Keeping foreign rights

Out of curiousity, did this other author have an agent?

Some publishers are refusing to take anything but world rights - and so then the author has to decide whether they can get enough from the world rights deal to make it worth it to give up the foreign rights. Or whether they are going to turn down the deal to hold out for maybe another publisher who won't demand world rights.

Of course, everything is negotiable, but there are some that are holding the line pretty hard - world rights or no deal. Then the negotiations come down to money - ie, how much to give up world rights.

ETA: And some books really don't sell world rights - contemporary, realistic fiction set in the US is an especially hard sell. So, for some authors, getting more money for world rights might be the better deal. This, like most other topics in publishing, can't be talked about in absolutes - it almost always depends on the circumstance. That's why it is important to have a good agent, knowledgeable in these kinds of issues, to help guide you as to what is the best deal for your book.

~suki

rsullivan9597 said:

Moral of the story...don't sign a contract with Worldwide rights just because you're happy to get "a contract". By signing only English language rights you'll make more in the long run.

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The moral of YOUR story, perhaps. But your experience cannot be used as an example for all.

suki said:

ETA: And some books really don't sell world rights - contemporary, realistic fiction set in the US is an especially hard sell. So, for some authors, getting more money for world rights might be the better deal. This, like most other topics in publishing, can't be talked about in absolutes - it almost always depends on the circumstance. That's why it is important to have a good agent, knowledgeable in these kinds of issues, to help guide you as to what is the best deal for your book.

~suki

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As suki said, there is no "one way" for everyone. While there is a good world-wide market for certain genres (fantasy, for example), others rarely sell in foreign countries. The interest just isn't there for foreign language translation.


(this next bit isn't directed at rsullivan9597, but at any other writers reading this thread)

Foreign rights are something you want to discuss with your agent going into submission. Does your agent want to keep them, or sell them? It's important to know the strengths of your agent. Do they handle the foreign sales themselves? Who is their foreign rights co-agent and how much experience do they have in your genre?

One of the benefits of selling foreign rights to your publisher is that your advance will earn out faster. Every time your publisher sells translation rights to, say France or Germany, that money is put against your initial advance. And this is useful for books in genres that don't typically sell a lot of translations. It helps you earn out faster and start seeing royalties sooner.

Each case will be different, and it's important to know the pros and cons of all of your choices.

rsullivan9597 said:

Moral of the story...don't sign a contract with Worldwide rights just because you're happy to get "a contract". By signing only English language rights you'll make more in the long run.

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There's no point in a writer keeping rights they don't have the experience and contacts to sell on their own. For writers who do have the means to do it, it might make sense to try to retain them, but for writers who don't (which is the majority), it's pretty pointless.

If MarySue Author could never possibly in a bazillion years negotiate, say, the German rights, keeping them will earn her precisely nothing, whereas if the publisher does so she gets 50%.

100% of nothing is LESS THAN 50% of something.

Terie said:

There's no point in a writer keeping rights they don't have the experience and contacts to sell on their own. For writers who do have the means to do it, it might make sense to try to retain them, but for writers who don't (which is the majority), it's pretty pointless.

If MarySue Author could never possibly in a bazillion years negotiate, say, the German rights, keeping them will earn her precisely nothing, whereas if the publisher does so she gets 50%.

100% of nothing is LESS THAN 50% of something.

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This is good advice...applies to film as well. I have a sales agent friend (in film) who has been offered an extremely good amount for a new film he reps and the producers won't accept because they think they're giving away the keys to the kingdom whereas if they accepted it they'd take an immediate 300% return. It's a combo of greed and a sense of entitlement. These are not good traits in any author, filmmaker or human being.

He's a funny story for you all, when my first book came out about 5 years ago it was sold to a an american publisher, and the worldwide rights went with it for a nominal amount. But it worked out in my favour because the country I sold the most in was Ireland, where I'm from, but which was technically 'foreign'.

Some publishers do want world rights and add that consideration to the dollar amount they offer as an advance. Declining to give them world rights could also mean declining the entire contract - you have to decide what is in your best interests.

