Learn Writing with Uncle Jim, Volume 1

James D. Macdonald · Jan 6, 2006

Sure, Anna.

You can also ask about 'em here: http://webnews.sff.net/read?cmd=xover&group=sff.workshop.viable-paradise&from=-10

AnnaWhite · Jan 6, 2006

The fact is, I'm very keen to attend the workshop. I tried to apply last June, but there were no places left. How much time do I have to send in my submission?

Unfortunately, I only have two completed and revised short stories that haven't yet been submitted to any magazine, and they are only just over 3,000 words each (total: 6,402 words, so quite a lot less than 10,000).

I also have the Frankenstein exercise (also just over 3,000 words), but although I recast the characters of Holmes and Watson, the style is still unmistakably Conan Doyle. I have a few other short stories, but I don't think they are any good. Besides the short stories, I have the sequel to the book that was printed by PA, but it is very much a 'sequel'. Originally, it was only one book.

So my question is, can I afford to wait until I finish another short story? Or should I send what I have immediately?

I'll be back online on Monday. A happy weekend to everybody!

James D. Macdonald · Jan 6, 2006

The workshop organizers usually send the first batch of submissions to the instructors in mid-March, then every month thereafter until we've filled the class.

We look at the submissions as: Obvious Invite, Let's Wait a Bit, and I Don't Think So. We keep going like that until we've filled the class.

Other instructors may have other criteria, but mine is: Do I think I have something useful to tell this person?

The staff figures it all out in June, though there may be some early acceptances. I don't have much to do with that end of things.

Sharon Mock · Jan 6, 2006

I attended last year and very highly recommend the experience.

I submitted two short stories, roughly the same total word count, and the length wasn't a problem. The one downside is that the two pieces tended to split attention, though I think most people tended to focus on one or the other.

My advice is to submit something that shows best who and where you are as a writer -- so that you can learn from its critique. (Once you're accepted to the workshop, you also have until mid-August to change your mind and send in something different. I ended up doing this with a newer draft of one of my two stories.)

As for when to apply... the staff says earlier is better, but I should think you could safely wait a month or two if you'd rather write something fresh.

Ken Schneider · Jan 7, 2006

I have a question.

In my current wip, I have scenes that I split, leaving the characters hanging, and rejoin them later to resolve the problem, or scene I left them in.

Should I,(is it standard), resolve the scene in the same chapter? Or, is it okay to resolve it in the next chapter?
I hope this makes sense.

blacbird · Jan 7, 2006

There isn't any standard.

caw.

Ken Schneider · Jan 7, 2006

I don't want to wait until the last chapter to resolve it, the reader may have forgotten the scene.

zornhau · Jan 7, 2006

Sounds like you're trying to artificially create forward momentum by inserting annoying chapter breaks.

Can't you resolve each scene, but give the resolution unexpected implications which will keep the reader reading?

E.g.

Sid: "Well, we sure kicked those orcs in the ###, Jeff... Jeff?"
Jeff: "Think I twisted my ankle. How the ### are we going to get up the Pass of Doom now?"
[End of chapter]

i.e. instead of cutting as the orcs attack: "Will our heroes prevail?" etc like the 1930s Flash Gordon serials, show them defeat the orcs but leave them with a complication.

Ken Schneider · Jan 7, 2006

Okay, let me see if I can explain this so that you may be able to give the answer I'm looking for.
By resolving the scene I mean to finish the cliffhanger that I left the group in when I changed scenes.

I want to have a page break, because I have differnet groups of people doing things to achieve a common end.

I want to leave these groups hanging in a bad, or difficult situations, or with unaswered questions, and then move on to a different group.

Then, I will come back later and answer those questions, or get them out of a stickty situation. I don't mean to say I stop in mid sentence, I can finish a scene.

This is the question, if you know, feel free to answer this question.

Is it common to have a page break, leave the characters in a difficult situation, go on to something else, and then come back to the other scene in the same chapter, or can it be the next chapter?

