Ancient History

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Puma

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Out of curiosity, how many people on this forum are interested in ancient history/archaeology? If you are interested in ancient history, do you have a specific area of interest?

I'm interested in all areas of the world; but have the most knowledge in midwestern US archaeology. I'm also fascinated by the similarities in traditional stories from widely separated cultural groups. Puma
 

LloydBrown

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Puma said:
Out of curiosity, how many people on this forum are interested in ancient history/archaeology? If you are interested in ancient history, do you have a specific area of interest?

::Raises hand:: over here!

Lots of areas of interest--too many to name specific time periods, cultures, or areas.
 

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I'm interested in archaeology and prehistory in general, but I'm particularly interested in inscriptions and the history of writing, and in Indo-European cultures, particularly the ancient Celts, insular and continental.
 

Puma

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I wanted to be an archaeologist too but at the time I was most interested in pre-Columbian central America. My senior year in college I realized that archaeologists would starve if there weren't big grants from National Geo. And so, I putter with Ohio archaeology. I find all areas of prehistory fascinating. Puma
 

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I think if you put anything old in front of a history geek (which I'm) they will find it interesting.
 

Puma

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Old Stone Fort - Ohio

There's an interesting stone "fort" in Ohio that predates the first settlers in the area. The fort is small (14' square), tall enough that there was a loft, one door. The fort is constructed of hewn stone. On three sides of the fort there are slit windows that are tapered on the inside to allow an archer optional angles for shooting (very similar to European bailey castle construction). One of the suppositions as to the forts origin is Madoc ab Owain Gwynedd, a Prince of Wales who is said to have sailed west about 1170 (and supposedly ended up with the Modoc Indians out in the Dakotas).

The local historical society has a few items that have been found near the fort. One of them is a mariners compass, hand drawn and painted (?). The compass has a fleur de lis at the top, and interestingly has 90 degrees at both the East and West points. The center support for the needle is a four sided pyramid with tiny pieces of what may be pink coral set around the base. I haven't been able to find anything similar in researching. The fort is near the Tuscarawas River.

Has anyone else heard of anything similar, or of Madoc, or know anything about mariner's compasses? The fort would make a really interesting historical non-fiction or fiction work; but I wouldn't want to use it without being able to confirm more about it's origins. Puma
 

arrowqueen

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Yes, I find it all fascinating too.

Shame you're not here tonight. There's a programme on BBC2 that combines both writing and history: 'Mary Renault: Love and War in Ancient Greece.'
 

Puma

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Beautiful!

Thank you for showing us your castle (and town), Arrowqueen. It's beautiful. I'm jealous.

The doorway shown for the Tourist Information Center is constructed in the same manner as the slit windows I mentioned in the old stone fort here in Ohio (except the windows widen to the inside).

Thank you very much for your post. Puma
 

Puma

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Innkeeper - It looks like I struck a responsive chord. Thank you for the links to websites about Madoc. The first one mentioned that he might have been in Ohio.

As I mentioned, the stone fort is very near the Tuscarawas River which flows into the Muskingum River which flows to the Ohio at Marietta. The fort is up from the river a way and could very well have been built in the moat and bailey manner (the field between the fort and the river is now a cornfield so any evidence of a moat is long lost). The compass I mentioned was plowed up in the cornfield.

The only other supposition on the origin of the fort is d'Iberville, or some of his men; but it looks to me like they weren't in the area - and, the fort was called old when the land was settled in 1800 - d'Iberville wasn't that long before 1800.

It's an intriguing mystery. Puma
 

arrowqueen

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Yes, ours do too. The walls are about three feet thick.

What a fascinating story about Madoc. It's the first time I'd heard it. If you find out more, I'd love to hear it.

Great sites, Innkeeper. Cheers.
 

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Ancient history?

Ah yes, I like periods of time where one culture met another. Anything from 500AD back to 4000BC is very interesting.

Here in Japan you can see how a peaceful people who used their precious and scarce metals to make bronze for pouring and producing large, beautiful bells to hang in their villages became something quite different due to meeting migrants. The historians believe the bells were used for ceremonial purposes. This peaceful use of metal then changes slowly but definitely through 2000 years. The bells were actually ceremonially buried, I wonder if they were hidden to save the metal from violent use. First there are a few ceremonial spears and a few arrow heads but by 500 Ad we see bronze used only for weapons, many weapons and no bells except tiny ones on horses' bridles.

