How Many Commas?

Ciera_ · Dec 26, 2008

I was wondering what concentration of commas is average for novels in general.
Especially because I've come to realize that I think I use them far too often.
I divided my word count (90,000) by the number of commas I have (7050), and I have a comma about every 13 words, on average.
Now, that seems like a lot, doesn't it?
So I'm wondering whether other people have similarly, surprisingly high comma-concentrations.
Thanks for your input!

Cassiopeia · Dec 26, 2008

KILL THE COMMAS...Kill them I tell you...kill them all!

*composes herself*

Sorry, speaking as one who has had to endure critiquing work with way too many of them, they annoy the daylights out of me, if you know, what , I mean that we, as a general, rule think we must put them, like EVERY WHERE!

KILL THEM I SAY!

C.bronco · Dec 26, 2008

I don't count commas. If I did, someone might ask me to pay for their use.

smoothseas · Dec 26, 2008

I admit...

I. Too. Am. A. Serial. Comma. User.

Can't help it. Depending on where you place them, they can totally alter the meaning of a sentence.

*chanting* I will watch my comma usage

C.bronco · Dec 26, 2008

I put the commas where Strunk and White make me. It is all their fault.

Ciera_ · Dec 26, 2008

C.bronco said:
I don't count commas. If I did, someone might ask me to pay for their use.

Lol. If I didn't have Word 2007 (with which I can just go find-->','--> highlight all) I definitely wouldn't be counting commas. But even then, it would be apparent that I have a few too many.

I checked, and so far in the rewrite the concentration has gone down to one comma every 16 words! Woot! Next up, I need to work on getting rid of exclamation points!

Thanks for the feedback, guys.

Jerry B. Flory · Dec 26, 2008

It's hard to say. I use them or I don't use them. More according to how I'm pacing at the moment. Sometimes, they're structurally sound and sometimes I just want to keep writing.
I notice a lot of writers are impartial to their comma usage.
Best way: Write first, comma later.

blacbird · Dec 26, 2008

Ciera_ said:
I divided my word count (90,000) by the number of commas I have (7050), and I have a comma about every 13 words, on average.
Now, that seems like a lot, doesn't it?

No. What it seems like is a completely useless waste of your time. The use or abuse of commas can only be judged in the context of your actual writing. Nobody can answer your question via a mathematical formula.

caw

maestrowork · Dec 26, 2008

I don't stress about commas, as long as they're used properly.

kct webber · Dec 26, 2008

blacbird said:
No. What it seems like is a completely useless waste of your time. The use or abuse of commas can only be judged in the context of your actual writing. Nobody can answer your question via a mathematical formula.

caw

maestrowork said:
I don't stress about commas, as long as they're used properly.

Yes and yes. I think you may be stressing over them a bit too much. If you are using commas properly, the math doesn't really matter. It's all about context of your writing. It's like asking if using the letter 'T' every 13 words is bad. Who knows? What 13 words are we talking about? It's only bad if none of the thirteen words are spelled with a 'T'.

Stop counting commas. There are rules for commas. If you are obeying them, you're fine. Leave them alone.

Ken Schneider · Dec 27, 2008

How many times do you take a breath when you talk?

Say the line out loud, and when you have to take a breath, put in a comma. That ought to do it.

dpaterso · Dec 27, 2008

I follow the Hochtenstein Comma Methodology and insert one comma into every 3rd sentence whether it needs it or not. This has transformed my writing from dull and rhythmless twittering to dynamic flowing prose. It reads much, better.

-Derek

RobJ · Dec 27, 2008

I just checked your rewrite of Murder Pet, or part of it at least. I can see a few places where you could lose a comma, but it's not too bad. Your sentence structure tends towards requiring commas. Restructuring some of your sentences would reduce the comma count if you thought it was necessary. I don't think it's necessary from a numerical perspective, but the prose might benefit from a little more variation in sentence structure in parts.

