Explosives?

[tusenord]

I'm thinking my bad guys is going to (try to) place an explosive at the safehouse. I've actually not decided yet if they want to kill the good guys (attack the house) or scare them (attack the barn/Quonset). Either way, I've somehow pictured the explosive as being in a sort of box, placed in a backpack, but not sure if that makes sense, or what a homemade explosives would look like. So, I'd love ideas and thoughts and things to take into consideration - or tips of links for good information. It can be anything from what a pair of reckless young men would do on their own to somewhat advanced. The bad guys got money, but might act a bit rash because of internal conflict. It's set in the US present time if that makes a difference..

 

[BustedPrinter]

A well know mantra in writing is to "always write boldly". You can decide for yourself of course, but generally being bold is better for the reader as they can tell when something is watered down. In this case, scaring them by attacking the barn or Quonset building instead of going for the good guys directly. Myself, I even try and take things a little further than what the reader might expect, so not only would I have the bad guys attack the good guys, one good guy would end up dead.

As for bombs. I realize there is plenty of information on the internet about them, but my book is NOT going to be an additional place. I write about compelling and potential realistic bombs; HOWEVER, I leave out one key element so that if someone was ever to try and mimic anything I have written in a book, it would be a dud and disappoint them. That is just my moral ethics at play as an author though.

 

[tusenord]

A well know mantra in writing is to "always write boldly". You can decide for yourself of course, but generally being bold is better for the reader as they can tell when something is watered down. In this case, scaring them by attacking the barn or Quonset building instead of going for the good guys directly. Myself, I even try and take things a little further than what the reader might expect, so not only would I have the bad guys attack the good guys, one good guy would end up dead.

Alright, that is good advice - going for lethal intent! It's not going to blow up, but there will be injuries from the fight when they're noticed.

As for bombs. I realize there is plenty of information on the internet about them, but my book is NOT going to be an additional place. I write about compelling and potential realistic bombs; HOWEVER, I leave out one key element so that if someone was ever to try and mimic anything I have written in a book, it would be a dud and disappoint them. That is just my moral ethics at play as an author though.

Oh, definitely didn't plan on that detailed! But MC2 has worked black ops (though keeps vehemently denying it throughout) so would be nice to have him be able to notice a few details that makes the reader (and the rest of the team) thinks he knows his stuff.

 

[CMBright]

Something suspicious. Do the good guys know every box, crate, barrel, backpack, etc. on the property? "We have five packs, why are there six?" could be enough to realize something might be wrong. Would the bad guys attack while the good guys were moving the sixth pack to dump in the woods?

The bomb can be as simple or as complicated as you want. Basically, something explosive and something to time or trigger the explosion with thing-a-ma-bobs to connect the two.

Since you have werewolves and such in this world, in theory you could have a spell to go boom and a spell to trigger the going boom at a given time or when an antagonist sets off a trigger spell, with someone magical to unravel one or both spells to the bomb doesn't go boom. Or a member with ordinary military/paramilitary bomb disposal techniques.

If the antagonists just want to scare the protagonists into running to make them easier to pick off, I'd suggest several smaller bombs along the outside of the house, ones that would do less damage if they do go boom. Or a larger one in the barn. Either way, it makes the protagonists feel their safe house is no longer safe.

 

[Al X.]

If you are in to bomb territory, you are in to lethal territory. Non-lethal 'bombs' such as flash-bangs are carefully engineered to be temporarily incapacitating but not deadly, and an amateur attempt at such can range from ineffective to too effective.

I've had a lot of training in explosives, including IED's. What would I do? The classic pipe bomb, made from short sections of small diameter steel pipe with threaded end caps. The explosive? Gunpowder if it's available, otherwise, the solid propellant from fireworks and model rocket engines, ground in to a powder is highly effective. Homemade dynamite (nitroglycerine) and fertilizer based explosives are an option but it requires a degree of chemical knowledge plus they are dangerous to fabricate.

The fuse? Incendiary time fuse is hard to come by, but if you're using fireworks as your base stock, those fuses work nicely, otherwise I would opt for an electrical option. Those little igniters that come with packs of model rocket engines are perfect, but fine wire inserts would work with some testing - even lightbulb filaments.

 

[BustedPrinter]

Oh, definitely didn't plan on that detailed! But MC2 has worked black ops (though keeps vehemently denying it throughout) so would be nice to have him be able to notice a few details that makes the reader (and the rest of the team) thinks he knows his stuff.

My wife is an avid reader and told me she loves to learn things as she reads, even though most of her reading is fiction. As a writer I try and do that... but ethically.