Otzi the iceman came to a nearby museum last year. What stunned me was that his clothes, weapons and backpack were superbly adapted for the mountains. His equipment was better in some respects than modern mountaineering gear. The arrow between his ribs showed that some things never change!

Oh to be an archaeologist! Interesting that we'd all like to be one. I went to school in England and the nearby city council was excavating the local castle. I worked at the dig for three summers. The castle wasn't as pretty as yours, Arrowqueen, for it was smashed to pieces during the Civil war by Roundheads and we found 17thC clay pipes and a spur, various other bits and pieces. What amazed me was the metres of soil we had to remove to get anywhere near the castle floor. I went on as a university student to spend my summers on emergency digs as a lowly scraper and carrier but loved it. Did a Knights Templar site and a Roman villa. Wasn't allowed to train as an archaeologist because then you needed Latin and Classical studies as well as history.

Did you know that many digs around the world these days fund themselves by taking keen amateurs who pay to be trained and pay a little each week as they work? It's a good holiday idea!

Lief Erikson and Brendan definitely reached America, there must have been others. I wonder who reached us and Oz before the official 1st finder, Abel Tasman. I'm sure East Indian tea clippers were storm driven and wrecked on our coastline and there were brave explorers through the ages.
 

Puma

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pdr - What are the Japanese arrowheads like in style, notched to tie on a shaft, triangular? I've done a lot of work with midwestern flint arrowheads and am curious about any similarities. (Again, interesting that different cultures used similar designs).

I'm jealous that you got to see Otzi. In my genealogical digging I discovered that one of my families came from the same area of the Alps (I discovered it just about the time Otzi was found - that was a thrill).

I've seen quite a few ads for going on archaeological (and paleontological) digs. It would be interesting. I spent time in New Mexico in a geology fieldwork class and was amazed to discover the ground in one area littered with pottery chards - and no one seemed to care about them.

I've always thought that the traditional discoverers and migrators to various places around the world aren't necessarily accurate. The ancients got around pretty well - who's to say the Phoenicians didn't get across the Atlantic or that the Norse might not have sailed down the coast of Africa. As far as Japan goes, I'll bet there was contact with the Pacific Island groups, New Zealand, etc. and some of the canoe type vessels the islanders made were exceptionally sea worthy. Very interesting world we live in! Puma
 

JenNipps

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Puma said:
Out of curiosity, how many people on this forum are interested in ancient history/archaeology? If you are interested in ancient history, do you have a specific area of interest?

How ancient?

I have a deep interest in the Celts and the beginnings/mythology surrounding Stonehenge, but I don't quite think that's what you're referring to. *s*
 

Puma

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Jen - Celts and Stonehenge definitely qualify as ancient history (which could also be called prehistory). The timeline for prehistoric time varies greatly around the globe. Puma
 

BardSkye

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My interest in history dates (pun intended) from long after my school years. In school our history teacher seemed to think the subject involved memorizing names and dates of uninteresting politicians, dates of when wars started and ended, but nothing really any older than 1800 and no details to flesh out those dust-dry statistics.

It was actually Gone With the Wind that got me interested in history. Though it could hardly qualify as a textbook, for the first time it showed me a different era rich in tiny details where there were actually ordinary people doing ordinary things... and I was hooked.

My WIP, which is currently shelved until I finish several other work-related projects that are taking all my free time, is combining characters from China, Persia and Palestine in about 4BC, so I've been trying to read up on those areas and cultures.
 

BardSkye

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Sounds like fun, huh? I did originally have the first page or so up in SYW but it disappeared during our last glitch.
 

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Stonehenge is Neolithic, and that's pretty darn ancient. And I've got to revise my Stonehenge FAQ with the Amesbury archer finds.

*Sigh*
 

JenNipps

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Medievalist said:
Stonehenge is Neolithic, and that's pretty darn ancient. And I've got to revise my Stonehenge FAQ with the Amesbury archer finds.

*Sigh*

With all the myths, legends, and general uncertainty surrounding Stonehenge, that's why I said I wasn't certain if it fit in with what Puma was intending with this discussion. *s*

(Anybody want to finish my work for me? Only 11 reports left.)
 

NeuroFizz

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Anyone interested in the Hohokam and the early history of what is now Arizona? Lots of gold to mine in that vein, but it seems to be resisting current prospecting, at least in terms of their sudden disappearance.
 
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