Need encouragement

La Reine · Jul 1, 2005

Hi,

I'm new on this board. I'm struggling a bit with motivation issues regarding completing my first novel. I have about 40,000 words written but I keep thinking a lot about whether or not it's a good story and when I will eventually finish.

How do you know when it's time to go on to the second draft? I have the beginning and the end already, but the middle part gets filled out constantly since it's in diary format.

Also, I'm worried about the potential readership. It's not a children's story but I don't know if adults would want to read it since it's the diary of an 8-year-old girl written in "Nigerian English."

I'm just worried about too many things right now...no title, what readership...how do I just focus and get it done? I currently have a one page a day policy but it's hard writing that even 'cos I've started running out of ideas...

Thanks to anyone who responds...

James D. Macdonald · Jul 1, 2005

You're in the dread mid-book. That's when everything seems horrible and it looks like you'll never get done, the prose is terrible, the plot doesn't make sense, the characters are dull, and you wonder why you ever started.

This is normal.

Get a copy of The Unstrung Harp; or, Mr. Earbrass Writes A Novel.

La Reine · Jul 1, 2005

James D. Macdonald said:
You're in the dread mid-book. That's when everything seems horrible and it looks like you'll never get done, the prose is terrible, the plot doesn't make sense, the characters are dull, and you wonder why you ever started.

This is normal.

Get a copy of The Unstrung Harp; or, Mr. Earbrass Writes A Novel.

It's good to know that it's normal. I don't know if I can read the book. I'm working almost full-time and studying almost full-time. But if it gets worse I'll surely pick it up.

Has anybody gone through this before? How do you get yourself out?

James D. Macdonald · Jul 1, 2005

La Reine said:
Has anybody gone through this before?

Everyone has gone through this before.

How do you get yourself out?

BIC

La Reine · Jul 1, 2005

James D. Macdonald said:
Everyone has gone through this before.

BIC

What does BIC mean?

Jamesaritchie · Jul 1, 2005

Normal

La Reine said:
It's good to know that it's normal. I don't know if I can read the book. I'm working almost full-time and studying almost full-time. But if it gets worse I'll surely pick it up.

Has anybody gone through this before? How do you get yourself out?

I think you have to keep writing until you get out through the other end of the tunnel. Once the first draft is fis=nished, and you set it aside for a few weeks, you may be amazed how much better it suddenly reads, and how large an audience there will be for it.

Middlebook is an evil land filled with demons we all fear.

BIC means "Butt in Chair." It's the only sure way to get through anything.

Mistook · Jul 1, 2005

Jamesaritchie said:
Middlebook is an evil land filled with demons we all fear.

Yep! That's about where I'm at right now - that part of the map that says, "Here be dragons."

icerose · Jul 1, 2005

Hi La Reine,

The things you are worrying about now, are things you shouldn't worry about until it is done. Just focus on the story, push everything else aside and full speed ahead. The editing time is where you deal with those issues

So just ignore the voice that is making you worry and plow on.

Sara

BenMears · Jul 1, 2005

The glorious newness of the adventure lasts about a day with me, so I'm in mid-book as a natural condition.

If you are interested in how I am working my way through it day by day, see the thread I have going on writing my novel. It can be done. It ain't easy.

Above all remember, every wonderful thing you felt about this story when you first started writing it is all true. It has value and is worth finishing. Now with that out of the way, just keep showing up and keep moving forward.

Best wishes.

hpoppink · Jul 1, 2005

I can't offer you expert advice, but I can share my method (unproven though it may be).

It sounds as though you're wondering whether you can stop now, put your draft in that drawer, and come back to start fresh. Or whether you have to keep working on this for several thousand more words, then put it in that drawer.

You have a beginning and an end, plus a convoluted middle. Is that enough? It depends, I guess, on whether your beginning, middle, and end feel fully written. I'm not talking quality, but I do think you need to get all your main events on paper. If they are there, I would personally consider that a complete first draft.

From your post, I'm going to assume your middle is lacking some events to tie the beginning to the end. If that were my WIP, I'd say I was not done. I think it's important to write down all the "dots" in the first draft, so that I can connect them in the second draft.

Kiva Wolfe · Jul 1, 2005

I worked from a 100-page plot and character outline--obviously more than I needed to draft my first book, but it did serve as my guidepost. I had the ending all figured out and avoided writing ahead. I broke my consecutive chapter rule only once when it was the only way I could get through a low period in the writing. As I approached the finish, I had a marathon writing session where I wrote the last three chapters in two days. It was exhilarating, but the ending I originally planned, well, it changed suddenly, and in a way breathed new life into a project that was originally supposed to be just one book. Now it is a four-book series and I'm still using my outline.

