help me regroup

tko · Aug 15, 2011

Not sure the best place to post this. I took an extra 4 months to polish my novel and query letter, waiting until response to the query were positive, and people indicated the 1st 10 pages would make them read further. Not only did I list the query here (many time), but also a few other places, the feedback seems pretty positive.

However, out of my first 30 inquiries, I received 15 quick rejections (one in 3 minutes), and 15 no reply's in the first 3 weeks. Not a hint of any interest.

Now I'm trying to troubleshoot this with very little clues. My query isn't going to get that much better (not after 6 months of work), neither are my opening pages. I can certainly accept I'm not the greatest writer, but I've seen worse. Not signing w/a publisher was always a possibility, but not getting a single request for a partial was something I hadn't really considered.

It's possible that by making a thriller/suspense that was a little out of the box I've sealed my fate. Despite lip service to the contrary, agents (or publishers, the same thing) may not want anything that doesn't fit into a neat category, and just don't want to take any chances.

If you were me, how would you troubleshoot this? (keeping in mind I've probably worn out the Query Hell Forum

and done everything I know to make it as good as possible).

Should I rewrite the query to make it sound more conventional, and minimize the unique elements? Should I wait till end of summer is over? Should I pay some agent to review the query? Should I throw the query away and use something with more voice, more unique?

thanks for any thoughts

Terie · Aug 15, 2011

Three weeks is nothing in publishing time. Publishing moves at a glacial pace.

Old Hack · Aug 15, 2011

I've not read any of your work so my comments are given cold (and are heartless--forgive me). But two things come to mind.

1) Three months and you'd be ready to nudge. But three weeks? Nothing.

2) While you're waiting, in the words of Uncle Jim, write a new and better book.

Keep the faith.

Tromboli · Aug 15, 2011

I agree. Be a little more patient. Stop the negative thoughts.

But if this persists you might consider the idea that this isn't the one. Are you working on your next work? You should be. You're never done in the writing world. You never have to give up completely. And even if you do end up shelving this novel, if you get some more luck with another you can pull this one down and publish it then.

But, even that isn't something you need to worry about now. Take your time and take it one step at a time.

tko · Aug 15, 2011

well

I agree 3 weeks isn't much time. And if I had one request for a partial I'd be fine. Maybe the more direct question is whether I keep going with the same query? How do you know when a query isn't doing what you want - versus it just being to early? That's my immediate concern. I don't want to throw out a good query that's been honed, but it would be foolish to blow chances if it's just not working.

Lucy · Aug 15, 2011

You asked if you should pay some agent to review the query. The answer is no. Any agent who would accept payment for that is not an agent you want to be in business with. Three weeks is nothing. Chill.

I haven't read your query but broadly states, yes, you should definitely try to craft it so that it fits into a neat category. Pick a shelf from Barnes & Noble and don't be creative like "supernatural thriller romance" or whatever. Pick one.

There is no reason to wait until the end of summer.

Also I've been saying it a lot lately but if this is your first book and you really are getting no response or just rejections galore, consider that this might be your "learning novel", and move on. But whatever you do, be patient, don't look for shortcuts, and focus on the writing.

leahzero · Aug 15, 2011

Like everyone's saying, three weeks is far too early to judge.

I queried a literary thriller/suspense/horror genre-bender and had similar problems. Make sure you research the agents you're querying thoroughly. "Thriller" is a very broad, vague category. I actually had one thriller-repping agent reject me with a curt note that said she "doesn't represent SF." That's nice--my book isn't SF.

Clearly genre labels can mean different things to different people, agents included. Unless you write strict categorical genre fiction, they're more a marketing tool than anything.

I got better results choosing agents based on their blogs, interviews, and books they'd repped and sold.

Try finding books that are similar to yours and query the agents who repped them.

I haven't read your query so I don't know if there's a problem there.

wheelwriter · Aug 15, 2011

tko said:
If you were me, how would you troubleshoot this? (keeping in mind I've probably worn out the Query Hell Forum

and done everything I know to make it as good as possible).

Should I rewrite the query to make it sound more conventional, and minimize the unique elements?
thanks for any thoughts

I don't think you wore out the QLH forum, but I think some concerns were raised there about your query letter. Concerns that might have been a little difficult for you to hear. I don't think you should minimize the unique elements of your book, but I do think the query letter needs to be easily understandable. It's possible you are querying something very different than the query letter I saw in QLH, and if so, I may be totally off base. Either way, good luck.

Lucy · Aug 15, 2011

TKO, I just read your query. It's the query. Keep working on it, you'll get it.

Edited to add: For what it's worth, you do seem defensive about your work on the Query forums. Just something to think about.

Ctairo · Aug 15, 2011

Looking at the query and the sample you posted, you've got a readability issue. Which means you have several options:

Keep going because your writing is as good as you can make it.
Let the novel and query sit for a bit and return to them with fresh eyes at some point in the future.
Listen to the crits. If multiple people are telling you the same thing, you may need to pay attention.

A unique story has to be told in a way that's accessible. Figure out how to give readers that point of access.

I understand you want to remain true to your vision. The problem with vision is you have to cultivate an audience. You may be willing to do that kind of work. An agent won't.

tko · Aug 16, 2011

aha, some questions

How many agents did you find in your genre?

I know it sounds like I've been panicking early. But there is a reason. What I did sounds closest to what you did. I went through most of the 250 some odd agents listed on query tracker. I went to every one of their web sites and cherry picked agents who had actual sales in novels that seemed to be in the same genre and style. I also went through the thrillerfest agent-in-attendance list, and Bill's list of thriller agents. I rejected any agents who said they rep'ed thriller, but only had children or romance stories listed. That gave me about 60 hard core thriller agents (yes, I can probably find more, that was my 1st effort.) These are agents where I can easily personalize the novel, because I read many of the novels they've sold.

