Can this personal rejection help me improve my story?

The_Red_Wing · May 15, 2011

"We appreciate the opportunity to read your work, but we will not be publishing (title). We wish you luck placing it elsewhere.

There was a lot that we liked about this piece. The voice felt authentic, and many of the details rang true. Ultimately, though, those details didn't have clear consequence for the narrative, and we found the story's momentum and tension lacking. What's at stake for (main character) in choosing a school? What does he really want?

We hope those comments are helpful. Thanks very much for your interest in (Magazine)!"

At first I was happy because I thought it would point out weaknesses in my story. But then, when I re-read the rejection, I realized it wasn't very specific. It says the "details didn't have clear consequence"....well, which details? They didn't say.

So I'm not really sure what to do with this. Have you ever changed/improved your short story based on comments like this? They also found the "momentum/tension lacking", but I don't know what to do about that, either. So I ended up being pretty disappointed because there's not much to take away.

zanzjan · May 15, 2011

Honestly, that's a lot more feedback than usually comes with rejections. It does seem like they're trying to point out what did and didn't work for them without prescribing specific fixes for the things that didn't, and in some ways that's a plus because it's easy to fall into the trap of fixing the story the way someone else thinks it should be, rather than the way you think it should be.

So all in all, I'd count that a more-helpful-than-most rejection.

-Suzanne, my $.02

The_Red_Wing · May 15, 2011

zanzjan said:
Honestly, that's a lot more feedback than usually comes with rejections. It does seem like they're trying to point out what did and didn't work for them without prescribing specific fixes for the things that didn't, and in some ways that's a plus because it's easy to fall into the trap of fixing the story the way someone else thinks it should be, rather than the way you think it should be.

So all in all, I'd count that a more-helpful-than-most rejection.

-Suzanne, my $.02

I've sent this same story to a few other places...I've gotten 3 rejections already, but 2 of those, including this one, came with some "personal" comments. But since it's out for submission at a few places, should I just sit on it and wait before changing anything? If I can figure out exactly what to change, that is.

mccardey · May 15, 2011

The_Red_Wing said:
So I'm not really sure what to do with this....
I ended up being pretty disappointed because there's not much to take away.

You might be judging it too quickly. They say positive things about your writing in general and name a couple of areas in this work that might profit from tightening up - that's a pretty good response

Without knowing the work, we can't say which bits they're targetting, but I'll bet if you were to go back to read it in a couple of weeks with this rejection beside you as a guide, you might hone in on them (unless their response is completely inaccurate, of course).

It's good rejection though, if there is such a thing. They like your writing, they liked your voice - they just felt there was technical work still to be done. I think you could celebrate that! (I'm a big believer in celebrating stuff...

)

thothguard51 · May 15, 2011

Just throwing a few thoughts out here, but to me, the comments feel fairly pointed, especially the part about asking what the character wants in choosing a school.

As writers, we know most of the time what is involved and what the outcome is going to be. We understand our characters motives and inner feelings, but many times, we forget to give the readers enough information so they can feel the details as well.

If the momentum lacks, perhaps its because there are too many details, which can slow the progression of a story down.

When I read a story, the clock starts ticking, it should never come to a stop or go backwards... IMHO.

mccardey · May 15, 2011

thothguard51 said:
As writers, we know most of the time what is involved and what the outcome is going to be. We understand our characters motives and inner feelings, but many times, we forget to give the readers enough information so they can feel the details as well...

Oh, lord - have you been talking to my betas?

scope · May 15, 2011

So I'm not really sure what to do with this. Have you ever changed/improved your short story based on comments like this? They also found the "momentum/tension lacking" said:
Disappointed? Not much to take away? For a rejection, consider yourself lucky to have received as much feedback as you did. Rarely do you get this much. That doesn't mean you have to agree - that's up to you - but you really can't expect an agent who is not going to rep you to be more explicit. She's done you a favor by suggesting as much as she did.

scope · May 15, 2011

The_Red_Wing said:
I've sent this same story to a few other places...I've gotten 3 rejections already, but 2 of those, including this one, came with some "personal" comments. But since it's out for submission at a few places, should I just sit on it and wait before changing anything? If I can figure out exactly what to change, that is.