HConn · Jan 7, 2006

It can be either. Do whatever the story requires.

Ken Schneider · Jan 7, 2006

Thank you!

zornhau · Jan 7, 2006

Quite common to do either.

Sean Bosker · Jan 10, 2006

Ken Schneider said:
I don't want to wait until the last chapter to resolve it, the reader may have forgotten the scene.

For what it's worth, the first book in the His Dark Materials trilogy starts with the protagonist overhearing snippets of conversation that don't mean anything to her, or to the reader, and that conversation isn't referenced again until the very end of the book. By then, those words make sense, but the reader has almost certainly forgotten most of that conversation. It works fine in the book, it even creates a "Oh that's what they were talking about" moment.

James D. Macdonald · Jan 16, 2006

If I recall correctly, the first scene of The Golden Compass also has our protagonist sneaking around where she shouldn't be, in imminent danger of being discovered and getting in trouble. That she doesn't understand Adults talking about Adult Things isn't a problem there.

Linda Adams · Jan 16, 2006

Ken Schneider said:
Is it common to have a page break, leave the characters in a difficult situation, go on to something else, and then come back to the other scene in the same chapter, or can it be the next chapter?

But not so long that the reader forgets about the cliffhanger. I ran into a book by Kathy Reichs where she dropped a cliffhanger question without answering it and finally got around to answering it maybe ten chapters later. By then, I had forgotten the cliffhanger because of all the things that happened in between, and the cliffhanger quality had, over time, lost its effect.

Rambling · Jan 16, 2006

The subplot exampled above doesn't have much relevance to the main plot, and I was wondering if I'm losing complexity by trying to unify my story too much. Is it enough to have the subplot highlight or counterpoint a theme, even if it does nothing to drive forward the main thrust of the story?

PurpleLady · Jan 16, 2006

I had a similar experience. The beginning of my novel has a subplot that doesn't reappear later. It's sort of background about two of the main characters. However, even when I re-wrote it to give it more "bite," it was so different that I decided to cut the first chapter all together and begin with the main story. :e2writer:

Puddle Jumper · Jan 16, 2006

James D Macdonald said:
There are twenty-five simple steps to becoming a published author.

Here are the steps:

1. Black ink on white paper.
2. Place your name and address in the top left-hand corner of the first page.
3. Place the title and byline, centered, half-way down the first page.
4. Put a running head (your name, the title, and a page number) in the top right hand corner of every page.
5. Your pages should have one-inch margins.
6. Doublespace your text.
7. Use Courier 10 or Courier 12 only.
8. Type on one side of the paper only.
9. Continue until you reach "The End."
10. Rewrite.
11. Rewrite.
12.....21. Revise
22. Obtain the guidelines for a market that accepts material similar to what you have finished.
23. Follow the guidelines scrupulously when you submit your material.
24. While you are waiting for your rejection slip, start again back at step 1 for your next work.
25. When the rejection slip arrives, send the manuscript to the next market on your list, that same day.

Aw, you mean I can't use my pretty blue cloud paper? :Shrug:

What's the difference between rewriting and revising?

On the title page do you want to keep the same size font for the title as your text or do you want to make it bigger? What about bolding it? What about changing the font to make it a little fancier? And what about bolding chapter numbers and titles?

Title and byline - is by line where you write "By Your Name?" So you have it both there and up in the upper left hand corner of the title page?

Is there a difference between Courier and New Courier?

Puddle Jumper · Jan 16, 2006

Also, what if you have a really long title? For example if you're writing a series so that you have the series name plus the name of that exact book.

To take C.S. Lewis for example...

The Chronicles of Narnia: The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe

Would I want that full title "The Chronicles of Narnia: The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe" at the top of every page or would I want to shorten it to just the book name, "The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe?"

Or what if it's not a series like that and you just have a really long title?

And do you want it bolded to set it apart from the text or do you want it to be unbolded and look just like the text?

