Should I learn to draw or hire an artist

Question is, do you want to be an artist? Very few comics/graphic novels are written and illustrated by the same person - each is a very different talent. I spent a lot more time drawing than writing in my teens and early twenties, but I realised that whilst I was OK, I was never going to be that brilliant at it, so I switched to writing (conventional novels, not scripts for graphic novels). If you're just beginning at 17, maybe your heart isn't in it? If you want to be a published artist, you have to be really committed to it, not just a dabbler.

Also, at your age, I doubt you could afford to hire a decent artist, TBH. How about looking around for a budding artist to collaborate with? Lots of people are looking to break into the comics market...

Kizaru said:

But what is involved with working with an artist?

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Do you mean the actual collaboration or sharing of monies...presuming there are any?

If you think becoming a pro-level manga artists isn't difficult, I suspect you will find that isn't true.

Well, there are problems with both ways.

For one, all manga is different. Some work is very basic (say, Digi Charat at its most minimalist) but still has an underlying level of professionalism. The average manga artist could probably do a reasonable academic-level portrait or still life. I can draw a little, and I draw very cute manga girls, but I can't draw a car or a rocking chair or a television to save my life. I'd never make it as a professional manga artist.

Even if you do get the basics down, you have to compete with the serious talent. The work of Takayuki Yamaguchi is so incredibly detailed you have to wonder if the poor man gets any sleep at all. That's before you get into his storytelling, which is also incredible. There are lots like him in the manga industry.

On the other hand, if you look for an artist, there can be a lot of issues that crop up. A few years back, I was collaborating with an artist on a project and we did quite well. But once we started getting recognized for our efforts she thought I was getting more attention than her and in her mind it wasn't fair, because she thought she was doing more of the work than I was. (How true that is depends on whether you consider writing to be effort equal to illustration.) We had a huge falling out and I've sworn off working with artists since.

But, it's up to you. Both writing and illustration takes a huge amount of practice to get right, you may need to sit on your idea for a while before you can do anything about it.

Kizaru said:

I know it won't be easy. Nothing good is easy. I'm just wondering if it's worth trying or not.

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If you haven't been doing it for at least a couple of years, I'd say not.

Unless you're a Leonardo-level supahgenius, that's a bare minimum for basic competence - if you have good instincts.

If you've never drawn anything before, ever, I'd say "Don't even think about it."

PrincessTeacake said:

The work of Takayuki Yamaguchi is so incredibly detailed you have to wonder if the poor man gets any sleep at all. That's before you get into his storytelling, which is also incredible.

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I'll just add one addendum to that observation, in the interests of completely understanding the way Japanese comics differentiates from western comics - in the US and UK, titles are (generally) created by a penciller, an inker, and (if the title is in color) the pages will be finished by a colorist. Japanese titles have often been created in studio environments, due to the sheer number of pages required every year. The main characters, important objects and any special elements will normally be the work of the credited artist, while a number of other individuals will contribute elements of the background, logo's, lettering, effects, et cetera.

There are highly successful writer/artists... the European market, in particular, has produced plenty of really talented people - Moebius, Guido Crepax, Milo Manara, and Hugo Pratt amongst that number. They are noted for being able to complete every aspect of a title themselves, but their ability to do so should not be taken as evidence that it is either easy or necessarily desirable. Some of the best comics are collaborative efforts, and by throwing ideas back and forth you will likely come up with ideas which you would never have thought of on your own.

One quick question, which cuts straight to the heart of this - how long do you plan on studying character placement, composition, inking styles, and so on? If you want to have a finished product which you have a hope of selling, then the answer should probably be years rather than weeks or months. Simply reading a stack of comics, picking up the way the artist has indicated the physicality of the objects on the page, isn't going to help you any. That said, if the illustration style is deliberately simple - and if it fits the mood of the story - then it can work very well.

If you can look at something like Persepolis and say that you can achieve an equally consistent style, then you might be alright on your own. Not all manga has to look complex and detailed - both Doraemon and the early Tezuka Astro Boy strips were very simple in style.

... it's worth a try. What have you got to lose? DO NOT illustrate your comic though. Write it out and then when you pitch to publishers offer to illustrate it and include some samples: about 5 pages worth. Or don't even include samples and just say you have some to send if they'd be interested. If they really like your comic and they find your art at least adequate they might be willing to allow you to do both. Of course you need to be flexible if they say no to the art and yes to the story. My two cents. G'luck.

it isn't a horrifyingly hard medium to learn.

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This actually made me gag.

Here I have highlighted SOME of the drawing elements in the links you provided. Since you have not posted any of your own work I cannot judge your 'talent' either way. I do not believe you need to be talented to learn to draw, only if you want to be wildly successful

link 1 panel 1.-- 1 point, foreshortened perspective of a character with two foreground characters using a circular composition.

link 1 large central panel -- 2 point, three quarter, foreshortened upshot of a character with a horizon line below the frame of reference in a triangular composition plus two foreground characters.

link 2 panel 2 -- 3 point perspective down shot with movement lines and special effects.

Entire 3rd link - Gradated tonal pattern on anatomically realistic imaginary monster in 2 point perspective. PLUS a panel with a two point down shot of a perspective-accurate explosion around foreshortened characters

This is a list of the 'basics of drawing' Just as writing requires verbs, adverbs, nouns, sentences, paragraphs, etc... drawing has it's own fundamentals.

Before colour:
Anatomy, perspective, gesture, weight, line quality, overlap, foreshortening, 1, 2, 3 point perspective, balance, unity, size, curvilinear perspective, orthographic perspective, form, figure drawing, composition, tonal pattern, Proportion, mood, atmosphere, texture, gradation, body types, cartooning, expression, hands and feet, reflections, shape, size, value- sorry if I forgot something
Plus colour:
Hue, reflected light, temperature, complementary/analogous colors, saturation, tint,

Then add mediums - traditional inking or computer inking? Digital painting or gouache / oils / acrylics / markers - what ever your into.