Assuming you think some revisions are in order, start making them, but don't send anying new to the agents to whom you have submitted. Agents expect writers to send them polished, finished material.

Polenth · May 16, 2011

The rejection seemed pretty specific to me. They think there are too many details slowing down the stories (in other words, cut some to make it faster paced). And that there isn't enough tension (either the motivation or the obstacles aren't clear enough).

Whether they're right is another matter. Only you can decide that. But it's about average in detail for a personal rejection.

scope said:
Assuming you think some revisions are in order, start making them, but don't send anying new to the agents to whom you have submitted. Agents expect writers to send them polished, finished material.

Individual shorts don't go to agents and short story writers are rarely represented. The basic principle of polishing work still applies, but the submission system is different to novels.

AlwaysJuly · May 16, 2011

I think this can help you improve your story. Why not use the issues they gave you as a sort of checklist to compare your story against? Read through it again while asking yourself "What does this detail add to the story?" and "What's the consequence?" and "Does this add to the tension of the piece?" Maybe your answers will point towards not making any revisions if the piece works for you as-is - and that's OK - but I do think their comments give you some very solid things to consider as you review your piece and decide if further revisions are appropriate.

ardenbird · May 16, 2011

I've rewritten stories on much less

I'd say this is a great rejection, with that feedback.

I think you may be concentrating on the vague part ("these details") and losing the specific part -- what is at state in choosing a school? what the character really want? I suggest you answer these to yourself, then go back and see if they're actually obvious in the story. Which phrases convey it? Try to step outside yourself and see if they would convey if you didn't know anything else... As said above, knowing so much more as writers about the character can make it hard to notice we haven't passed on the crucial information to the readers.

The_Red_Wing · May 16, 2011

So is it okay to rewrite this story and re-submit to the same journal that made these comments? Or do I just chalk it up as a loss and hope someone else takes it?

thewakingself · May 16, 2011

The_Red_Wing said:
So is it okay to rewrite this story and re-submit to the same journal that made these comments? Or do I just chalk it up as a loss and hope someone else takes it?

That doesn't look like a "revise and resubmit" to me.

From what I understand, it's considered bad form to R&R a story that was rejected unless specifically asked to do so by the editor. It's probably best you submit this or the new version elsewhere, and send this market something you haven't sent them before. You might be close to finding a home for it if you're getting this kind of in-depth feedback. Good luck!

MatthewWuertz · May 16, 2011

The_Red_Wing said:
So is it okay to rewrite this story and re-submit to the same journal that made these comments? Or do I just chalk it up as a loss and hope someone else takes it?

It didn't sound like a rewrite request to me. I've had five or so rewrite requests so far from various magazines, and they were all very blatant about inviting me to resubmit. I've also had personal rejections like this, and they were not invitations for submitting rewrites.

One mistake I've made in the past is that I would take personal rejections and just run with whatever advice was offered. With one story, I made changes because an editor complained about one aspect. Then, a second editor complained about another aspect that only existed because of my edits I did to address the first editor. All of which seemed to be a pointless exercise because no one was asking for rewrites. They were simply pointing out what didn't work for them. I agree with other posters that if you really do agree with the comments, go ahead and make changes. But if you think, "That doesn't make much sense" or, "I disagree," then don't change anything. The next editor may love it. My only caveat would be if you see a recurring theme among multiple editors. That usually indicates a problem.

Luis · May 18, 2011

You need a writer's critique group to read your story. Tell them what the editor wrote in the rejection letter and ask them for an opinion. Most people will be honest and they'll even tell you how you might fix it. One excallent site is Zoetrope.com.

After you fix your story re-submit it. if the editor is open minded they will publish it. What do you have to lose?

Good luck,

Luis
http://writerinwind.blogspot.com

Izz · May 18, 2011

Luis said:
After you fix your story re-submit it. if the editor is open minded they will publish it. What do you have to lose?