Sharon Mock · Jan 16, 2006

Puddle Jumper said:
Also, what if you have a really long title? For example if you're writing a series so that you have the series name plus the name of that exact book.

To take C.S. Lewis for example...

The Chronicles of Narnia: The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe

Would I want that full title "The Chronicles of Narnia: The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe" at the top of every page or would I want to shorten it to just the book name, "The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe?"

Or what if it's not a series like that and you just have a really long title?

And do you want it bolded to set it apart from the text or do you want it to be unbolded and look just like the text?

In this case you'd abbreviate it to just a word or two. The way I've been taught is:

Lewis/Wardrobe/123

Same font and style as the rest of the text. Right aligned. Leave about a double space between the header and the rest of the text.

Here is a good visual resource on manuscript format.

James D. Macdonald · Jan 16, 2006

Puddle Jumper said:
Aw, you mean I can't use my pretty blue cloud paper?

No.

What's the difference between rewriting and revising?

Rewriting gets the spelling, punctuation, and grammar. Revising is "looking again." Is there something else that needs to happen? Is this the best character to tell that part of the story? Does the story of the birthday party in chapter four, however amusing, belong? If so, would it go better in chapter eight? Is the ending as strong as it can be? Is the opening as smooth as it must be?

On the title page do you want to keep the same size font for the title as your text or do you want to make it bigger? What about bolding it? What about changing the font to make it a little fancier? And what about bolding chapter numbers and titles?

One font, one size. Why make your editor's job harder?

Title and byline - is by line where you write "By Your Name?" So you have it both there and up in the upper left hand corner of the title page?

The "byline" is "By [name of author that will appear on the story]." This is not always the same as [name of guy who wrote the story].

Is there a difference between Courier and New Courier?

No important difference for our purposes.

Also, what if you have a really long title? For example if you're writing a series so that you have the series name plus the name of that exact book.

To take C.S. Lewis for example...

The Chronicles of Narnia: The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe

Would I want that full title "The Chronicles of Narnia: The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe" at the top of every page or would I want to shorten it to just the book name, "The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe?"

Abbreviate. Lewis/Lion/1 ... etc. The purpose is so that when the pile holding your manuscript and fifteen others falls over, the editorial assistants can put all the manuscripts back together in the right order.

Or what if it's not a series like that and you just have a really long title?

Use one or two words from the title.

And do you want it bolded to set it apart from the text or do you want it to be unbolded and look just like the text?

One font, one size. What's with all this bolding? Just because your wordprocessor can doesn't mean you should. The header is already on its own line and flush right. No one's going to mistake it for the body text. Why distract the reader with boldface?

Puddle Jumper · Jan 16, 2006

Since the text would be double spaced, does that mean it should be the same space in comparison as the rest of the text? Thanks!

Puddle Jumper · Jan 16, 2006

Thank you James, that was very informative! I need to print that out.

James D. Macdonald · Jan 16, 2006

Puddle Jumper said:
Since the text would be double spaced, does that mean it should be the same space in comparison as the rest of the text? Thanks!

What's the antecedent for "it" there?

If you mean the header: Yes, it's two lines above the first line of the body text.

Puddle Jumper · Jan 16, 2006

James D. Macdonald said:
What's the antecedent for "it" there?

If you mean the header: Yes, it's two lines above the first line of the body text.

I was asking that in regards to what Sharon wrote...

Same font and style as the rest of the text. Right aligned. Leave about a double space between the header and the rest of the text.

Learn Writing with Uncle Jim, Volume 1

Your Genial Uncle

Your Genial Uncle

Wing nut

Absolute sagebrush

Absolute sagebrush

Swordsman

Absolute sagebrush

Whore for genre

Absolute sagebrush

Swordsman

Sean Bosker

Your Genial Uncle

Soldier, Storyteller

Puddle Jumper

Puddle Jumper

Wing nut

Your Genial Uncle

Puddle Jumper

Puddle Jumper

Your Genial Uncle

Puddle Jumper