Schrodinger's Rapist and Hyperawareness

BunnyMaz

Ruining your porn since 1984
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 14, 2011
Messages
2,295
Reaction score
412
Age
42
So.

Been mulling over the whole thing in a recent thread where the subject was about rape, and mulling especially over the responses to my link to the Schrodinger's Rapist blog post. Those who haven't read it, it's really a pretty good post! It also ties in very well with Meet the Predators, which talks about the existence of rapists, who they are based on studies and how they operate. Oh, and this, too.

In the discussion, I posited that depicting rapists as monsters is part of the problem, and the reply I received was that the Schrodinger's Rapist attitude must therefore also be a part of the problem, as it treats all men as monsters.

I disagree, and I'm going to try to articulate why.

What is Schrodinger's Rapist?

Most people, when they leave their car, will lock it. They will roll up the windows, make sure any potentially tempting valuables are hidden under the seat or in the glove compartment, they may or may not attach something to the steering wheel, and will lock the car when they exit it.

That doesn't mean they think everyone is a car thief just waiting for the opportunity to strike. What it does mean is that most people recognise that at any time there is a chance, which may be smaller or larger depending on circumstances, that someone may be nearby who may break into their car.

Car crime is significantly less common than rape and sexual assault.

In the Meet the Predators blog post, studies are mentioned which indicate that in a population with an average age somewhere in the mid-twenties, that roughly 1 in 16 will openly admit to committing rape, who started raping in their late teens and have by that stage in their lives committed an average of 6 rapes each. These same rapists also admitted to lesser sexual assaults and violence, as well as more disturbing acts like sexual assault of children. They target friends, relatives or acquaintances the vast majority of the time, and in the rare times they target strangers they almost never use overt violence or threats of violence.

Studies have shown that between 1-in-6 and 1-in-3 women will experience some form of sexual assault or sexual violence in their lives, and that roughly 1-in-16 women will be raped. Depending on which study you read, of course.

At the same time, we live in a society where rape victims are overwhelmingly treated as being partially or wholly responsible for being attacked. This can be everything from people stating a person couldn't possibly have been really raped because they were old, or fat, or otherwise not conventionally attractive, to positing that a child was somehow responsible for her own gang rape, and that the rape accusation is going to ruin the lives of her rapists.

It is normal that pretty much any time a woman admits publicly to having been assaulted, she will be questioned. Why were you walking home alone? Why did you let the electrician enter your home? Why did you take the bus at night? Why did you get into that taxi alone? Why were you dressed that way? Why were you drinking alcohol at that party? What did you say to him? Did you say no? Did you say no forcefully enough? Did you fight back? Did you run?

There is pretty much no circumstance a woman can be in when she is raped, that will not include things people will question. As a whole, we are overwhelmingly taught from a young age that we are responsible for protecting ourselves from predators.

At the same time, we also learn from a young age that men who notice us may or may not turn nasty if they don't like how we respond. I know I'm not the only woman who has had "Smile, lovely." or "Hey girl! Hey pretty girl!" or "Nice tits!" or "PHWOOAR!" Turn into "Fuck you, bitch!" "You cunt I want to talk to you!" "You're just a fat lesbo slag!" "How would you like me to get my black friend to rape you?!" (actual thing I was told by a 14 year old earlier this year walking home) if we don't respond, or don't respond nicely enough, or respond but politely decline their interest. And I'm not the only one who has had seemingly nice men grab me when I'm alone on public transport, or masturbate at me, or try to manoeuvre me into a concealed space during conversation, or otherwise go from banal to threatening. It happens, and usually you don't know about it until they make some overt move against you.

Rapists do not have their crimes tattooed on their foreheads. They do not walk around drooling and sweating and breathing heavily, rubbing their palms against their thighs every time they see a potential target. They do not creep up behind strangers and lick their necks. They, as a whole, act just like everyone else.

So.

Rapists represent 1 in 16 of the population, are repeat offenders and predatory in their tactics, and are outwardly no different to anyone else. Society as a whole judges and interrogates rape victims and sexual assault victims, and tends to place partial or entire blame on them.

The risk of assuming a person - any person, whether they are a complete stranger or someone you've known for years - to be safe carries a high cost. It is incredibly offensive to me that there are people who think women are being unkind, or judgemental, or "part of the problem", when they take precautions to protect themselves, simply because those precautions might mean they silently, without telling you or acting in an offensive way towards you, analyse you as a potential threat.

When you (general you) demand or expect that women should compromise their own comfort and safety in order to avoid offending you, you are asking that they put themselves at risk for you. You are asking for the same things that predators ask for. Of the three links I posted above, you might take note of this quote from the last one.

