POV - couldn't find in other threads

razormoney · Oct 15, 2006

I know several gurus (including Trottier) frown on POV. However, I have a character who, when she concentrates, can see things as they were in the past. No one else can see what she does. For instance, when she and her friends walk through an ancient city, she can see the stautes as they were thousands of years ago.

Anybody have any insights as to a clear way to approach this?

I was thinking of just keeping it simple and writing:

Like holograms, Amber sees each statue in its original glory before it fades from her sight.

Can anyone think of a better way? Especially if I want to point this out several times as they search the ruins.

Thanks,
R

Anthony Ravenscroft · Oct 15, 2006

In a screenplay or script? Nah. A radio play, maybe.

Wouldn't you leave this entirely as a "showing" approach? Like, describe the visuals you use to indicate the otherworldliness of the phenomenon.

clockwork · Oct 15, 2006

Nothing wrong with POV if if it makes things clearer or is a device.

When you want to switch into it go with--

AMBER'S POV,

Holograms in their former glory which quickly fade from sight.

Jon enters the room. Glances at Amber.

******
Just make sure it's simple and clear.

icerose · Oct 15, 2006

There's always the SUPER tool. Where you can superimpose an image over the current scene, and then end it. And if only she is looking in that direction, then we know it's coming from her, especially if she zones out, then someone shakes her and asks. "Are you okay?" "yeah, did you see that?" "See what?"

Type of thing.

Anthony Ravenscroft · Oct 16, 2006

Except you're not showing "holograms," right? You're supposed to be describing what God's Eyeball is seeing. I doubt you'd be showing actual holograms, being as they're notoriously difficult to get to film in the best of situations.

And how the heck do I tell the artists or propmakers or camera operators to get the "former glory" part?

I can see some sense in mentioning what an actor's supposed to somehow express, but it's hard to get a visual to emote on cue.

dpaterso · Oct 16, 2006

I can't say I get "Like holograms" -- not sure what I'm supposed to be seeing, a rock concert light show, or what?

Many ways to write this... here are some random suggestions, maybe a word or two might help, but feel free to ignore me and do your own funky thing:

When Amber looks at the statues she sees them in their original intact form for a moment, radiant and glowing, before they change to their real appearance, broken and crumbled.

Again the heroic statues appear whole and radiant to Amber, before they change to their present day state.

Amber stares up at Apollo's glowing, handsome face... until it changes to a worn, featureless lump of stone.

Amber gasps with delight at the rows of beautiful rainbow statues... which morph into broken ruins.

-Derek
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scripter1 · Oct 16, 2006

Write

what would be on screen.

If Amber looks at things and sees them as they used to be then write

Amber sees beautiful statues.

Maybe focus on that for moment, show us her reaction to them, her awe, her appreciation, her understanding that she knows what they once were.

THEN have someone break that connection to the past, walk in front of her, or something and we see them as they really are, broken and crumpled.
Don't use stagnate descriptions, involve action to convey your point.
We should feel some emotion has we move from glory to ruin.

For reference check out Shallow Hal and The Mummy 2.

scottVee · Oct 17, 2006

Actually, a lot of internalizing is frowned upon, period. Flowery descriptions may get a snort instead of getting creativity points. And explanations are the worst of all. It's tricky stuff, since some directors hate to be told what to show, and others hate not to have all the elements laid out for them to choose from. And of course the folks who plow through heaps of scripts aren't directors at all.

Every scene has a POV from one point or another -- the trick is not to pick artificial POVs require interrupting the flow of the story. But sometimes characters see things that aren't there, or notice details other characters are unaware of, and you just have to tell it like it is then get back to the story.

scripter1 · Oct 17, 2006

I'll say it again.

Write what needs to be on the screen.

You may have to think about the setup with in the scene but what Amber sees and does is simply what she sees and does.

She looks around, sees handsome Apollo, smiles at beautiful Athena, stands quiet before mighty Zeus.

Someone callls her name, she turns, acknowldges them, looks back to the statues, aged, crumpled, lumps of rock.

If you've introduced us to her gift then people will get it.

Remember, the scene needs to do several things at once.
It needs to advance the story, it needs to increase our understanding and relationship with the character, it needs to set up an expectation of more to come (present us with some type of question to answer) and it needs to possibly resolve issues/questions left open by previous scenes.

So, it is more then just she sees, and then he sees, and the two are different.

jonpiper · Dec 2, 2006

Would this work?

EXT. PLAZA OF GODS - DAY

Amber and Sean stand alone, among ancient statues of Apollo, Zeus, and others.

SEAN
How sad.

IN AMBER'S EYES

The statues stand in their original splendor.

Many people in robes wander among the statues.

Children run between the gods.

A horse and rider gallop into the plaza.

BACK TO SCENE

SEAN (CONT'D)
(shaking Amber)
Amber. Amber.

Goodwriterguy · Dec 2, 2006

razormoney said:
I know several gurus (including Trottier) frown on POV. However, I have a character who, when she concentrates, can see things as they were in the past. No one else can see what she does. For instance, when she and her friends walk through an ancient city, she can see the stautes as they were thousands of years ago.

Anybody have any insights as to a clear way to approach this?

I was thinking of just keeping it simple and writing:

Like holograms, Amber sees each statue in its original glory before it fades from her sight.

Can anyone think of a better way? Especially if I want to point this out several times as they search the ruins.

Thanks,
R

Well, lots of advice so far.

