Curse Words

NovelistWannabe · Jan 12, 2012

Simple question should I or shouldn't I include curse words in a YA novel?
Being the MCs four teens they are bound to say a curse word sooner or later.
Please explain your answer. Thanks

missesdash · Jan 12, 2012

NovelistWannabe said:
Simple question should I or shouldn't I include curse words in a YA novel?
Being the MCs four teens they are bound to say a curse word sooner or later.
Please explain your answer. Thanks

You definitely answered your own question.

NovelistWannabe · Jan 12, 2012

missesdash said:
You definitely answered your own question.

Should I just write:
The bold example: the guy said "fuck you man"
The censored example: the guy said "fudge you" (which I don't like)
or the curse cut example: the guy said "you should fu-..." while the girl interrupted "...fulfill your dream" the guy responded "I wasn't going to say that.

Springs · Jan 12, 2012

I would avoid the censored example, simply because it feels awkward. Unless that character genuinely dislikes swearing or has some other motive for censoring him/herself, it will come off as incredibly unnatural. Few people actually talk like that.

Personally, I typically go with the bold example. As long as it fits the scene and mood and it's not too overdone, I believe that, to a degree, swearing in YA is deemed acceptable. After all, let's face it, the readers are going to be at that level of language themselves. If you placed such words in every other sentence, it might get a little extreme, but as long as it's called for, I wouldn't worry in it. Of course, cutting the word might help inject a moment of comedy into your scene, but if used multiple times for no reason, it will just seem unnatural.

NovelistWannabe · Jan 12, 2012

Springs said:
I would avoid the censored example, simply because it feels awkward. Unless that character genuinely dislikes swearing or has some other motive for censoring him/herself, it will come off as incredibly unnatural. Few people actually talk like that.

Personally, I typically go with the bold example. As long as it fits the scene and mood and it's not too overdone, I believe that, to a degree, swearing in YA is deemed acceptable. After all, let's face it, the readers are going to be at that level of language themselves. If you placed such words in every other sentence, it might get a little extreme, but as long as it's called for, I wouldn't worry in it. Of course, cutting the word might help inject a moment of comedy into your scene, but if used multiple times for no reason, it will just seem unnatural.

I know the censored example is very unnatural, that's why I don't like it. The cutting the curse one I'll use it a few times but not a lot since, like you said, it's not normal.
Don't worry about over doing the curse words. My MCs only curse when the time is right not all the time. It's not that they are bad mouths lol

missesdash · Jan 12, 2012

Your font is very very large.

Anyway, definitely don't censor the words. Write what they say.

J.S.F. · Jan 12, 2012

Write what they say and how they say it, but ask yourself this one question: Is it necessary? If it is, if it's part of the MC's character(s) then use them. If they're just gratuitous and not integral to the development of the plot or moving the scene along, take 'em out.

As an example, in one of my YA novels (submitted and waiting) the MC leans back in his prison cell and bangs his head. I could have just written: "Shit!" Mort swore, and rubbed his head....", which would have been okay. Instead, I wrote "He let out a string of vicious curses and then got up to survey his surroundings, rubbing his head." Either way, he swore, but in the first example you know what he said and in the second you can guess.

JMO....

wampuscat · Jan 12, 2012

I'm by no means an expert in YA, but when I was a teenager, I tossed any book that started to feel fake or preachy. You'll lose your audience if you're not genuine to your character.

vintagegirl · Jan 13, 2012

If swearing feels natural to your characters they should do it. I have characters who do it more than others, and I have a character who just doesn't really swear, at all. Either way just stick to what feels genuine for your characters.

mellymel · Jan 13, 2012

I think the question you really want to know is not should I, but can I. The answer is yes. You can curse in YA. But as a pp said, do not make it gratuitous. If it's fitting to your characters and your story, then go for it. You might have one character who is a potty mouth and one that refuses to curse and says "What the fudge" all the time. Listen to the voices of your characters, but keep in mind you will have a hard sell if you have all of your characters cursing throughout the entire story. It will just become annoying and detract from the story. IMO. Be sparing if you can. It will have more impact.

kecargiulo · Jan 13, 2012

I think curse words give novels a realistic and gritty feel. I mean what teen actually says "fudge you!" unless they are a goody-two-shoes who is afraid of swearing?

thebloodfiend · Jan 13, 2012

Fudge you just sounds kind of ridiculous. Use whatever your characters would say.

Honestly, I've seen a lot of YA books that have just as much cursing as AF books . And there are a lot of AF books that don't have a lot of cursing, just like there are a lot of YA books that don't have a lot of cursing.