While I felt I knew my audience from Day One, I didn’t worry about the market and how I was going to present my work to an agent or publisher, until I completed it and had the opportunity to fine-tune it.

I feel for you. Worry, angst, panic, lack of confidence are awful to experience. Some of us have been there and can attest to how it literally shuts the creativity off. Stay busy; believe in your ability, keep thinking about moving the story along and it'll all come about.

It's okay to have doubts. Just don't let them lead you away from what you're trying to accomplish.

aruna · Jul 1, 2005

I'm a little bit concerned about the "Nigerian English" bit. Generally, we should avoid writing in dialect, as readers don't like it and as a result neither do editors and agents. Could you give us an example as to just how "Nigerian" the English is?

Recently, a British author wrote a novel about an 8 year old Nigerian girl (one who lved in England, however) and it received a huge amount of hype - the rumour went around that it got a £400000 advance (which turned out to be hugely exagerrated, apparently) and got tons of good reviews. A lot of the hype was because the author was only 18,and studying for her high school finals as she wrote it! That book is "The Icarus Girl" by Helen Oyeyemi. You should read it to see how she treats the subject, and the language. It was written in correct English, even though about half of it is set in Nigeria.

That is also an adult book, so that is not the problem you should worry about. Just make sure that yours has an adult theme, and enough adult characters to hold a reader's interest.

The dialect should not be so strong as to make it impossible to read, unless your target readership is Nigerian - and even then, readers prefer to read in correct English, and assume the dialect by tiny clues. For instance, in my own novel several of the people speak in Creolese dialect, but I don't write it exactly as they would speak it - I just put a few word's, such as "in't" for isn't and "gon'" for going to. This lets the reader know that they are speaking dialect but doesn't distract them too much.

Have you read the book Brick Lane? if you read the amazon reviews for that book almost every second reviewer - even those who liked the book - complain about the bad English in the thread of letters that runds through the book - letters written by the protagonist's sister in Bangladesh. And it is truly horrible, and takes you out of the story trying to figure out what is being said. I think the effect could have been achieved far more subtly.

La Reine · Jul 2, 2005

hpoppink said:
I can't offer you expert advice, but I can share my method (unproven though it may be).

It sounds as though you're wondering whether you can stop now, put your draft in that drawer, and come back to start fresh. Or whether you have to keep working on this for several thousand more words, then put it in that drawer.

You have a beginning and an end, plus a convoluted middle. Is that enough? It depends, I guess, on whether your beginning, middle, and end feel fully written. I'm not talking quality, but I do think you need to get all your main events on paper. If they are there, I would personally consider that a complete first draft.

From your post, I'm going to assume your middle is lacking some events to tie the beginning to the end. If that were my WIP, I'd say I was not done. I think it's important to write down all the "dots" in the first draft, so that I can connect them in the second draft.

That's a little bit of my dilemma now. I have a complete story, but the middle is not as filled out as it should be and the plot needs to be ironed out some more. I'm just thinking too much about things I cannot control, like whether it will get published and who will want to read it...

La Reine · Jul 2, 2005

Kiva Wolfe said:
I worked from a 100-page plot and character outline--obviously more than I needed to draft my first book, but it did serve as my guidepost. I had the ending all figured out and avoided writing ahead. I broke my consecutive chapter rule only once when it was the only way I could get through a low period in the writing. As I approached the finish, I had a marathon writing session where I wrote the last three chapters in two days. It was exhilarating, but the ending I originally planned, well, it changed suddenly, and in a way breathed new life into a project that was originally supposed to be just one book. Now it is a four-book series and I'm still using my outline.

While I felt I knew my audience from Day One, I didn’t worry about the market and how I was going to present my work to an agent or publisher, until I completed it and had the opportunity to fine-tune it.

I feel for you. Worry, angst, panic, lack of confidence are awful to experience. Some of us have been there and can attest to how it literally shuts the creativity off. Stay busy; believe in your ability, keep thinking about moving the story along and it'll all come about.

It's okay to have doubts. Just don't let them lead you away from what you're trying to accomplish.

Thank you. These are the kinds of words I need.