The problem involves the idea that what Amber sees is different from what the other characters see and conveying this from the page without inducing confusion and doing so succinctly.

Your attempt (above) tells us what amber sees but it doesn't tell us what WE SEE, and that's an all-important consideration. You probably assumed that your description at least implies or infers that WE SEE what Amber sees, but that's not what it says; it says, "Amber sees" and leaves us high and dry.

This would require some real scrubbing to get right, with any number of different approaches written and tested out.

Of the top of my head I think I'd try the POV first.

EXT ANCIENT CITY - DAY

Amber and her friends amble along a street and into a plaza-like situation where statues and sculptings abound, all showing the same signs of extreme age that everything exhibits.

Amber checks up, appears to go trance-like. She gapes.

WHAT SHE SEES

The statues and sculptings alright, but here they are as new, as they were five-thousand years before, in all their glory.

AMBER'S FRIEND (VO)
Come on, Amber, we have to keep
moving.

AMBER
No, I -- give me a sec.

AMBER'S FRIEND (VO)
You okay? We're going.

AMBER (VO)
No. I'm fine. You guys go ahead.
I'll catch up. I just need a minute.

BACK TO SCENE

Amber's friends move along, leaving her staring. She shakes her head, blinks her eyes, shades them with a hand from the sun, disbelieving, puzzled.

Amber runs her gaze around the plaza again.

WHAT SHE SEES

This time everything is as it is, statues and sculptings worn with age.

BACK TO SCENE

Amber runs to catch up to her friends.

AMBER
Hey you guys, you're not gonna believe this!

Amber catches up. Her friends turn to her.

FRIEND
Believe what?

AMBER
What I just saw.

FRIEND
What did you see?

AMBER
I, uh, well -- oh never mind. Let's go.

NEXT SCENE

This would be my first attack but probably not the last.

I don't think there's a blessed thing in the world "wrong" with declaring POVs like this, and in the end if I decided this approach was gonna be it, I'd not hestitate a moment writing them.

You have some writer's work to do. Play with this, write some renditions, keep looking until you find something that suits the scene and your voice. It's there, you just have to find it.

Study the responses you've gotten here, there's good thinking in them.

Cheers!

Goodwriterguy · Dec 2, 2006

Added thought ...

Goodwriterguy said:
Well, lots of advice so far.

The problem involves the idea that what Amber sees is different from what the other characters see and conveying this from the page without inducing confusion and doing so succinctly.

Your attempt (above) tells us what amber sees but it doesn't tell us what WE SEE, and that's an all-important consideration. You probably assumed that your description at least implies or infers that WE SEE what Amber sees, but that's not what it says; it says, "Amber sees" and leaves us high and dry.

This would require some real scrubbing to get right, with any number of different approaches written and tested out.

Of the top of my head I think I'd try the POV first.

EXT ANCIENT CITY - DAY

Amber and her friends amble along a street and into a plaza-like situation where statues and sculptings abound, all showing the same signs of extreme age that everything exhibits.

Amber checks up, appears to go trance-like. She gapes.

WHAT SHE SEES

The statues and sculptings alright, but here they are as new, as they were five-thousand years before, in all their glory.

AMBER'S FRIEND (VO)
Come on, Amber, we have to keep
moving.

AMBER
No, I -- give me a sec.

AMBER'S FRIEND (VO)
You okay? We're going.

AMBER (VO)
No. I'm fine. You guys go ahead.
I'll catch up. I just need a minute.

BACK TO SCENE

Amber's friends move along, leaving her staring. She shakes her head, blinks her eyes, shades them with a hand from the sun, disbelieving, puzzled.

Amber runs her gaze around the plaza again.

WHAT SHE SEES

This time everything is as it is, statues and sculptings worn with age.

BACK TO SCENE

Amber runs to catch up to her friends.

AMBER
Hey you guys, you're not gonna believe this!

Amber catches up. Her friends turn to her.

FRIEND
Believe what?

AMBER
What I just saw.

FRIEND
What did you see?

AMBER
I, uh, well -- oh never mind. Let's go.

NEXT SCENE

This would be my first attack but probably not the last.

I don't think there's a blessed thing in the world "wrong" with declaring POVs like this, and in the end if I decided this approach was gonna be it, I'd not hestitate a moment writing them.

You have some writer's work to do. Play with this, write some renditions, keep looking until you find something that suits the scene and your voice. It's there, you just have to find it.

Study the responses you've gotten here, there's good thinking in them.

Cheers!

I neglected to address the idea that you wish to show Amber having this experience more than once. Again, the next time she does I'd have to fiddle with it to decide just how I was going to write it. I might decide to use her POV again or I might just say that "She's seeing things as she did before, the way they looked five-thousand years ago."

EXT ANCIENT CITY

Amber and her friends are now atop a nearby hill, gazing over the entire cityscape below.

Amber gets that trance-like posture again, her eyes go narrow. She's seeing the city as it was five-thousand years ago!

Or,

EXT ANCIENT CITY

Amber and her friends are now atop a nearby hill, gazing over the entire cityscape below.

Amber gets that trance-like posture she had earlier, when she saw the statues and sculptings as they were thousands of years before.

WHAT AMBER SEES

A gloriously new city, teeming with PEOPLE, smoke rising from cook fires.

BACK TO SCENE

Amber rubs her eyes, disbelieving, deeply puzzled.

(complete scene)

NEXT SCENE

Something like one of these two examples.

Cheers again!

POV - couldn't find in other threads

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