I can’t lay my hands on the link at the moment, but the emerging empirical research is that guys who admit in anonymous surveys that they commit acts which meet the legal definition of rape in most places select targets through a process of testing boundaries. So men who violate a woman’s boundaries are mimicking the targeting behavior of a rapist. Because it’s so high-stakes for women, they are much more aware of this then most men. If a predatory animal is behaving towards you in a way that you know means it’s trying to figure out if you’re prey, you get scared and go into a defensive mode. That’s just how it is.
And the worst thing is that chances are, women have judged you to be a risk before, and you never knew it. You will almost certainly never know it, because we aren't going to pepper-spray you in the face and run screaming just because you got on the bus, or said hello. At worst, we might quietly remove ourselves from the situation.

*If this seems shocking or surprising to you, consider that you might have fur, and that Being Cold hasn't formed the background radiation of your life.
 
Last edited:

BunnyMaz

Ruining your porn since 1984
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 14, 2011
Messages
2,295
Reaction score
412
Age
42
Thank you! If anyone else has any handy links about the subject, it'd be great to add them here. :D
 

MacAllister

Tired and worried.
El Jefe
Administrator
Super Moderator
Moderator
Kind Benefactor
VPX
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 11, 2005
Messages
22,039
Reaction score
10,839
Location
Out on a limb
Website
macallisterstone.com
+1
So excellent, in fact, that I've put a copy of it in the Newbie's Guide to AW.

Also adding a link to the "Yes means Yes" blog -- where they repeatedly make the excellent point that "No" should be the default, but by behaving as if and making laws whereby saying "no" is central and necessary to the definition of sexual assault, as a culture we treat women as if "Yes" is then the default.

And that's screwed up.
 
Last edited:

Cranky

Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Aug 26, 2007
Messages
14,945
Reaction score
8,145
It *is* a very good post, Bunny. :) I can't seem to find any links that aren't a little too academic for my tastes, frankly, or worse, we've got Wiki. But if I come across any (I'll keep looking), I'll happily add them.

Thanks.
 

regdog

The Scavengers
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Apr 27, 2008
Messages
58,074
Reaction score
21,023
Location
She/Her
Fantastic post!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm glad it's part of our Newbie Guide :)
 

fireluxlou

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jan 17, 2011
Messages
2,089
Reaction score
283
This is great and what many people need to know.
 

Cranky

Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Aug 26, 2007
Messages
14,945
Reaction score
8,145
After reading through Meet The Predators, I found this link, too, which sort of helps explain why the concept of Schrodinger's Rapist even exists. I think. I'm not exactly 100% articulate today. In any event, I think it's interesting reading in it's own right, enough to single it out, anyway.

For those who don't want to follow the link, it's another one in the vein of what Mac posted, about legal consent and what that means -- or, rather, what it *should* mean.
 

jjdebenedictis

is watching you via her avatar
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jun 25, 2010
Messages
7,063
Reaction score
1,643
:nothing

Ditto! Wonderful, eloquent post.
 

slcboston

Pasture-ized
Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Dec 1, 2007
Messages
50,326
Reaction score
29,066
Location
Second Star To The Right
As the father of a girl who is all too quickly growing up, I am constantly discovering things about the way society treats women (and girls) that appall me. Things that somehow, as a guy - and a guy who thought he was reasonably aware of this stuff - I did not know before.

While this didn't exactly help with the being appalled aspect... this backlash against women taking sensible measures was something I wasn't aware of.

So thank you. (And a thanks to Mac for Tweeting it and making me aware of it in the first place.)
 

MacAllister

Tired and worried.
El Jefe
Administrator
Super Moderator
Moderator
Kind Benefactor
VPX
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 11, 2005
Messages
22,039
Reaction score
10,839
Location
Out on a limb
Website
macallisterstone.com
RobJ, you're absolutely entitled to your opinion, of course.

On the other hand, I'm the one who usually gets to deal with members (almost inevitably guys) who fixate on someone, keep sending highly sexualized PMs and just won't leave the object of fixation alone.

The other mods and I are the ones who get to explain that "No, she doesn't owe you her time, attention, energy, or an answer. No, she doesn't at least have to read what you've said. Yes, she can put you on ignore -- that's not up to you, that's up to her..." over and over again.

When a mod deletes a rape "joke" I'm usually the one who deals with the backlash of "Jeez, it's just a joke, lighten up why don't you, you humorless bitch/cunt/dyke/whore."

So from MY perspective, it's an excellent post to have in the Newbie Guide, and as part of our board culture.
 

little_e

Trust: that most precious coin.
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 29, 2012
Messages
2,741
Reaction score
508
Location
USA
Most rapes in the US actually are prison rapes--male on male.

"The Justice Department now seems to be saying that prison rape accounted for the majority of all rapes committed in the US in 2008, likely making the United States the first country in the history of the world to count more rapes for men than for women."