La Reine · Jul 2, 2005

aruna said:
I'm a little bit concerned about the "Nigerian English" bit. Generally, we should avoid writing in dialect, as readers don't like it and as a result neither do editors and agents. Could you give us an example as to just how "Nigerian" the English is?

Recently, a British author wrote a novel about an 8 year old Nigerian girl (one who lved in England, however) and it received a huge amount of hype - the rumour went around that it got a £400000 advance (which turned out to be hugely exagerrated, apparently) and got tons of good reviews. A lot of the hype was because the author was only 18,and studying for her high school finals as she wrote it! That book is "The Icarus Girl" by Helen Oyeyemi. You should read it to see how she treats the subject, and the language. It was written in correct English, even though about half of it is set in Nigeria.

That is also an adult book, so that is not the problem you should worry about. Just make sure that yours has an adult theme, and enough adult characters to hold a reader's interest.

The dialect should not be so strong as to make it impossible to read, unless your target readership is Nigerian - and even then, readers prefer to read in correct English, and assume the dialect by tiny clues. For instance, in my own novel several of the people speak in Creolese dialect, but I don't write it exactly as they would speak it - I just put a few word's, such as "in't" for isn't and "gon'" for going to. This lets the reader know that they are speaking dialect but doesn't distract them too much.

Have you read the book Brick Lane? if you read the amazon reviews for that book almost every second reviewer - even those who liked the book - complain about the bad English in the thread of letters that runds through the book - letters written by the protagonist's sister in Bangladesh. And it is truly horrible, and takes you out of the story trying to figure out what is being said. I think the effect could have been achieved far more subtly.

Hi Aruna, thanks for your wonderful post. I see what you're saying about dialect, and I completely agree. Only a hint is really necessary, so my character says 'is' for 'it's' and 'am' for 'I am' that's the only evidence. Another thing is her English is almost a direct translation of Nigerian languages, so she uses words like 'nightfood' instead of 'dinner.'

I have heard about Helen Oyeyemi but I'm yet to read her book with the exception of an excerpt. The only main child character in mine is the narrator and she deals with a mix of adult and children issues (I think mostly adult in a child's way).

I will go on writing it and try to finish. Thanks for the encouraging words.

aruna · Jul 4, 2005

La Reine said:
Hi Aruna, thanks for your wonderful post. I see what you're saying about dialect, and I completely agree. Only a hint is really necessary, so my character says 'is' for 'it's' and 'am' for 'I am' that's the only evidence. Another thing is her English is almost a direct translation of Nigerian languages, so she uses words like 'nightfood' instead of 'dinner.'

That sounds good - I love the wrod "nightfood" - anyone can guess what it means. Good luck, and let us know how you get on!

Nateskate · Jul 6, 2005

James D. Macdonald said:
You're in the dread mid-book. That's when everything seems horrible and it looks like you'll never get done, the prose is terrible, the plot doesn't make sense, the characters are dull, and you wonder why you ever started.

This is normal.

Get a copy of The Unstrung Harp; or, Mr. Earbrass Writes A Novel.

Great encouragement Jim. There are days, even positive ones, where I feel like, "What in the world did I just get myself into? Now I've got to finish this!"

I should just say-What Jim said.

La Reine · Jul 7, 2005

Nateskate said:
Great encouragement Jim. There are days, even positive ones, where I feel like, "What in the world did I just get myself into? Now I've got to finish this!"

I should just say-What Jim said.

I know! The story that once excited me now seems dull. I guess I'll just finish it and go through the motions of sending the query letter and all...you never know.

Thanks.

GPatten · Jul 7, 2005

La Reine said:
I know! The story that once excited me now seems dull. I guess I'll just finish it and go through the motions of sending the query letter and all...you never know.

Thanks.

There will be stages where it will seem your work is dull, and some time later when you continue on, it will be exciting.

Not to worry.

JerseyGirl1962 · Jul 7, 2005

La Reine,

Don't give up...as you can see in prior posts, all writers go through stuff like this.

Maybe you should read a book, and once you're done with your book, go back and look things over. I have to admit I was stuck in the middle of my WIP, saying my usual, "This is no good" stuff (on the flip side, I'm enough of a meglomaniac regarding various portions of the WIP, heh heh).

I got thru it because I saw something on a website (escapes me now, unfortunately) that got the words flowing again; it also helped that No. 1 Boss was on vacation for 3 weeks, so I wasn't constantly interrupted (how dare he interrupt my story for work

).

