Can a dialogue tag "smile"?

DamaNegra · Apr 17, 2006

It won't bite if you do it, but its generally not recommended. Actually, many people have warned me against it. Of course, someone wiser than me may elaborate on that.

maestrowork · Apr 17, 2006

No.

I've yet to see someone smile or laugh out the line of dialogue. It takes some serious vocal talent.

This kind of dialogue tags is mostly likely frowned upon by agent and editors.

Try these instead:

"Mrs Forster is all politeness," she said and laughed.

"Mrs Forster is all politeness," she said with a smile.

Shadow_Ferret · Apr 17, 2006

Actually, if someone is laughing and trying to talk at the same time it generally comes out incoherent.

Go with what maestro said with a smile on his lips and laughter in his heart.

NeuroFizz · Apr 17, 2006

Or, you can go without a dialogue tag and just follow the line with an action:

"Mrs Forster is all politeness." She laughed.

Jamesaritchie · Apr 17, 2006

NeuroFizz said:
Or, you can go without a dialogue tag and just follow the line with an action:

"Mrs Forster is all politeness." She laughed.

Or better, I think, precede it with an action. Sara laughed. "Mrs. Forster is all politeness," she said.

Or: Sara laughed and said, "Mrs. Forster is all politeness."

After the dialogue, it still comes across as a tag. The difference between a comma and a period isn't enough.

maestrowork · Apr 17, 2006

"Blah blah." She laughed. (Making a joke)

is different than

She laughed. "Blah blah." (Commenting on something funny)

Jamesaritchie · Apr 17, 2006

maestrowork said:
"Blah blah." She laughed. (Making a joke)

is different than

She laughed. "Blah blah." (Commenting on something funny)

It is? Seems the same to me. Though if you want the "She laughed" after the dialogue, I think it needs the word "and" attached. Either way, "She laughed" doesn't really sound right at all to my ear. It needs more. It needs "and," or it needs a bit of explanation. Otherwise, it may as well be a dialogue tag.

NeuroFizz · Apr 17, 2006

Good points, James and Ray, although She laughed after the dialogue doesn't read poorly to me. I guess it depends on what surrounds it. Which to use (before or after) depends on the temporal sequence of events you want, and that can vary depending upon what immediately precedes the dialogue in question. Also, totally independent of this, when one wants to break up a long dialogue exchange, it may be best to put in a beat (action) before the line(s) of a speaker. On the other hand, when the desire is to break up a long bit of dialogue from a single person, it's best to place the beat somewhere within the dialogue trail (possibly inserting more than one beat). However, I suspect the first consideration should always be proper temporal sequencing.

pandora9 · Apr 17, 2006

I can't laugh and talk at the same time. And I look like a psychopath if I try and smile and talk at the same time. I just tried it in the mirror. I'd dropped the tag, or at least use 'and'. However tempting, it's best to avoid physical impossibilities in writing.

cwfgal · Apr 17, 2006

I agree there is a difference, albeit a subtle one, in having the laugh come before the dialogue as opposed to after it. However, I might be inclined to elaborate beyond the simple laugh to make the context clearer. Or to find a more descriptive verb than a simple "laugh." Then too, preceding text might make the context perfectly clear so that laugh works just fine.

For the line below I think the dialogue tag can be eliminated all together:
Sara laughed. "Mrs. Forster is all politeness," she said.

Beth

maestrowork · Apr 17, 2006

"Mrs Forster is all politeness." She laughed.

is a way to get away with having too many "he said, she said" tags. I try not to argue about the effectiveness here because I don't think it's the point of this thread -- we're not trying to rewrite this sentence, not without the context anyway. The point here is that "she laughed" is not a dialogue tag, but a perfectly fine (whether it's effective is another matter) action that goes with the dialogue, eliminating the "she said" tag:

"Mrs. Forster stopped by earlier," she said.
"Oh? And what did she say?" he said.
"Not much, she just came by and asked for some sugar."
"Sugar? And what else?"
"And to formally thank us for the painting we gave her."
"She came over just to thank us?"
"Mrs. Forster is all politeness." She laughed. "She would come by again just to thank us for the sugar."
He sat and lit his pipe. "I suppose you're right."
"I always am, dear."

writeorwrong · Apr 17, 2006

Maestrowork is right.

BTW, there is nothing wrong with saying, "said". In fact, lots of writers prefer it because it is less intrusive. You don't want your readers distracted from the story because they're wondering how someone smiles dialogue, or walks menacingly.

