"Hi," John said -or- "Hi," said John?

WannabeWriter · Feb 26, 2008

"<NAME> said" or "said <NAME>"

I notice two ways of identifying speakers in dialogue.

1. "I ran out," Kevin said.
2. "I ran out," said Kevin.

Are there pros and cons of either usage?

blacbird · Feb 26, 2008

The latter sounds old-fashioned to me, generally, although there might be context in which it would work appropriately. But if it's a question that really bugs you, go to a library or bookstore and see what other authors do in books similar to yours.

caw

ORION · Feb 26, 2008

I agree - read more -- each has its use. You can also make attributions ahead of the sentence depending on what your intent is.

megan_d · Feb 26, 2008

blacbird said:
The latter sounds old-fashioned to me

That's interesting, as it's the first that sounds old fashioned to me.

reenkam · Feb 26, 2008

Personally, I use both and switch back and forth depending on which flows better in the sentence.

plunderpuss · Feb 26, 2008

I'm with reenkam. It has to do with flow, so it's a choice every time I write it.

JJ Cooper · Feb 27, 2008

Disagree with a couple of posters here. I think you should select one and keep it consistent throughout your work. I advise against swapping back and forth, as it can be distracting.

Personally - Name said.

seun · Feb 27, 2008

JJ Cooper said:
Disagree with a couple of posters here. I think you should select one and keep it consistent throughout your work. I advise against swapping back and forth, as it can be distracting.

Personally - Name said.

Agreed on all points.

Danalynn · Feb 27, 2008

Nowadays, it seems to be more modern to use Name said. I agree that the other one seems old fashioned. I've also read where it's taboo now to switch back and forth from Name said to said Name throughout a novel. It can take the reader out of the story and make them notice that they are reading, and that's the LAST thing you want to happen.
:gone:

Either way you prefer to use it, though, consistency is the KEY. Pick whichever of the two that you like the most, and stick with it throughout the entire novel. Your readers will thank you for it.

Marlys · Feb 27, 2008

I disagree with the "pick one and stick to it" crowd. While I tend to use "Name said" most of the time, there are instances where for flow or emphasis "said Name" is the better choice. Consider:

"Poor lad," the man who hadn't wanted to help me earlier said.
"Poor lad," said the man who hadn't wanted to help me earlier. [too much going on between subject and verb in the first example]

"I think we're all peasants at heart," the King of France said.
"I think we're all peasants at heart," said the King of France. [the punchline effect is lost in the "Name said" example]

Just out of curiosity: taboo according to what source?

The Scip · Feb 27, 2008

JJ Cooper said:
Disagree with a couple of posters here. I think you should select one and keep it consistent throughout your work. I advise against swapping back and forth, as it can be distracting.

Personally - Name said.

I agree with this too.

johnzakour · Feb 27, 2008

I am with the "said <name>" is old more old fashion crowd. (Or perhaps younger sounding.)

I'm also with the mix it up a bit crowd. I usually use "<name> said" but on occasion when it fits I will change it around. Nothing is taboo if you do it right.

scribbler1382 · Feb 27, 2008

Mix it up. But don't get hung up on stuff like this. For the most part, as long as you stay away from swifties, attributions are invisible to the reader.

hammerklavier · Feb 27, 2008

It seems 'Name said' is overwhelmingly what most people use in common speach.

Charlie Horse · Feb 27, 2008

This is like asking whether you should wear button fly or zip ups. I say whichever is more comfortable for you. I do agree that you should be somewhat consistent throughout, but even on that point I don't think you need to obsess about it.

PenDragon · Feb 27, 2008

Replace "Name" with "He" or "She" and to me "said he" or "said she" sounds antiquated, possibly a bit goofy too. I stick with "Name said."

IceCreamEmpress · Feb 27, 2008

Marlys said:
I disagree with the "pick one and stick to it" crowd. While I tend to use "Name said" most of the time, there are instances where for flow or emphasis "said Name" is the better choice. Consider:

"Poor lad," the man who hadn't wanted to help me earlier said.
"Poor lad," said the man who hadn't wanted to help me earlier. [too much going on between subject and verb in the first example]

"I think we're all peasants at heart," the King of France said.
"I think we're all peasants at heart," said the King of France. [the punchline effect is lost in the "Name said" example]

Just out of curiosity: taboo according to what source?

This is the right answer, in my opinion.

I don't think "Said she" or "Said he" are useful except in a book that's trying to give the flavor of a bygone age.

But "...said the man behind the counter" is always useful.

LilliCray · Feb 27, 2008

I always use "Name said." Something about "said Name" jolts me as both a reader and a writer out of whatever piece I'm reading/working on. Not that I'm... y'know... weird or anything. *hides*

PenDragon · Feb 27, 2008

IceCreamEmpress said:
But "...said the man behind the counter" is always useful.

I agree, but I think the original poster was looking for specific guidance on "Kevin said" vs "said Kevin." type tags.

johnzakour · Feb 27, 2008

LilliCray said:
I always use "Name said." Something about "said Name" jolts me as both a reader and a writer out of whatever piece I'm reading/working on. Not that I'm... y'know... weird or anything. *hides*

There are times when a little jolt is good. Like I said, most of the time I do go with <Name> said... But on occasion when it seems right I will do a switch.

reenkam · Feb 27, 2008

I just picked up a couple books and 4 of the 5 used both "said Name" and "Name said". So, it seems, either my books are anomalies, people don't like reading the books I read, or people actually don't notice when an author makes the switch...which should actually be the case, in my opinion.

IceCreamEmpress · Feb 27, 2008

PenDragon said:
I agree, but I think the original poster was looking for specific guidance on "Kevin said" vs "said Kevin." type tags.

Oh, agreed.

It's just that some people take rules and guidelines to an extreme. After the various "you must NEVER use an adverb" and "you must NEVER use passive construction" comments I've seen, I would hate for someone to take away "you must NEVER use 'said {someone}'" from this thread.

MerryDay · Feb 27, 2008

Well, if you need one more counter-opinion, I'm in the said Kevin camp. I think the whole point of using said as a dialogue tag is so that it's "invisible" to the reader. Personally, when the construction is inversed to Kevin said it doesn't have the same effect on me - I notice it, it doesn't always flow right, technically this messes up the punctuation of the sentence, etc.

And I'm all for switching it up a few times, if you find your syntax getting a little redundant. However, whichever you choose, it's best to only switch it up when you want your dialogue tag not to be "invisible." For a jolt, as it were.

Bufty · Feb 27, 2008

If 'said X' is good enough for Philip Pullman it's good enough for me and I can honestly say I never cared a toss which way it was written in any book I can recall reading.

And I had to check Pullman's novels to be sure which version he used.

IceCreamEmpress · Feb 27, 2008

MerryDay said:
Well, if you need one more counter-opinion, I'm in the said Kevin camp. I think the whole point of using said as a dialogue tag is so that it's "invisible" to the reader. Personally, when the construction is inversed to Kevin said it doesn't have the same effect on me - I notice it

I think that your response is pretty unusual. Most people find "Kevin said" less noticeable than "said Kevin".

How about at the beginning of a sentence? "Said X" at the beginning of a sentence really sticks out to me, unless it's in an historical novel. (Or a poem

)

"Hi," John said -or- "Hi," said John?

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