Market or Passion?

Get to the end of writing the book then tell us how you feel. Number one passion is to finish the WIP.


Os.

Agree 100% with Os.

Don't read Writer's Digest while you're writing your novel! That's like trying to read the instruction manual for a toaster while riding a snorting dragon. Throw that silly mag into the trash and channel the passion.

I definitely have the market (stereotypical group of readers) in mind as I write my book. I think you need to know who will be reading the book so you can write in a way that will appeal to them.

When I write articles for magazines I always ask who the target readership is so I can slant the article in a way that appeals to those readers. I think you should do the same with a novel.

As for writing for what is hot now; it takes so damm long to write and publish a book that if you kept trying to markets the current hot topic you would be rushing about a week too late on every topic. I think you are better off writing something that greatly appeals to you and hope that there is a bigger enough market of readers who like the same stuff as you do.

I write stories that I'd like to read, not what others like to read. My thinking is, I can only try to guess what others like and probably get it wrong, or I write what I like and get it right. The idea that you can't get published if you write what you like makes the assumption that your taste in reading is completely unique. Surely, someone has the same tastes as you.

Passion is what gives the fireworks, and fireworks is what makes me happy as a reader. If it happens to coincide with what's hot currently, it's a bonus.

The alternative is writing by numbers, which is as boring to read as it is to write.

False antithesis

Mike Coombes said:

Passion is what gives the fireworks, and fireworks is what makes me happy as a reader. If it happens to coincide with what's hot currently, it's a bonus.

The alternative is writing by numbers, which is as boring to read as it is to write.

Click to expand...

On the contrary! This is a false antithesis. If you hear them speak, I think the best pro writers have a passion for entertaining the reader.

Imagine being story teller at a winter fireside. Wouldn't you pitch your tales to please your audience? Isn't that part of the fun?

Writing fiction is similarly interactive, it's just the feedback loop has a greater delay.

ps1:
I can't see a writer changing their style, just so they can get a novel sold.

Click to expand...

I think it all depends on why you're writing. If you're writing first and foremost because you want to get your story down on paper, then writing with passion can carry that through (and I'm all in favour of anything that gets you to finish x thousand words and complete a manuscript).

However, (and I'm just stating my opinion here without any intention of causing offence), writing with passion and your own style isn't necessarily going to appeal to people. Therefore, if you're looking at getting your manuscript to a publisher, I think that you've got to take a step back during the editing and rewriting process to work out if your style is actually readable by the general public. If you write in a particular genre, then I think you need to have at least a nodding acquaintance with what sells in that genre so you can make sure that your work is pitched correctly.

I'm not suggesting that people completely compromise their work to whatever the herd mentality demands, but I think you need to be aware of what's out there if you're serious about looking to sell. There's always room for unique voices out there in every genre, but really look at what you're doing to work out if you have come up with something unique and sellable, or whether your passion has made you over-indulgent to your work.

Like I said, I don't intend any offence by saying that.

MM

passion

Mike Coombes said:

Passion is what gives the fireworks, and fireworks is what makes me happy as a reader. If it happens to coincide with what's hot currently, it's a bonus.

The alternative is writing by numbers, which is as boring to read as it is to write.

Click to expand...

I tend to agree. Writing for the market is just not something very many writers can pull off. Good writers don't write for teh market, they make the market.

zornhau said:

On the contrary! This is a false antithesis. If you hear them speak, I think the best pro writers have a passion for entertaining the reader.

Imagine being story teller at a winter fireside. Wouldn't you pitch your tales to please your audience? Isn't that part of the fun?

Writing fiction is similarly interactive, it's just the feedback loop has a greater delay.

Click to expand...

Yes, but this does not mean pro writers write for the market. Every pro writer I know writes out of passion. That is, they write what they most love writing, and they write it in the way they would most want to read it.

I think the worst possible way to please your audience is to write to the market, thinking, well, I need to do this, that, and then the other because that's what readers will like.

The best pro writer always write the novel they would love to read themselves, the novel they have a passion for, not the novel they think readers will love.

You hope readers will love the tale, of course, but unless you love it, unless you're telling the story you care about, in the way you want to do it, odds are no one but your mother is going to like it.

Yes, but presumably most of them can choose from a range of ideas swarming around in their heads.

zornhau said:

Yes, but presumably most of them can choose from a range of ideas swarming around in their heads.