Recently I wrote a Femme Fetale where the vile lady kills via cyanide. Being a former sheep farmer, that is a concoction I can and have cooked up myself. So, I had the main character in my novel make it, letting readers learn how crazy easy it is to cook up. It really was a prominent part of the novel as she always had some cyanide on her. But... I left out one critical item so if a reader did try and cook some, it would be harmless.

I think that is the right approach. I want my readers to learn, and my novels to have a sense of realism, but ethically I am okay with a situation be just plausible. I am not a narcist, and do not need people to know everything that I do, especially if that might get them hurt. It is a very fine line I realize, but as writers we have to recognize that there is power in the pen, and while we have the right to write whatever we want, its up to us to morally not fully divulge information either if someone can get hurt from it.

 

[BustedPrinter]

A little off topic but also not.

I do the same thing with my writing in terms of abuse.

Abuse of all kinds is rampant in our modern society, but I am not a writer who is going to fill my pages with its descriptive words. I want my novels to make readers feel, and through the plotline they will feel negative emotions as well, but I am NOT going to make any reader that happened to have an abusive childhood or relationship be drawn back into those emotional scars. I will elude to what happened in a character's past, sure... but I would never, never, never describe it with such realism that an abused person would relive the event as they read my novel.

I want my novels to inspire, give hope, and encourage.

 

[tusenord]

If you are in to bomb territory, you are in to lethal territory. Non-lethal 'bombs' such as flash-bangs are carefully engineered to be temporarily incapacitating but not deadly, and an amateur attempt at such can range from ineffective to too effective.

I've had a lot of training in explosives, including IED's. What would I do? The classic pipe bomb, made from short sections of small diameter steel pipe with threaded end caps. The explosive? Gunpowder if it's available, otherwise, the solid propellant from fireworks and model rocket engines, ground in to a powder is highly effective. Homemade dynamite (nitroglycerine) and fertilizer based explosives are an option but it requires a degree of chemical knowledge plus they are dangerous to fabricate.

The fuse? Incendiary time fuse is hard to come by, but if you're using fireworks as your base stock, those fuses work nicely, otherwise I would opt for an electrical option. Those little igniters that come with packs of model rocket engines are perfect, but fine wire inserts would work with some testing - even lightbulb filaments.

Awesome, great ideas! Going for lethal seems to make most sense.

If you wanted to take out a barn/house, would there be several pipe bombs strapped together or such? Would that be heavy? (I've got an idea of the of the team seeing an impression from something heavy in the mud on a track to the house)

 

[tusenord]

A little off topic but also not.

I do the same thing with my writing in terms of abuse.

Abuse of all kinds is rampant in our modern society, but I am not a writer who is going to fill my pages with its descriptive words. I want my novels to make readers feel, and through the plotline they will feel negative emotions as well, but I am NOT going to make any reader that happened to have an abusive childhood or relationship be drawn back into those emotional scars. I will elude to what happened in a character's past, sure... but I would never, never, never describe it with such realism that an abused person would relive the event as they read my novel.

I want my novels to inspire, give hope, and encourage.

I'm not one for too much unpleasant details either!

 

[CMBright]

If the ground is covered in (enough) mud or snow, you're going to find tracks even if a mouse or songbird bird. If the ground is dry enough or the area is covered in gravel, you might not see pickup tracks driving across it. The surface and what it is covered in is going to be as important in picking up tracks of the bomb setters as any additional weight they will be carrying.

 

[frimble3]

My wife is an avid reader and told me she loves to learn things as she reads, even though most of her reading is fiction. As a writer I try and do that... but ethically.

Recently I wrote a Femme Fatale where the vile lady kills via cyanide. Being a former sheep farmer, that is a concoction I can and have cooked up myself. So, I had the main character in my novel make it, letting readers learn how crazy easy it is to cook up. It really was a prominent part of the novel as she always had some cyanide on her. But... I left out one critical item so if a reader did try and cook some, it would be harmless.

I think that is the right approach. I want my readers to learn, and my novels to have a sense of realism, but ethically I am okay with a situation be just plausible. I am not a narcist, and do not need people to know everything that I do, especially if that might get them hurt. It is a very fine line I realize, but as writers we have to recognize that there is power in the pen, and while we have the right to write whatever we want, its up to us to morally not fully divulge information either if someone can get hurt from it.

Especially if the writer might end up in court, explaining that, no, they weren't intending to write a disguised version of the Anarchist's Cookbook, and no, it wasn't their fault that some swine killed someone else using their description.
I think you approach of leaving one critical component out makes perfect sense. And, probably those readers who know about these things and recognize what's missing will agree with your decision/choices, for sensible ethical reasons.

 

[Al X.]