Right now I'm halfway though that list. Not a hint of interest.

I don't get the wait-another-few months part. The agents are responding very quickly. Minutes, a few hours, days. I'm guessing 70% will respond in under 3 days. Maybe 20% will never respond. That mean's 90% of the action has already happened. It's not like I have partials or fulls that might take them a month to respond to!

leahzero said:
Like everyone's saying, three weeks is far too early to judge.

I queried a literary thriller/suspense/horror genre-bender and had similar problems. Make sure you research the agents you're querying thoroughly. "Thriller" is a very broad, vague category. I actually had one thriller-repping agent reject me with a curt note that said she "doesn't represent SF." That's nice--my book isn't SF. Clearly genre labels can mean different things to different people, agents included. Unless you write strict categorical genre fiction, they're more a marketing tool than anything.

I got better results choosing agents based on their blogs, interviews, and books they'd repped and sold.

Try finding books that are similar to yours and query the agents who repped them.

I haven't read your query so I don't know if there's a problem there.

Ctairo · Aug 16, 2011

You're panicking early. Relax. There are potential reasons why there's been no interest - and they're outlined in this thread.

Rather than assuming you're doing as others have done and not getting the same result, you may have to own you're not doing the same things in the same way.

Also, I understand the frustration re: the non-responders. But working yourself up about it won't change anything. If you want to vent, maybe let loose here: http://absolutewrite.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=28

kenpochick · Aug 16, 2011

I just looked over at QLH and I would guess it's your query. Unless you have a new version the one that is over there is confusing and fragmented. The danger is going to be that agents will assume that if your query is confusing and fragmented, that your novel is as well. I would hold off on querying, revise and try again. Focus on who your characters are and what must they overcome.

Hbooks · Aug 16, 2011

TKO, I think your novel has an interesting premise and it caught my eye back in QLH. However, (and I mean this as gently as possible), I think the fact that your query isn't quite at 100% may not be helping to put your best foot forward with selling your novel. Were I you, I might consider thoroughly reworking the query keeping in mind points that multiple people touched upon, then send out another ten queries to see if you get any bites.

alias octavia · Aug 17, 2011

I think you have reason to be concerned. 30 queries in 3 weeks with no requests means that either your query or your sample pages are not grabbing the agent's attention. If it were me, I would rework my material before sending out more queries. I did look at your various query threads in SYW and felt you got some good advice on how to improve your query. Given your response rate, you might want to revisit some of those comments.

Also, I think a 20% no response rate is actually very low. I've been querying my second book for a few months now and the actual no response rate is more like 35%. The average user on QT has a 7-8% request rate, 38% no response and the rest are rejections. Just an FYI.

tko · Aug 17, 2011

are you sure?

I've never rejected help with my query or my writing.

I have objected for being told I didn't know what I was talking about. By one person.

You can call Michael Jordan a bad writer. You can't call him a bad basketball player.

There is a difference.

alias octavia · Aug 17, 2011

Whenever I get a critique I take what resonates with me and pass on things that feel off-base. But when I start to see evidence that my initial pass at a piece of writing is failing, for one reason or another, I take another look at prior comments to see if they can help riddle out a new approach.

I noticed that a number of people pointed out that the fragmented opening of your query was confusing. Yet each new version of your query kept this opening line. If you haven't already addressed that issue, it might be worth revisiting as you try to rework your query.

I wish you the best of luck.

Toothpaste · Aug 17, 2011

I read your query, and I must admit I didn't understand it (especially the opening bit - I didn't know to what the numbers were referring and how someone could steal emotions). Therefore I think that's good news! It means it's your query that's causing the rejection, not your story. Why is this good news? You only need to fix the query, not the entire book.

Now I notice your thread in QLH was locked for a while because it went off on a bit of a tangent. If and when it is unlocked, I'd advise you to ignore the debate of whether or not you are qualified to write the book, and just try to make the query make sense to the layman reading it. Remember, we have no idea what your story is about before we start to read, and we need to have a really good sense really quickly.

I think it's totally doable, and it's a far easier solution than having to work on the novel itself. Queries are hard. And can take a while to master. And that's okay.

ETA: Ha! Cross posted with alias.

Yes exactly, that first bit needs to be changed. A lot of people have said as much, and that should be a sign. Now you don't have to take it out, or change it completely, just make it a little clearer to what the numbers refer etc. It's about minor changes making a major difference.

AshRose · Aug 22, 2011

I see a lot of people saying "Work on your next novel." Does anyone else have an issue with doing this? I know that me personally I can't work on anything else knowing the best thing I've written can't get representation. I'm sure some of you will say "It's the best thing you're written so far," which is true, but I would have no inspiration or motivation to work on anything else knowing this. I hope I'm not the only one who feels this way, and no I haven't given up...yet.

help me regroup

tko

just thanks fore everything

Terie

Writer is as Writer does

Old Hack

Such a nasty woman

Tromboli

Hopelessly Hopeful

tko

just thanks fore everything

Lucy

sky with diamonds

leahzero

The colors! THE COLORS!

wheelwriter

Not a runner, running.

Lucy

sky with diamonds

Ctairo

Why Isn't IGNORE Available in RL?

tko

just thanks fore everything

Ctairo

Why Isn't IGNORE Available in RL?

kenpochick

I should be writing, not on AW.:-)

Hbooks

alias octavia

smooshed

tko

just thanks fore everything

alias octavia

smooshed

Toothpaste

THE RECKLESS RESCUE is out now!

AshRose

Unofficial Expert on Angels