Click to expand...

Sure, but they're always going to pick the one they have passion for. Trying to write a novel that doesn't first and foremost please and excite you is akin to watching paint dry.

I just do not believe anyone can write very well at all by trying to write for some audience out there, rather than writing something that instills passion in the writer. You may get published by writing to teh market, but I sincerely doubt your book will make a splash. More like a dull thud when it hits bottom.

Jamesaritchie said:

Sure, but they're always going to pick the one they have passion for. Trying to write a novel that doesn't first and foremost please and excite you is akin to watching paint dry.

I just do not believe anyone can write very well at all by trying to write for some audience out there, rather than writing something that instills passion in the writer. You may get published by writing to teh market, but I sincerely doubt your book will make a splash. More like a dull thud when it hits bottom.

Click to expand...

Agreed!

I just think it's important to make the point that there's nothing wrong with selecting from your possible projects with a market in mind.

"Don't marry for money. But look for love where money is."

ps1 said:

Something along the lines of:

How to Write for "X" Market that is Really Selling.

Click to expand...

It must have been a while since I picked up Writer's Digest. I remember those "How To" articles tended to focus on freelance writing markets, rather than hot novel markets.

zornhau said:

Agreed!

I just think it's important to make the point that there's nothing wrong with selecting from your possible projects with a market in mind.

"Don't marry for money. But look for love where money is."

Click to expand...

Yes, I think having a market in mind is a good idea. I do this with short stories on a regular basis. But I still right the story I want to write, and do my best to write it in a way that works for me.

I'm not sure it's as important with novels because the marketing system is different, and there's a much better chance of a novel finding the market that's right for it, rather than trying to preconceive a market.

Just my experience, but with novels, I've found the writer is often surprised by which publisher actually buys his first novel. It seldom seems to be the one the writer had in mind.

And sometimes I think it's easier to sell fiction when the writer comes up with something new, and the short story or novel makes its own market. This is a very tough act to pull off, but it's the way many of the writing superstars are made.

But, really, in the end, I think it always comes down to a good story, well-told, good characters, well-rounded, and good dialogue, well-spoken.
If you can do this, the market will take care of itself.

Always and ever write what turns you on, never write for a trend.

By the time you've finished the work, the trend is pushing up daisies, but your passion will never go out of style.

For the last 20 years I've been told the "trend" for which I write is over, but I have a passion for its themes, so I keep selling. I ignore how other writers deal with it and go with what turns me on about it. That passion keeps me different from the rest and readers pick up on that.

And what the others said: lose the cheesy writing magazine. Fast. Hit the 808 section of the library instead and look up how-to books by writers with a serious track record of sales.

Good luck!

My advice: write what you really like to do - perhaps it can catch on, perhaps not. But the most important thing is that you feel happy about it (as goes for most things).


Nickie

Jamesaritchie said:

Yes, but this does not mean pro writers write for the market. Every pro writer I know writes out of passion. That is, they write what they most love writing, and they write it in the way they would most want to read it.

I think the worst possible way to please your audience is to write to the market, thinking, well, I need to do this, that, and then the other because that's what readers will like.

The best pro writer always write the novel they would love to read themselves, the novel they have a passion for, not the novel they think readers will love.

You hope readers will love the tale, of course, but unless you love it, unless you're telling the story you care about, in the way you want to do it, odds are no one but your mother is going to like it.

Click to expand...

I agree.

Magazine

I do think Writer's Digest is a very valuable magazine, and there's a ton of information in it that's useful for beginners and seasoned pros alike. But there is also a lot of information aimed at selling copies of the magazine, rather than at real world writing. If you lack enough experience to tell one sort of information from the other, you can get in trouble.

When you read an article in WD, look at who wrote it, why they wrote, and check out how well what they say worked for them out in the real world.

In one sense, you do have to write for the market. If you want to write a romance novel, you do have to know the tropes, and you probably need to know that an HEA ending is most often required.

And in any genre, you have to know what's been done to death.

I agree with Gillhoughly about writing for trends. By the time you learn how to write well in a given trend, odds are that trend will already be dead and gone.

But there is a phenomena called "coattailing," and if you can already write well and fast, it is possible to take advantage of it. It's not something I'd want to do, but many writers have made it work.