"After asking around, and performing some calculations, the Justice Department came up with a new number: 216,000. That’s 216,000 victims, not instances. These victims are often assaulted multiple times over the course of the year."

http://nplusonemag.com/raise-the-crime-rate
 

little_e

Trust: that most precious coin.
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 29, 2012
Messages
2,741
Reaction score
508
Location
USA
It's a pretty horrific article, actually.
 

backslashbaby

~~~~*~~~~
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 12, 2009
Messages
12,635
Reaction score
1,605
Location
NC
As a woman, I am so glad to see newbies being made aware that sexist BS that is considered funny or normal is not allowed here. I see it a lot like letting folks know that racist 'jokes' won't be welcomed, etc.

I have gotten into a couple of minor tiffs on here about certain disability ones that must seem really out there that I'd point out or 'worry' about. Seriously, it all can be so ingrained that folks do need it pointed out that their behavior isn't always welcomed, even if it is unfortunately pretty normal :(
 

BunnyMaz

Ruining your porn since 1984
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 14, 2011
Messages
2,295
Reaction score
412
Age
42
That IS horrific.

While I will say that I've read some articles about that and that there seems to be some debate as to whether the numbers actually add up to more male-on-male rapes per year in the USA than male-on-female or other, that seems besides the point. (warning for problematic language in that article - which seems to imply that only MRAs care about the prison rape statistics. That is wrong. The math in the article is worth reading, though).

Because rape is horrific. And the cultural acceptance and expectation of prison rape, and the shockingly high frequency with which it occurs, is utterly horrifying.

I can suggest solutions and action to take regarding the society-wide male-on-female rape incidents, but I have no idea what to suggest for solutions to the male-on-male rape issues. Any suggestions, guys?
 
Last edited:

little_e

Trust: that most precious coin.
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 29, 2012
Messages
2,741
Reaction score
508
Location
USA
Our culture's acceptance of violence, period, is pretty awful.
 

BunnyMaz

Ruining your porn since 1984
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 14, 2011
Messages
2,295
Reaction score
412
Age
42
Indeed.

I worry about my little country across the pond here, too. Apparently we don't actually know whether prison rape in the UK is as prevalent as in the US. Because statistics on it are not collected.

And that is just shocking to me.
 

Cranky

Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Aug 26, 2007
Messages
14,945
Reaction score
8,145
I don't know if anyone else here has read it, but you've all probably heard of The Gift of Fear, by Gavin DeBecker. I read this in my early twenties, and it scared the shit out of me. OTOH, I felt weirdly empowered by it, and from that day forward, I stopped giving a damn if the strange man trying to chat me up in a bar thought I was rude if I didn't want to talk to him, let him buy me a drink, or give me a ride home. Realizing that my safety was more important than his hurt feelings was life-changing, it really was.

So much so that I've taught the very same thing to my own sons, and will teach it to my daughter, too.
 

little_e

Trust: that most precious coin.
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 29, 2012
Messages
2,741
Reaction score
508
Location
USA
You would think that prisons would be places for controlling behavior and preventing crime. Instead they're just black holes for tossing in and destroying society's "trash". The humanity is just stripped away.

My dad recently got a job related to preventing/tracing human trackers over the US/Mexico border. "According to the CIA, more than 1,000,000 people are enslaved in the US today." Most of those slaves are women and children.

The crimes against them don't get counted in the official rape statistics, of course.

"In its 400 years, the transatlantic slave trade is estimated to have shipped up to 12 million Africans to various colonies in the West. Free the Slaves estimates that the number of people in slavery today is at least 27 million." http://matadornetwork.com/change/10-shocking-facts-about-global-slavery-in-2008/
The Civil War was fought over 4 million slaves.
 

little_e

Trust: that most precious coin.
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 29, 2012
Messages
2,741
Reaction score
508
Location
USA
I am a great big ball of funshine!
 

FabricatedParadise

Can be bribed with circus peanuts
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Oct 22, 2010
Messages
2,485
Reaction score
1,267
Location
In a house with lots of books
I stopped giving a damn if the strange man trying to chat me up in a bar thought I was rude if I didn't want to talk to him, let him buy me a drink, or give me a ride home. Realizing that my safety was more important than his hurt feelings was life-changing, it really was.

So much so that I've taught the very same thing to my own sons, and will teach it to my daughter, too.


This. So much this.

And there have been times where I KNOW, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that speaking up saved my butt. Like the night a guy tried to follow me out of a crowded bar to my car, even though I'd done nothing to make him think I was interested and had in fact told him I was married (which was a lie at the time). I stopped half way to the door and told him flat out to stop following me that he was being creepy. Then I stood my ground, didn't budge until he walked away.

He, on the other hand, seemed genuinely surprised that I thought he was being creepy.

My kids will always know that I want them to put their safety over someone else's feelings. Every time.