Also, fantasy sells really well in several other countries, but not all genres sell foreign rights. Like suki said, if you have a very American-centric story, you're not necessarily going to sell a lot of international rights.

So yes, foreign rights are awesome. But just because you sell them to your publisher doesn't mean that you shouldn't have signed. You have to weigh all your options and discuss with your agent.

Also, just because you sell foreign rights to your publisher doesn't necessarily mean that you won't make another dollar. It just means that for the period of time determined in your contract, the publisher has the right to go after foreign sales. You get a portion of whatever foreign sales they make, and you split that portion with the house. It's not signing away your rights forever.

rsullivan9597 said:

I can't comment on how "hard" a discussion it was. It seemed pretty easy as this was the first line in the sand she drew (2nd being multi-media rights) which many publishers are trying to "grab" as well. This was made crystal clear right after the offer was extended. The things we are having to "negotiate" is non-compete and reversion clauses. Those have been the parts of the contract that I'm focusing on.

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But this is for your contract. A non-compete is really finickity for you because of your husband's self-publishing ventures. Ditto the reversion clauses. There are other things that are far more important for other authors, and so saying it's "easy" to draw the line in the sand is unfair.

Harlequin, for example, is a terrific publisher of romance - they have amazing distribution, great cover art, and really promote their authors. They insist on world rights. If you won't give them world rights, they will likely turn the deal down (or so I have heard - Harlequin authors, please feel free to correct me!).

My point is that you are making this sound like a blanket statement, and it truly, truly is not. Every contract is different. Every publishing house has a different contract. You cannot look at one contract for your genre and assume that it is the same across the board for all houses, all genres. You just can't. If this was the case, we wouldn't need agents, right?

Irysangel said:

Every contract is different. Every publishing house has a different contract. You cannot look at one contract for your genre and assume that it is the same across the board for all houses, all genres. You just can't. If this was the case, we wouldn't need agents, right?

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This. Add to that every writer is different and every book is different.

Now, here's something else to consider.

Does your agent have the necessary contacts or ability to sell your work abroad? If they don't then selling world rights to the publisher is probably the best thing. But, if they do have those contacts and the ability to garner other, potentially better deals, abroad, then that might be the best route.

There are lots of things to consider either way.

rsullivan9597 said:

Well maybe my head is skewed because my agent is primarily for foreign rights - I think I 'lucked into' that situation but it has made me a boatload of money that I wouldn't have had because I probably would have "automatically" gone for world rights without pausing to consider whether it was worth selling just Enlish rights. My point in posting was to make other authors "think" about this before just signing a boilerplate which can end up taking a big cut from their pockets.

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It's not luck inasmuch as it's a number of factors. It's your agent's connections, your genre, the country, etc. Epic fantasy sells terrifically in Europe, for example, especially Germany. I write (among many things), small town contemporary romance. If it sells for a lot of money overseas, I'll be flat out surprised.

Your experience = all experiences for everyone.

If Orbit came to you and said "We want world rights" and your agent said no and you kept them and sold the rights elsewhere, that is terrific! Orbit is probably used to a lot of fantasy authors keeping their rights, and that's fine. But the same scenario with Harlequin? Would not fly.

Think of it like a job you are applying for. You get an amazing job offer at a nice building with lots of perks. Great 401k, a flexible schedule, free coffee (okay, this is a perk for me, heh). You tell your friend about this awesome job and they ask if you get paid sick time. You do not. Your friend says "Pfft. You shouldn't take that job then. Other jobs give you THREE weeks of paid sick time. Why would you take that job when they're obviously going to screw you out of your sick time?"

I feel like that's the conversation we're having here. You are encouraging people to push hard for something that, while a great benefit to have, might not even be on the table.

Foreign rights are lovely, yes, but they do not always magically appear. I have a friend that has made a small fortune on foreign rights for her urban fantasy. I have another friend that has also only made $500.00 total on foreign rights for her romance series. They both have great agents. It's terrific money, but it's not guaranteed money and we should not act like it's some terrible thing if someone takes a deal that involves world rights. Is it ideal? No, but the contract has to work for you personally.