Coattailing is when a novel hits it big on a topic or trend that wasn't around before, or when a new novel brings a dormant genre to life. If that novel stays popular long enough, there is time for some other writers to jump on the bandwagon. Da Vinci Code, for example, has had several novels coattail it.

Coattail novels seldom hit as big as the original, but they can land pretty far up the bestseller list, and can get a writer started.

And whenever a novel is big enough to bring a dormant genre to life, there usually is time enough for quite a few writers to jump on that bandwagon, which is usually what kills the genre again.

One thing I can say with near certainly is that even two or three or four or five years from now, romance novels and mysteries are still going to be very popular, and will still be the two largest segments of the market. What no one can say is which sub-genre of romance or mystery will be the ones most sought, and this is the problem with trying to write to trends.

Mysteries are still extremely popular, but male-oriented hardboiled novels with a tough guy protagonist are a very tough sell.

But I think the real problem of trying to jump on a bandwagon, catching a coattail, or following a trend has little to do with what may or may not be selling two or three years from now. The real problem is trying to write a quality novel in an area you don't love to read and write.

Most writers do their best work when they're writing the kind of novel they most love to read. It usually takes some very wide reading, and quite a bit of writing experience to be able to write well in multiple genres, or on topics that never interested you deeply. For new writers, trying to write to a trend, or to a market, probably won't work for a lot of reasons, but maybe the main reason is because they've haven't yet learned to write a publishable novel in their favorite genre/area, and writing one outside of this is far tougher.

My situation is sort of similar to this...I'm primarily a fantasy writer, and I've got a couple of fantasy novels on the backburner that I'm truly, wildly passionate about. But they're the odd, deep, meaningful monster epic masterpiece kind--the kind that an unpublished author could have a lot of trouble selling (especially since it looks like it's going to be a trilogy). I'm also working out some plot issues right now, and so even though I WILL write them someday, I'm seriously considering working instead right now on an idea I had for a paranormal romance.

I'm excited about the romance one too, just not quite in the same way I'm excited about my fantasy babies--I'd planned to write it someday, but was going to write it *after* the uber-epics. But the romance is a more, well, marketable story--in the sense that it would all fit in one book, and that book would probably be around 70,000-80,000 words, which is a more likely length for a new author to get published at. And I think it might be entertaining to a broader audience. So even though I really want to work on my fantasy stories, my thought is that if I tap into my passion for the romance story first, then when I get around to doing the fantasy novels I'll be more likely to get them published. If I 'write to the market' a little bit for my first book or two, I could be more likely to get my more unorthodox stories published later than if I did them first as a no-name unpublished author. I'm not writing purely to be sellable--the romance idea is one I'm passionate about too. And I'm not planning on changing the story itself just to please the public. But I'm reordering my list-of-books to write based on what I think would work best for an unpublished author.

Does that make any sense? Should I just go with the flow and write whatever I want the most first, even if it's a sprawling six-book fantasy? Or should I still write what I want, but try and look out for my best interests too? (considering my net income this year is going to be negative, it'd be nice to put effort into something that could pay off within the next five years). plus, since I've never even finished a book before, would it be better as a learning experience to do something that, y'know, I could actually finish in a year?

Passion.

Next question?

Passion. The market will take care of itself. If you spend your time writing to market, you'll end up writing based on a formula. If you're going to do that you might as well just fill out a mad-lib.

I_Shrugged said:

To use a quote: "Above all else to thine own self be true."

I could change my work (my style, my philosophy...) to meet someone else's expectations of what a writer should write, but I'd be stabbing myself in the heart to do it. If I never get published, at least I can look at myself in the mirror everyday without cringing.

Click to expand...

I agree..the only thing I dont agree with is that no matter what I do, when I look at myself in the mirror I cringe.

If I had the skill for it, market. Passion will get me nowhere. Nobody buys what I like to write. Writing is a lot better than jobs that involve shovels or retail. I don't care what I'd have to write. I would do anything not to have to work for someone else.

But since I don't have the skill for it, I doubt I'll try writing outside my non existent genre any time soon.

Gillhoughly said:

Always and ever write what turns you on, never write for a trend.

Click to expand...

On the other hand, I know someone who read on an agent's blog that a certain genre was 'hot'. She sat down and wrote a novel in that genre (a very good novel), and it sold in a decent three book deal.

So there y'go. Make of that what you will . . .