Child Actors

Dear Hollow,

If there's a solid reason that the 10-year-old's actions and dialogue are adult, then by all means keep it as it is. But if it's just too adult because you're not really sure how littl'uns act and speak, then I think you may want to do some research. How about letting some of the mums and dads here have a look at your dialogue? Obviously, though, not all kids are at the same level. The part of London where I live, the kids are repellently confident and articulate, but go a few miles in another direction and some of them of the same age can barely string a sentence together. Good luck, and I hope you have an interesting time researching.

You've hit on a particular peeve of mine, screenplays and teleplays in which the kids are like miniature adults, with adult vocabularies and sensibilities.

Writing kids that seem like real kids isn't easy. Casting young actors to portray kids can't be any picnic, either, or there'd be more who aren't painful to watch. But even a gifted child actor isn't going to be able to sell lines which are too wise for their years and the character's experiences.

Remember, streetwise, savvy kids who've seen everything, including things they shouldn't have, still don't know everything, even though they may act like they do. They still experience self-doubt, a need for unconditional love, shame at their shortcomings, wonder at things adults take for granted, and innocence, both sexual and social.

If you aren't around kids the age you're writing about, spend some time observing them without their knowing, if you can. They'll open your eyes.

Maryn

Have to quote one of my old audiovisual teachers. He claimed that old people, animals and children could ruin even the best script because of their often lacking acting skills. One of my fellow students then made the best short film at the university that year containing only these 3 types of actors. But it's a challenge for sure.

tangent alert

have you seen the will farrell short where the little girl (about 3) screams at him (her tenant) about paying the rent?
you can't not laugh at that little girl acting like an adult

The first two things they taught me in film school were:

KISS (Keep it simple, stupid)

and

AWAC (stay away from Air-Water-Animals-Children)

Maryn said:

If you aren't around kids the age you're writing about, spend some time observing them without their knowing, if you can. They'll open your eyes.

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But don't hang around playparks smiling at kids. Bad men in uniforms will come and do bad things to you. I'm just saying.

-Derek

Hollow,

I'd recommend you to watch Forbidden games by Rene Clement (1952) for an example of a movie with kids as main characters that got it right. And you heard it from someone who is usually allergic to kids. An amazing movie on many levels.

tourdeforce said:

The first two things they taught me in film school were:

KISS (Keep it simple, stupid)

and

AWAC (stay away from Air-Water-Animals-Children)

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You folks don't like a challenge, do you? I'm not going to get started on that KISS rule to avoid off-topic controversy.

I have worked with children as a summer camp counselor in different countries and cultures, and I find that children up through the age of 10 or 11 are uterly universal from one end of the globe to the other. They will laugh at the same things and get upset over the same things. It isn't until about the age of 12 and beyond that culture starts to take hold of a child and their sensibilities start to become more locally-distinct.

If your script is about a 10-year-old, you're at the advantage of having a universal-type child to write about. ANY kid from ANY neighborhood and ANY economic level and speaking ANY language will be exactly the same as any other kid in the world of the same age (barring mental/emotional disabilities). So any 10-year-old kid in your neighborhod will be a fine model to study, regarless of where your script takes place.

As for the maturity level, you might wanna make your child an extremely gifted child. Children with mega-brain intelligence can be startlingly advanced in their maturity and vocabularies, and often tend to be very pure-hearted and altruistic (thank God! otherwise they're downright creepy!). If your character is a super-brain, then advanced maturity is just fine.

But that scenario almost NEVER makes any allowances for actual WISDOM. Wisdom comes from years of life, not reading books. It's possible for a gifted child to read books of wisdom ("Chicken Soup for the Soul" anyone? or how about Proverbs and Ecclesiastes?) and increase their capacity for wisdom. But even then, wisdom usually needs to be tested and seasoned through actual living. So I wouldn't have a problem with a gifted child who is very smart and has great people skills, but I'd laugh at a child displaying advanced degrees of wisdom.