Awesome, great ideas! Going for lethal seems to make most sense.

If you wanted to take out a barn/house, would there be several pipe bombs strapped together or such? Would that be heavy? (I've got an idea of the of the team seeing an impression from something heavy in the mud on a track to the house)

The problem of strapping several pipe bombs or other homemade bombs together is getting them to detonate simultaneously. In military (and commercial) blasting applications, multiple charges can be made to detonate simultaneously using electric caps, and/or det cord chains. The difference between military grade explosives such as PETN and RDX and homemade bombs is that they actually detonate, whereas a homemade bomb is usually made with a material like gunpowder that doesn't actually detonate, but becomes explosive when contained, which is the whole reason for using capped metal pipes or the like. Since they don't actually detonate on ignition, getting them to fire off simultaneously would be nearly impossible. And if they don't, the first one to fire destroys the rest before they can do much damage.

Cut and threaded schedule 40 steel pipe sections are available in different diameters and lengths. Say, a 3 inch diameter x 8 inch long pipe filled with gunpowder is going to weigh about ten pounds. While it may not necessarily completely obliterate a house, anything inside it is going to be killed or destroyed. A typical IRA era car bomb would be in that general size range.

An ammonium nitrate bomb is another solution. ANFO does detonate, but as such it also requires a blasting detonator. Homemade IED's using ANFO were widely used in Afghanistan, but the bad guys also generally had access to blasting caps and bomb detonators. Five gallon tubs of the stuff could blow the bejesus out of trucks and light armored vehicles, so that could pretty much obliterate a house as well. A van full of it destroyed a multi story government building in Oklahoma City. You could probably improvise a detonator using a loaded firearm cartridge rigged with some striker device to fire it, or with a time fuse stuck in a small hole drilled in the casing, but the reliability would be iffy.

 

[tusenord]

Cut and threaded schedule 40 steel pipe sections are available in different diameters and lengths. Say, a 3 inch diameter x 8 inch long pipe filled with gunpowder is going to weigh about ten pounds. While it may not necessarily completely obliterate a house, anything inside it is going to be killed or destroyed. A typical IRA era car bomb would be in that general size range.

Excellent advice again, thanks! It sounds most suitable with a pipe bomb, and I can tweak the stuff I did write and remove the "mark in the mud" etc. They aren't sensitive to being carried, dropped etc, are they?

 

[Al X.]

Excellent advice again, thanks! It sounds most suitable with a pipe bomb, and I can tweak the stuff I did write and remove the "mark in the mud" etc. They aren't sensitive to being carried, dropped etc, are they?

The bomb itself no, but depending on the type of fuse you use, it could. For example an electric fuse on a timer could potentially have a premature contact closure if dropped. And more than one bomber has met his own demise confusing a normally open contact with a normally closed contact on a timing device.

 

[tusenord]

The bomb itself no, but depending on the type of fuse you use, it could. For example an electric fuse on a timer could potentially have a premature contact closure if dropped. And more than one bomber has met his own demise confusing a normally open contact with a normally closed contact on a timing device.

If the good guys want to diffuse it, would it be to just yank the ignition, if I do the idea from you, of igniters from model rocket engines?

 

[Al X.]

If the good guys want to diffuse it, would it be to just yank the ignition, if I do the idea from you, of igniters from model rocket engines?

Yep. Or at least disconnect it from the power source. When the bomb was fabricated, a small hole would have been drilled in an end cap, no larger than needed for a couple of insulated leads to pass through. Depending on how it was made, you may or may not be able to pull the igniter out through the hole. A thorough bomb maker would likely pot the leads in epoxy. Either way could work for your story.

 

[tusenord]

Yep. Or at least disconnect it from the power source. When the bomb was fabricated, a small hole would have been drilled in an end cap, no larger than needed for a couple of insulated leads to pass through. Depending on how it was made, you may or may not be able to pull the igniter out through the hole. A thorough bomb maker would likely pot the leads in epoxy. Either way could work for your story.

Great! I'm planning on not blowing up my good guys just yet. I'll save that for the feral dragon later on.

 

[ironmikezero]

Use a drone to deliver a flash-bang and an incendiary smoker in the same compact package, rigged for impact detonation. The blast/fire/smoke should sufficiently provoke immediate evacuation; the overall odds of hurting the characters are small (but not non-existent).

 

[tusenord]

Use a drone to deliver a flash-bang and an incendiary smoker in the same compact package, rigged for impact detonation. The blast/fire/smoke should sufficiently provoke immediate evacuation; the overall odds of hurting the characters are small (but not non-existent).

Ooh cool idea! Unfortunately I need the protags and antags to get into a bit of close contact to drop clues, but I'm saving that idea for a better spot...