I'm sorry, Luis, but this isn't good advice. For the great majority of markets, resubmitting an already rejected story will gain an automatic rejection.

The only exception to this that i can think of is Analog Science Fiction & Fact, where a personal rejection is an invitation to resubmit.

The_Red_Wing, unless an editor specifically asks you to resubmit the story after revising, then don't resubmit unless the story is unrecognizable to how it read previously. However, don't hesitate to send other stories to that venue.

As others have said, use what you feel is useful from the rejection and ignore what isn't.

Adam Israel · May 18, 2011

Personal rejections are like a double-edged sword; on one hand, an editor took the time to tell give you feedback as to why a story didn't work, giving you hope, but it's still a rejection unless they specifically ask you to resubmit that story.

I've gotten some great feedback from editors who rejected or asked that I resubmit a revised version, but more often than not the feedback comes down to the personal tastes of the editor. The only time I'll revise based on feedback from a rejection is if I've received similar notes from other editors or beta readers, or if it's specific enough that I see how I can apply it to fix a flaw.

Nod appreciatively, take what works for you, and ignore the rest.

TheMindKiller · May 19, 2011

The_Red_Wing said:
So is it okay to rewrite this story and re-submit to the same journal that made these comments? Or do I just chalk it up as a loss and hope someone else takes it?

I would take it as an opportunity to submit something else you've written. If they like your voice and your writing but just didn't like the details of that story, then maybe a different story with a different set of details and the same voice would work for them.

Luis · May 19, 2011

Wether you re-submit the story to the same publication or not.
Let a writer's critique group look at it first. You'll be happy you did.

Good luck,

Luis
http://writerinwind.blogspot.com

shelleyo · May 19, 2011

Getting some feedback may help clarify what the editor said, definitely. But don't resubmit it there or anywhere unless they specifically invite you to do so, or you'll look like an amateur. Nothing wrong with being an amateur at all this, everyone is once, but you don't want it to show.

Shelley

Stijn Hommes · May 22, 2011

I'd push those comments to my beta-readers to see if they can identify the comment's targets.

Ultimately, though, those details didn't have clear consequence for the narrative, and we found the story's momentum and tension lacking. What's at stake for (main character) in choosing a school? What does he really want?

To me it reads as if the editors believed the pace suffered from some unnecessary details and thought the stakes for the MC weren't clear. Without seeing the story I can't see whether I agree.

Personally, I'd wait before hearing back from the other ones you sent out before making any changes. Such comments are still a personal opinion and others might feel differently.

Jamesaritchie · May 22, 2011

This is good feedback, and a LOT to go on. But this was not a rewrite and resubmit. Do not do it. It has nothing to do with being open-minded. The editor does not want to see the story again, and what you have to lose by re-submitting it is the goodwill of this editor.

But the advice is a lot to go on. He tells you the problems he sees with the story, and they're common problems. Whether you follow them is up to you.

astonwest · May 23, 2011

Make sure your next story incorporates the improvements they're looking for (which was how my first short story publication took place), but as mentioned, don't re-submit this one to them.

Personally, I would only make the changes they suggest if your other submissions come back with rejections. The last thing you want to have happen is for someone to come back with an acceptance, and you're setting there wanting to send a new version to them...

A good reason that I don't sim-sub stories...

Can this personal rejection help me improve my story?

The_Red_Wing

zanzjan

killin' all teh werds

The_Red_Wing

mccardey

thothguard51

A Gentleman of a refined age...

mccardey

scope

Commonsensical Maverick

scope

Commonsensical Maverick

Polenth

Mushroom

AlwaysJuly

slugging through

ardenbird

The_Red_Wing

thewakingself

Plays with fire.

MatthewWuertz

shadow magic, FTW

Luis

Izz

Doing the Space Operatic

Adam Israel

Formerly known as StoneTable

TheMindKiller

Only I Will Remain

Luis

shelleyo

Just another face in a red jumpsuit

Stijn Hommes

Know what you write...

Jamesaritchie

astonwest

2 WIP? A glutton for punishment