BTW, this is a much discussed topic. There's a sticky for it on this forum and the search function could have brought up like five other threads.

It seems like every other week there's something on swearing, drugs, or sex in YA.

mellymel · Jan 13, 2012

thebloodfiend said:
Fudge you just sounds kind of ridiculous. Use whatever your characters would say.

Honestly, I've seen a lot of YA books that have just as much cursing as AF books . And there are a lot of AF books that don't have a lot of cursing, just like there are a lot of YA books that don't have a lot of cursing.

BTW, this is a much discussed topic. There's a sticky for it on this forum and the search function could have brought up like five other threads.

It seems like every other week there's something on swearing, drugs, or sex in YA.

and violence

missesdash · Jan 13, 2012

Oh yeah I forgot the obligatory: Read the friggin' stickies.
No really.
Really.
Read them.

thebloodfiend · Jan 13, 2012

I feel like I should put this link in my sig:

NEW YA WRITERS! READ THIS! IT WILL TELL YOU EVERYTHING YOU NEED TO KNOW ABOUT SEX, VIOLENCE, SWEARING, AND DRUGS IN YA!!!!!

ohthatmomagain · Jan 13, 2012

kecargiulo said:
I think curse words give novels a realistic and gritty feel. I mean what teen actually says "fudge you!" unless they are a goody-two-shoes who is afraid of swearing?

Um... that's me

lol

missesdash · Jan 13, 2012

ohthatmomagain said:
Um... that's me lol

I know a girl who types "lmbo" because she doesn't even want to imply the word "ass."

I don't mind it. To each his own. I have tons of cursing in a lot of my MS's, but I have one character who doesn't curse at all. Although I might have her scream out a sing curse at one point just for impact. She's immediately clap a hand over her mouth and then spend the next few days agonizing over it.

So yeah, not cursing can be as useful as cursing when it comes to characterization.

shaldna · Jan 13, 2012

If your characters would swear then let them,

There is nothing worse than self censorship - like Bella Swann's 'Holy Crow!' (I shit you not)

J.S.F. · Jan 13, 2012

"Holy Crow"?

No shit....

Smish · Jan 13, 2012

missesdash said:
Oh yeah I forgot the obligatory: Read the friggin' stickies.
No really.
Really.
Read them.

And, you know, actually reading YA novels may be helpful, too.

Literateparakeet · Jan 13, 2012

The real question is what will your future agent/editor think about it?

I can't think of any YA novels I have read that have swear words in them.

Think about movies...some words will almost automatically make a movie rated R...meaning 18 and up.

maybegenius · Jan 13, 2012

Erm. Film rating systems do not apply to literature. At all. I usually argue that they're pretty arbitrary for films, really. Language alone doesn't tend to bump up a movie to R anymore unless it's constant and/or extreme.

Anyway, as has been mentioned: yes, it is perfectly fine to swear in YA. It's perfectly fine to swear A LOT in YA. If you get to the publication stage, it's up to the publisher whether or not they want to ask you to dial it back depending on your audience. That said, you do not HAVE to have your teenagers swear to convey a sense of realness in the work. It should, as most everyone's already mentioned, feel natural.

Smish · Jan 13, 2012

Literateparakeet said:
I can't think of any YA novels I have read that have swear words in them.

Seriously? This surprises the heck out of me. Even Harry Potter has swearing.

(And so do PG movies)

Literateparakeet · Jan 13, 2012

Smish said:
Seriously? This surprises the heck out of me. Even Harry Potter has swearing.

Maybe it was just so natural I didn't notice.

Could also be that I lean toward fantasy, and it would be weird if the characters in a fantasy world used our swear words.

missesdash · Jan 13, 2012

Literateparakeet said:
The real question is what will your future agent/editor think about it?

I can't think of any YA novels I have read that have swear words in them.

Think about movies...some words will almost automatically make a movie rated R...meaning 18 and up.

Then you're missing out on a lot of good stuff. I read Some Girls Are a last month and there's a "fuck" on every page.

The only word my agent has ever asked me to reconsider was a racial slur (wetback). That was only because switching it out to something else didn't lessen the impact. I don't even remember what I switched it to. Fucking asshole I think. Or maybe piece of shit. One of those double duty curses.

Curse Words

You can't sit with us!

You can't sit with us!

Red fish, blue fish...

Recovering adjective addict

Cory

You can't sit with us!

Cory

writing, working, weeping, winning

You can't sit with us!

The cake is a lie. But still cake.

Red fish, blue fish...

Reads more than she writes.

Nerdy Budgie

might be a giant

Reads more than she writes.

Nerdy Budgie

You can't sit with us!