 

[BustedPrinter]

If the good guys want to diffuse it, would it be to just yank the ignition, if I do the idea from you, of igniters from model rocket engines?

It depends.

Where I work, where the lack of electricity can kill people, we have back-up, to back-up, to back-up systems. Its nearly impossible to isolate the plant from electricity, or going dark as we call it. It's back-lit using generators, then banks of batteries just to ensure we can always produce power.

As a writer this can work to your advantage or against you.

Recently I wrote a novel that was about bombings, and on one of them I used that exact situation to make it nearly undefeatable. (Back-up, to back-up to a back-up system). In that situation I had the bomb blow up.

Or it could add tension... just when the guy thinks he is going to defeat the bomb, it starts counting down again because the emergency buss contactor drew in and was energized.

Or... go the other way, make is VERY easy to defeat, yet the bomb expert is expecting such a hard bomb to defeat; they miss the blazingly obvious.

 

[BustedPrinter]

And more than one bomber has met his own demise confusing a normally open contact with a normally closed contact on a timing device.

The problem is: not nearly enough of them have!!

 

[Al X.]

Use a drone to deliver a flash-bang and an incendiary smoker in the same compact package, rigged for impact detonation. The blast/fire/smoke should sufficiently provoke immediate evacuation; the overall odds of hurting the characters are small (but not non-existent).

Or use it to deliver a lethal device. Drones are being extensively used in Ukraine on both sides, to the extent that is is changing tactics - the targets being tanks, and troop placements. In fact, Russia is building their own now simply because they can't order enough cheap Chinese hobby drones from Amazon.

It depends.

Where I work, where the lack of electricity can kill people, we have back-up, to back-up, to back-up systems. Its nearly impossible to isolate the plant from electricity, or going dark as we call it. It's back-lit using generators, then banks of batteries just to ensure we can always produce power.

As a writer this can work to your advantage or against you.

Recently I wrote a novel that was about bombings, and on one of them I used that exact situation to make it nearly undefeatable. (Back-up, to back-up to a back-up system). In that situation I had the bomb blow up.

Or it could add tension... just when the guy thinks he is going to defeat the bomb, it starts counting down again because the emergency buss contactor drew in and was energized.

Or... go the other way, make is VERY easy to defeat, yet the bomb expert is expecting such a hard bomb to defeat; they miss the blazingly obvious.

I've made the assumption that the bomb would be simple, fabricated with off the shelf or otherwise easily obtained materials, and would have a very simplistic fusing system without failsafe anti-tamper provisions. Certainly these things can get quite complex with all kinds of James Bond style safeguards like movement sensors, trip altimeters, yada yada. The sky is the limit. In the novel where I broached the issue of a trip altimeter on a stolen nuke atop a Miami high rise, I had my MC commandeer a helicopter, load it aboard, fly a course towards the open ocean, set the autopilot and bail out with a parachute. It's kind of outlandish I know, but hey, people liked it.

 

[BustedPrinter]

That is the thing about electricity though; once you understand a few basics, almost anything is possible. The plant I work at, it has a lot of PLC's and can operate without human intervention. Not indefinitely, but for long stretches of time for sure. Yet PLC's are everywhere, so give a character access to an electrical room and they can reroute PLC's to do almost anything.

 

[tusenord]

The sky is the limit. In the novel where I broached the issue of a trip altimeter on a stolen nuke atop a Miami high rise, I had my MC commandeer a helicopter, load it aboard, fly a course towards the open ocean, set the autopilot and bail out with a parachute. It's kind of outlandish I know, but hey, people liked it.

Ha! I'd liked it too

 

[Kylee A.]

It depends on the context of your story, but I know the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives list information about a lot of subjects (firearms, explosives, arsons, etc.). From what I can see the website doesn't go to in depth, but covers a broad range of topics like rules and regulations and news reports.

It may be less helpful for figuring out the mechanisms of how the bomb will work in your story, but it should provide some basic information on how other people in your story (like the police) may deal with those people. The news reports may also give you some inspiration.

Depending on the location of where the bomb is being set off in the story it may also be helpful to look at how that state and area deal with explosives.

Going on YouTube and finding how bombs explode could also help you get an idea of the damages inflicted and the descriptions you need to use. Just going on YouTube I found a channel called Ordnance Lab that has a bunch of videos on bombs and explosives. I don't know if it's a source of reliable information but you may want to check it out.

I don't know if this is an option for you but talking to someone in the military or who has been in the military may also be a good source for knowing how explosives work in real life situations. I know my brother worked in the chemicals unit in the military and has a bunch of stories.