Just recently, I've had to redo the last 1/3 or so of the WIP, and it was driving me crazy, no ideas. I started to read a book, and for some reason, the words started to flow again. Must've jiggled something in my thick head.

My one piece of advice: Put a title on your work. It doesn't matter if it doesn't quite fit. Some how-to book or another I've read over the years suggested that, and it's helped me keep focus on the matter at hand. (Never mind that I've changed the title about 5 or 6 times, and the latest title, which I like the most, comes from the name of a song.)

Stick with it, as I think this is your first draft, correct? Get it out all at once - you can pick it apart later.

Good writing! :Thumbs:

~Nancy

Nateskate · Jul 7, 2005

La Reine said:
I know! The story that once excited me now seems dull. I guess I'll just finish it and go through the motions of sending the query letter and all...you never know.

Thanks.

I feel your pain. I'm not sure my story was dull, but after reading so much about pacing and keeping dramatic tension, I wound up adding more scenes to spice it up. I wound up doing things I never imagined I would or could do, including the old (rapids/upcoming waterfall) scene. In this day and age, at least we can punch a scene with a word processor. In the old days I'd have just found a burn barrel and tossed the story.

Carrie · Jul 7, 2005

I Can Attest to Her Marathon

Kiva Wolfe said:
I worked from a 100-page plot and character outline--obviously more than I needed to draft my first book, but it did serve as my guidepost. I had the ending all figured out and avoided writing ahead. I broke my consecutive chapter rule only once when it was the only way I could get through a low period in the writing. As I approached the finish, I had a marathon writing session where I wrote the last three chapters in two days. It was exhilarating, but the ending I originally planned, well, it changed suddenly, and in a way breathed new life into a project that was originally supposed to be just one book. Now it is a four-book series and I'm still using my outline.

While I felt I knew my audience from Day One, I didn’t worry about the market and how I was going to present my work to an agent or publisher, until I completed it and had the opportunity to fine-tune it.

I feel for you. Worry, angst, panic, lack of confidence are awful to experience. Some of us have been there and can attest to how it literally shuts the creativity off. Stay busy; believe in your ability, keep thinking about moving the story along and it'll all come about.

It's okay to have doubts. Just don't let them lead you away from what you're trying to accomplish.

Listen to Kiva and believe in yourself and your story.

Ronda · Jul 8, 2005

Take a breath! You can finish. Just keep writing and don't invent problems for yourself. Let your characters and story "take over" and drive you.

OK let me first say I know full well that I'm weird. I recently finished my first novel.

I didn't write a first draft, then a second. I kept spiraling through my ms. More rewrites on the first part and less on the last parts - just the way it worked out, not done intentionally.

What was it that compelled you to write your story? Get your head full of that when you sit down to write and when you're on the potty, and when you're traveling to and from work, and whenever your mind isn't otherwise engaged. That helps your writing be part-way done by the time you sit down, and it keeps the passion alive.

Warmly,
Ronda

La Reine · Jul 9, 2005

Ronda said:
Take a breath! You can finish. Just keep writing and don't invent problems for yourself. Let your characters and story "take over" and drive you.

OK let me first say I know full well that I'm weird. I recently finished my first novel.

I didn't write a first draft, then a second. I kept spiraling through my ms. More rewrites on the first part and less on the last parts - just the way it worked out, not done intentionally.

What was it that compelled you to write your story? Get your head full of that when you sit down to write and when you're on the potty, and when you're traveling to and from work, and whenever your mind isn't otherwise engaged. That helps your writing be part-way done by the time you sit down, and it keeps the passion alive.

Warmly,
Ronda

Thanks Ronda. I think one of my problems it that I wanted the story to be longer, but there's not much more to add to the story except little bits here and there, so right now I'm thinking of making the story tighter and more believable.

Ronda · Jul 9, 2005

La Reine, the work could yet surprise you. You never know.

Warmly,
Ronda

Need encouragement

La Reine

James D. Macdonald

Your Genial Uncle

La Reine

James D. Macdonald

Your Genial Uncle

La Reine

Jamesaritchie

Mistook

Neverending WIP

icerose

Lost in School Work

BenMears

hpoppink

Kiva Wolfe

aruna

On a wing and a prayer

La Reine

La Reine

La Reine

aruna

On a wing and a prayer

Nateskate

La Reine

GPatten

Dang...

JerseyGirl1962

I heart Malamutes! :-)

Nateskate

Carrie

Ronda

La Reine

Ronda