Cheers,
Rob

Nakhlasmoke · Dec 27, 2008

Ken Schneider said:
How many times do you take a breath when you talk?

Say the line out loud, and when you have to take a breath, put in a comma. That ought to do it.

That's how I was taught. Sadly it doesn't work and I am constantly outed as a comma abuser.

Ken Schneider · Dec 27, 2008

Nakhlasmoke said:
That's how I was taught. Sadly it doesn't work and I am constantly outed as a comma abuser.

LOL.

Bufty · Dec 27, 2008

It's better looking at it from the viewpoint that if one runs out of breath while reading the sentence aloud one should consider whether the sentence is too long-winded. A full stop may be the better choice of punctuation.

In the quoted example below I would have used no punctuation at all because the meaning is clear without either comma - apart from the sentence being so short I doubt anyone would stop for breath while saying it aloud. :Hug2:

How many times do you take a breath when you talk?

Say the line out loud, and when you have to take a breath, put in a comma. That ought to do it.

maestrowork · Dec 27, 2008

Ken Schneider said:
How many times do you take a breath when you talk?

Say the line out loud, and when you have to take a breath, put in a comma. That ought to do it.

And what if someone has asthma?

regdog · Dec 27, 2008

All I can say, is see last line in sig line

James D. Macdonald · Dec 27, 2008

There's a minimum of four commas per page, but you aren't allowed to use more than 23 per page unless you have a Federal Class B Comma license.

Seriously, now, counting commas is probably writing-avoidance behavior. A more profitable way of avoiding writing would be by getting copies of Eats, Shoots, & Leaves and The Transitive Vampire, and reading them.

Yeshanu · Dec 27, 2008

I second the vote for Eats, Shoots, and Leaves. Hilarious and informative at the same time.

Just remember that the purpose of punctuation is to aid the reader in understanding the text. Where you do or don't put a comma can make one heck of a difference:

A woman without her man is nothing.

A woman: Without her, man is nothing.

The Lonely One · Dec 27, 2008

Ciera_ said:
I was wondering what concentration of commas is average for novels in general.
Especially because I've come to realize that I think I use them far too often.
I divided my word count (90,000) by the number of commas I have (7050), and I have a comma about every 13 words, on average.
Now, that seems like a lot, doesn't it?
So I'm wondering whether other people have similarly, surprisingly high comma-concentrations.
Thanks for your input!

I think the question isn't do you have too many commas, it's have you drafted for sentence rhythm. Probably after a while, a rhythm of speaking that is enjoyable comes naturally, but it should be something you're aware of during the edits. Commas are more important as a rhythm and pacing device than ultimately (though you should be aware of usage rules) as a grammar device. Too many could also mean sentences need recasting for length as others have said. Just ask my beta :/.

What, do, you, mean, dead?

Prawn · Dec 27, 2008

Commas are invisible if used well. If people notice them, you've messed it up.

Gynn · Dec 27, 2008

Having an extra comma is much less annoying than reading a fifty word sentence with no commas.

Don · Dec 27, 2008

Gynn said:
Having an extra comma is much less annoying than reading a fifty word sentence with no commas.

Breaking the sentence into two or three is even less annoying.

Ken Schneider · Dec 27, 2008

maestrowork said:
And what if someone has asthma?

Then you use a — whilst you use the inhaler.

I feel picked on, Bufty.

How Many Commas?

Ciera_

Otherwise Occupied

I have plans...

Life sucks... Then ya die...

I have plans...

Ciera_

under the Milky Way

Fear the Death Ray

Squirrel, Sekrit type, 1 ea.

Absolute sagebrush

Also in our Discord and IRC chat channels

yes

Absolute sagebrush

Where have the last ten years gone?

Fear the Death Ray

The Scavengers

Your Genial Uncle

Elf Queen

Why is a raven like a writing desk?

Writing is finite,revising infinite

Wandering worlds

All Living is Local

Absolute sagebrush