Is anyone here in an MFA or a graduate of one? I'm interested in hearing about where you went, who you studied with, what you thought of the experience.
MFA programs
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An MFA is a Master of Fine Arts. It's the degree that Colleges give now that supposedly recognizes the graduate as a expert in Fine Arts and, when presented in conjunction with an English program, implies that they are either Professional Poets, Poetic Scholars or both, and is considered proof that one is qualified to write Poetry and Criticism (Critiques) for various "Literary" journals
It is, in effect, the Union Card for the clique that controls Publication of Poetry through Journals, Contests and/or Workshops and is devoted to perpetuation of "Modern Poetry" at the expense of all other styles. (To put it another way, it is the core of the current "Poetic" establishment).
Some, like Dana Goya and Joseph Salemi, who have gone through the system and achieved reputations both as Scholars and Poets, have declared it the source of all that is wrong with Poetry today, because it treats Poetry as a "Profession rather than as a "Creative Art".
If, on the other hand, you like to write the same kinds of Poetry that you can find in "Poetry" Magazine, The New Yorker", "Atlantic Monthly" and most Literary Jouranals and Contests, It's the entry fee for joining their ranks.
I'm sure there are some who will consider this overly negative, (and sour grapes because of my inability to break into the markets they control), but it's not. Today's bias is simply a result of the natural cycles of Poetic Taste that have been going on for Centuries and will turn back to some form of Traditionalism in time, when people tire of the Experiential Imagism based on Personal Experience that characterizes today's Poetry and return to the concept that Poetry should provide meaning and insight, and reflect the beauty of the Lanquage.
Think About it,
James R. Hoye, (JRH)
P.S. You can check out http://foetry.com for an overview of the flaws of MFA system, (which is ironic as that Forum is comprised primarily of MFAs who, when they graduated, found that there weren't enough jobs provided by the system to go around).
P.P.S. I do have a BA in English and a year towards a Masters, completed many many years before MFAs existed, and rely on those studies and 45+ years of writing Poetry by the "Traditional" values I was trained in to support my opinions.
It is, in effect, the Union Card for the clique that controls Publication of Poetry through Journals, Contests and/or Workshops and is devoted to perpetuation of "Modern Poetry" at the expense of all other styles. (To put it another way, it is the core of the current "Poetic" establishment).
Some, like Dana Goya and Joseph Salemi, who have gone through the system and achieved reputations both as Scholars and Poets, have declared it the source of all that is wrong with Poetry today, because it treats Poetry as a "Profession rather than as a "Creative Art".
If, on the other hand, you like to write the same kinds of Poetry that you can find in "Poetry" Magazine, The New Yorker", "Atlantic Monthly" and most Literary Jouranals and Contests, It's the entry fee for joining their ranks.
I'm sure there are some who will consider this overly negative, (and sour grapes because of my inability to break into the markets they control), but it's not. Today's bias is simply a result of the natural cycles of Poetic Taste that have been going on for Centuries and will turn back to some form of Traditionalism in time, when people tire of the Experiential Imagism based on Personal Experience that characterizes today's Poetry and return to the concept that Poetry should provide meaning and insight, and reflect the beauty of the Lanquage.
Think About it,
James R. Hoye, (JRH)
P.S. You can check out http://foetry.com for an overview of the flaws of MFA system, (which is ironic as that Forum is comprised primarily of MFAs who, when they graduated, found that there weren't enough jobs provided by the system to go around).
P.P.S. I do have a BA in English and a year towards a Masters, completed many many years before MFAs existed, and rely on those studies and 45+ years of writing Poetry by the "Traditional" values I was trained in to support my opinions.
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I went through the MFA in writing and poetics at Naropa University's Jack Kerouac School of Disembodied Poetics. But I had my concentration in prose. It was definitely worthwhile for me. It helped me discover new writers and writing styles and gave me the kick in the butt that I needed to get writing more. Most people were pretty happy with the program... but I can't speak for the poets since I didn't really take any poetry classes outside of the summer sessions.
Mine are B.A. in Journalism (interestingly, technically, A.B.J, which has a prurient ring to it) and MBA, which is another entry-fee degree into certain clubs I now avoid.
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In his post, JRH seemed to be pretty solidly against posturing, and making somewhat the same point as you (albeit sans the vitriol). WTF is your problem?
Ho Boy, do I have to grab a couple o' wallys by the scruffs of the neck? No bickering in the forums...er,...um...I mean, no MORE bickering in the forums...(he, he, er, do as I say, not as I do and all...)
Thanks for PM, JRH... though I never doubted your literary quality and integrity for a split second.
J
J
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Poets may have letters after their names, but poems don't. Which is, I think, a point on which everyone agrees.
Let's not go out of our way to raise anyone's dander. This is Poetry, not TIO. No name-calling, and no baiting. Please.
And keep the one-on-one conversations in PM's, not in threads.
Finally, it wouldn't hurt to try to stay on topic; whimsical asides are okay, but hijacks lose their appeal quickly.
Now, back to Ultra's question. I'm unqualified, as both my degrees are decidedly un-literary.
Let's not go out of our way to raise anyone's dander. This is Poetry, not TIO. No name-calling, and no baiting. Please.
And keep the one-on-one conversations in PM's, not in threads.
Finally, it wouldn't hurt to try to stay on topic; whimsical asides are okay, but hijacks lose their appeal quickly.
Now, back to Ultra's question. I'm unqualified, as both my degrees are decidedly un-literary.
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