Rely on your language to convey emotions, rather than adverbs and dialogue tags. It's not easy (as I'm learning), but it makes the difference between polished and amateurish-sounding prose.

SC Harrison · Apr 17, 2006

maestrowork said:
"Mrs Forster is all politeness." She laughed.

is a way to get away with having too many "he said, she said" tags. I try not to argue about the effectiveness here because I don't think it's the point of this thread -- we're not trying to rewrite this sentence, not without the context anyway. The point here is that "she laughed" is not a dialogue tag, but a perfectly fine (whether it's effective is another matter) action that goes with the dialogue, eliminating the "she said" tag.

It's also a way (imo) to convey that the speaker is negating the statement with a humorous tone, as opposed to a sarcastic one. Even in a sentence this short, she laughed carries more meaning than merely the way the words came out of her mouth.

Could this be a form of showing and not telling? I think so, but what do I know?

maestrowork · Apr 17, 2006

SC, you got it.

AdamH · Apr 17, 2006

I'm an advocate of using "said". I didn't use to be. I used to "pretty-up" my tags in efforts of "omitting useless words" that a lot of books on writing talk about. It appears simpler to use:

"And that's how Tommy convinced his brother to eat crayons," Bill laughed.

Than it is to use:

"And that's how Tommy convinced his brother to eat crayons," Bill said and laughed.

It may have more words but it is more accurate. Also, as someone mentioned earlier, proper punctuation can save you. As in,

"And that's how Tommy convinced his brother to eat crayons." Bill laughed.

But as opposed to laughing, a person CAN smile while they're talking. It's these situations that I still have trouble with (I try "He smiled while saying" or some kind of variation but it's clunky to my ear). How do you guys handle situations like that?

Bufty · Apr 17, 2006

It's the eyes that twinkle while speaking as opposed to a proper smile - It's not possible to give a full blown smile and speak at the same time without looking a tad odd.
Although if I read that someone said something, 'smiling', I have no difficulty picturing it.

rich · Apr 17, 2006

..." she laughed. To me, seems better. After her words, I don't see how the reader would question when she laughed. 'She said and laughed,' hits me as awkward. I avoid descriptive tags like the plague, hoping that the dialogue would carry the moment.

reph · Apr 17, 2006

Maddwriter said:
"And that's how Tommy convinced his brother to eat crayons," Bill said and laughed.

It may have more words but it is more accurate.

Maybe so, but it isn't grammatical. What you've got there is a subject (Bill), two verbs (said, laughed), and an object (the quoted speech). What's wrong is clearer if you invert the sentence:

Bill said and laughed, "And that's how Tommy convinced [persuaded, actually, but let me not sidetrack] his brother to eat crayons."

So Bill says the speech and laughs it too. That isn't what you meant to say, but it's what the sentence says.

It also isn't okay to write "And that's how Tommy got his brother to eat crayons," Bill said and closed the photo album.

writeorwrong · Apr 17, 2006

Flailing her arm at the bartender, Jane nearly fell off the stool. "'Nother Long Island Ished Tea, over here."

Elsie laughed. "You're really going to regret this tomorrow."

Assuming this exchange is between two people and has been going on for several lines, there's no need to consider the awkwardness of a "she said, and laughed."

Give your reader credit. S/he's already into it, if you've done your job, and will know who's speaking.

reph · Apr 17, 2006

No one's suggested this yet:

"That's just what Grandma would have done," my cousin said with a smile.

writeorwrong · Apr 17, 2006

pandora9 said:
I can't laugh and talk at the same time. And I look like a psychopath if I try and smile and talk at the same time. I just tried it in the mirror.

I agree

. If you're not Jack Nicholson, Don't Try This At Home.

Akuma · Apr 17, 2006

I might not be so wrong in some situations:

"Ha ha ha," he laughed.

Then again, heaven forbid you ever do this.

Akuma <--- Laughing and talking at the same time

maestrowork · Apr 17, 2006

reph said:
Bill said and laughed, "And that's how Tommy convinced [persuaded, actually, but let me not sidetrack] his brother to eat crayons."

But couldn't we make it:

Bill said, "And that's how Tommy .... " and laughed.

maestrowork · Apr 17, 2006

reph said:
No one's suggested this yet:

"That's just what Grandma would have done," my cousin said with a smile.

I did. Post #3.

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