If you are willing to learn what all these mean and spend years studying them, then yes you should definitely learn how to draw.
If you want to buy a half a dozen learn to draw books and then post your uber l33t fan art on deviant art, hire someone.

As with all arts and crafts, the truly great creators make it look easy. That doesn't mean it IS easy.

Don't be fooled by apparent simplicity. Check out the Hyperbole and a Half blog. At a quick glance, the illustrations look like childish scribbles. But when you read the stories and really look at the illustrations, you begin to realise what a stunning talent (for both writing and illustrating) Allie Brosh has.

I have zero talent for drawing. (If it's possible to have talent in a negative number, that's what I have!) I bet I could draw things approximately like Allie's, but nothing I did would come CLOSE to conveying what her Hyperbole and a Half illustrations do. Mine would be dead lines on the page (or screen). Hers pop with life and story.

That's what skilled illustrators do: make their drawings come to life. When you're looking at the final page, it might look easy, but it just isn't.

Kizaru said:

...is it better to learn to draw or to hire an artist to draw for me? Feeback is appreciated!

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It depends what you want. Do you want to save money while maintaining complete control of the comic? If so, it's probably "better" to learn to draw it yourself. If time is an issue, it may be "better" to hire someone. Is this just for funzies, or do you want to be published? If the latter, it may be "better" to find someone with experience doing sequential works and knowledge of the comics industry.

Kizaru said:

Just looking at the manga I read in general, in my opinion, it isn't a horrifyingly hard medium to learn.

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This line made me twitch, because there's a difference between learning the medium and learning it well. Also, as BigWords mentioned, the manga industry and market are different in the East and West. For instance, the original english language (OEL) manga market used to be hot years back when Tokyopop was churning out books, but things have changed. I believe Viz and Yen currently accept OEL manga submissions, but I can't name a recent OEL title by either, and I think Yen does mostly YA adaptations now by in house artists.

Kizaru said:

I know it won't be easy. Nothing good is easy. I'm just wondering if it's worth trying or not.

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Is it worth learning to draw? Sure. Is it worth making a comic? Sure. Is it worth submitting it to publishers? Depending on your goals, it may be worth trying, but it might not be worth trying right now.

I know nothing about the business or creative process around graphic storytelling at all. But this is my general view on things:

At seventeen, *anything* is worth trying.

What do you want to do, and how long are you willing to work for it? Best advice I could give is "don't die wondering".

Good fortune to you.

Kizaru said:

Just looking at the manga I read in general, in my opinion, it isn't a horrifyingly hard medium to learn. Here are some links to highlight my point
http://mangastream.com/read/one_piece/39543275/5
http://mangastream.com/read/naruto/82033841/3
http://mangastream.com/read/claymore/67729021/3
I wouldn't consider this art "brilliant". It more or less is just enough to tell the story.

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Ah, just for a moment there I thought those samples were yours, I thought they were pretty good. Damn that right-to-left reading mode! Confuses me every time!

-Derek

I've been drawing since I was a small child, I'm now 30, and people regularly tell me my work isn't 'yet' publishable quality. I'm fairly certain it's not going to get substantially better after this many years, the main issue being that it looks good to me, I apparently can't see the problems other people see with it. I think that's a difference between having a natural aptitude for visual art and not having one. (I have a bit of aptitude for sculpture, a moderate amount for writing, but never had much for 2D art.)

...

Ditto to what Sunandshadow said. I'm 28, went to an art college, and have been drawing since I was a child(not so much anymore) and my drawing ability is only serviceable. Sure I could illustrate my own stories but I'd tear my hair out in the process and be disappointed by the results.

I say stick with your natural gift. If you get a really good artist to illustrate for you, you will be much happier with the results and visually it will probably be closer to what you imagine your story to be.

Kizaru said:

Thanks clonedbeef, that's what im going to do. It's just frustrating because ANYBODY can write a story and I really want mine to make it haha...don't we all?

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Anybody can write a story, draw a picture, play the piano, or any number of other things- The real question is - Should they?

Kizaru said:

Thanks clonedbeef, that's what im going to do. It's just frustrating because ANYBODY can write a story and I really want mine to make it haha...don't we all?

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Anybody can write a story, but few can write publishable ones. Anybody can draw illustrations, but few can draw publishable ones.

If you think writing publishable stories is easy, you're in for a big surprise.

You might want to think twice about insulting the writers here that way.

You didn't offend me since I knew exactly what you meant...and I agree.

I run into far more people who think they can write than those who think they can draw.

Hmm, interesting thread...

And it's getting me wondering about the why of any of this creative thing. My personal situation is this. I've been drawing and painting since I was a kid. I've been writing for a couple of years.

I decided I wanted to combine both talents and try my hand at a graphic novel. I had no prior experience with sequential art or of drawing people. I also had no prior experience with scriptwriting for comics which I understand is different from writing for the screen. So I'm currently learning about all those things.

I want to be good at what I'm choosing to do. I'm putting in the learning graft and I know what I come up with at first will probably be shit to experienced eyes. But, I'm still going to stick it out. Why? Well, why the hell not? I have a modicum of talent for art and writing so why not use them?

Why does anyone do anything creative? I guess for me if a person is hungry enough to want to create something and make it good to both themselves and to others, then absolutely go for it. But if a person is just getting into something because they think it's a cool thing to do or will make them money or looks easy compared to something else, then no, thats lazy. In that case, don't go for it. Hire yourself people who will put their effort and experience into the work to create something that is good. Thats worth the enjoyment of others.

Anyway, just my two bob's worth.

Good points all the way around.