Hollow said:

You make some good points Plot Device. But what about children who have had something traumatic happen to them in the past and have been made to grow up a bit quicker than normal?

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I think you're describing a damaged child who will not be stable. Such a child resorted to a defense mechanism of some kind which included shedding/abandonig his or her childlike innocence and sense of playfulness. To say that this child "grew up a bit quicker" is a myth. What this child really did was by-pass an impotrant developmental stage.

Not healthy.

Here's an example of damaged physical developemnt that I think can translate well into learning lessons on psychological development:

I used to babysit a 4-year-old little girl with odd motor problems. The physical therapist interviewed the mother and found out the mother mistakenly failed to allow the little girl to crawl as a baby. She always had the girl play in a stationary place, and then she always carried the little girl from point A to point B, so the girl never crawled. The result was she was delayed in her walking, and when she did learn to walk, she was a clumsy walker.

The physical therapist explained that there's a need for a child to crawl (if even for a few months) before eventually walking because there's an important motor development that gets fostered via the crawling activity. And that motor development later translates into a better gracefulness and more accute sense of balance when walking.

By-passing certain developmental stages is a bad thing. What you're describing is a child who's damaged goods, not a pillar of strength and not a fountain of wisdom.

Hollow said:

That's exactly what I meant! Thank you very much for responding I think that has helped a great deal.

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Glad it helped.

Hmmmm. Russian. I bet there's a list of films somewhere on the net where Russians are main characters.

Try "K-19: The Widow Maker" starrig Harrison Ford and Liam Neeson. ALL the characters in that are Russian (even Harrison Ford) and they ALL do Russian accents.

And then there's "The Sum of All Fears" with Ben Affleck.

And who could forget "The Russians Are Coming! The Russians Are Coming!" a comedy classic from the 1960's.

And then there's "Fiddler on the Roof." (uh ... that takes place Russia, right????? Yes? No? Anybody?)

Hollow said:

Thanks once again for the suggestions. I can't believe how helpful this forum has been. Honestly doubt I would be continueing this adventure if it weren't for you guys.

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And since you're a Star Trek fan, how about Ensiegn Checkov?

Hollow said:

Star Trek? ;>_> I've never seen ST in my life, haha. Where did you get that idea?

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Um ..... you signature????

A few films with connection to Russia:
Ninotchka
Isn't some of Bourne Supremacy taking place in Russia?
DR. Strangelove
Potemkin (won't help you with dialogue

I also did a search on youtube on "russian accent" and got 135 different clips.

Hollow said:

Oh, is that where that quote is from? I just found it when I Googled "Hollow" searching for something slightly appropriate ;>_> That was totally unintentional, haha.

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"For the World is Hollow and I have Touched the Sky" is the title of a Star Trek-Original Series episode where Kirk, Spock and McCoy visit an articifial planet that is enclosed in a super dome. The people who live there are of a lower technology than the makers of the dome (a bit Medieval) and have no knowledge about the artificiality of their world. They are forbidden by anceint law to ever climb the mountains. But one old man claims he climbed the mountains one day and that he reached up and touched the top of a ceiling of some kind (a little Truman Show for ya there). His dying words to Kirk were "For the world is hollow and I have touched the sky."

Hollow said:

Star Trek? ;>_> I've never seen ST in my life, haha. Where did you get that idea?

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That's just... wrong. I get all my plots from Star Trek: TOS. Most of my dialogue, too. No one seems to have noticed or complained yet. You. Damned. Klingon!

Plot Device said:

"For the World is Hollow and I have Touched the Sky" is the title of a Star Trek-Original Series episode where Kirk, Spock and McCoy visit an articifial planet that is enclosed in a super dome.

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"When visiting an alien world, never turn your back on big metal cylinders sticking up out of the ground, invariably they will turn out to be elevators stuffed full of bad men with swords." ~Starfleet Handbook (Captain's Edition)

-Derek