Please define grey area between YA and Adult

What I think they mean by 'crossover' isn't a genre. I think they mean books that are marketed in one category but succeed in others. Like Twilight is crossover because it's published as YA but adults read it. Harry Potter is a crossover series because it's published for kids but teens and adults read it. To pull out a less popular example, "Ender's Game" is published as an adult book, but is wildly popular among kids and teens. Later on, the publisher released a YA edition of the book (and I think a MG edition as well?).

There isn't a magical 'gray area' genre. A book is sold as one genre or another, wherever a publisher thinks it will sell best, then I think it's up to fate whether it because a crossover success. If you aren't sure where it fits best, read more YA and adult novels

There's this bookstore I shop at that actually has a crossover section. I just had to step into this thread to say that, because I've never seen it before and I was wondering whether it was common. Anyone else seen a crossover section?

To answer the original question: OP, there's very very very little content that would make your book 'too edgy' for YA. Unless the characters are not YAs, the pacing is incredibly slow, the voice retrospective (as in Prep) then I doubt it can't be classified as YA.

I hate the term crossover because it's one of those things that nobody really knows the meaning/use of. Any book has potential for crossover. I also have to say, being both barely out of my teens and studying contemporary literature extensively, there's not a whole lot of difference in the content. The situations and ages are different, but the book can be just as literary and deep as a mainstream adult one, often more. Also, the age most people target seems to be higher than it actually should be. A lot of "upper YA" is more labeled that way for parent's sake than for the readers. The biggest difference, in my opinion, between adult and YA is that teens won't put up with some of the indulgent things adult authors do. The writing has to be tighter and more to the point most of the time.

inkspatters said:

There's this bookstore I shop at that actually has a crossover section. I just had to step into this thread to say that, because I've never seen it before and I was wondering whether it was common. Anyone else seen a crossover section?

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Woah, really? I've never seen that before. That sounds really cool.

Ryan_Sullivan said:

I hate the term crossover because it's one of those things that nobody really knows the meaning/use of. Any book has potential for crossover. I also have to say, being both barely out of my teens and studying contemporary literature extensively, there's not a whole lot of difference in the content. The situations and ages are different, but the book can be just as literary and deep as a mainstream adult one, often more. Also, the age most people target seems to be higher than it actually should be. A lot of "upper YA" is more labeled that way for parent's sake than for the readers. The biggest difference, in my opinion, between adult and YA is that teens won't put up with some of the indulgent things adult authors do. The writing has to be tighter and more to the point most of the time.

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Not every book has crossover appeal. In fact, most don't. You have look at things from the mindset of readers. There are certain things MG readers want in books, there are certain things YA readers want in books, and there are certain things adult readers want in books. Most cases, these readers tend to rip on the other's genre. I've heard my little nephews and nieces dissing Twilight and other popular YA novels cos it didn't have certain things, and believe me, those things are kinda dumb lol not dumb as in dumb, but kiddy stuff, you know? I usually say to them, "What?! How is THAT cool?" And they lecture me on why it is hahaha! And some YA readers diss MG stuff for being too uncomplicated. And Adults, well you've heard them rip on YA plenty times.

But on some occassions, there's that one book that captures the heart of everyone, MG, YA, and adult. I don't think the publishers plan to publish crossover books. I don't even think the authors of these crossover books know their books will have crossover appeal when published. It just happens. One minute it's published, the next thing everyone - kids, young adults, and adults - is reading it and saying it's awesome.

I'd advise every author not to focus on any grey area or trying to write a crossover appeal book, cos you're sort of wasting your time. Just write your damn book. There's no formular for the crossover thing. I've read books like Harry Potter, even better than Potter, that had zero crossover appeal. It's just the way it is.

I'm 28 and I read a lot of YA and MG. But there are some books I won't pick up because I feel I'm just "too old" for them. I can see why teens would enjoy these books, but they're not for me.

Usually if a YA novel focuses on problems unique to teenagers (with the exception of generally coming of age) then I won't read it. Conflicts over gossip, disagreements with parents, losing virginity, drinking at parties, unrequited crushes, worries about grades, and navigating social hierarchy in high school don't interest me. I just can't relate to these problems anymore.

I think if a YA book is set mainly in a high school, then it has a lot less cross-over appeal than a book set outside the locker-lined walls.

I think that's why so many "grown-ups" read speculative YA.

The Hunger Games, Melissa Marr's Wicked Lovely Series, and Graceling and Fire by Kristin Cashore have huge cross-over appeal because the main conflicts are not dependent on the main character's age. But I'd also argue the writing in these examples is more literary and less dialogue-dependent than a lot of YA books out there.

Just my 2 cents.

There is no defined crossover genre, although there is a new publisher aiming novels at the 20-something market (forget who though). That's awesome about that bookstore that has a crossover section though. Never seen that before.

A crossover book is one that works for both markets and typically has a deep enough plot to keep adults interested, but still maintains teen-focused themes. Or it's one that has gotten so much press that adults are picking it up because they hear so much about it. (Can you say Twilight?) It's not so much the content, but the marketing.

Adults reads YA, so any good book tends to "crossover." And older teens are reading both YA and adult novels that suit them, so they'll pick up adult books with a teen slant.

YA is pretty edgy these days. If your book deals with teen situations and teen issues, you're probably fine in YA. But if the situations and issues are adult, then teens probably won't be interested anyway and you'd be better off marketing to adults.

Have you read a lot of YA paranormal romance to see how yours fits? Or some of the edgier YA out there? That'll most likely give you a good sense of how yours fit into the market.

The Borders I go to has handled the crossover phenomenon by smacking the YA section up against the adult fiction section. People naturally wander from one to the other now, and the YAs don't feel the stigma of being in the kid's and MG section.

I don't think there's a huge difference, to be honest, and most adults read YA books these days.

Ryan_Sullivan said:

I hate the term crossover because it's one of those things that nobody really knows the meaning/use of. Any book has potential for crossover. I also have to say, being both barely out of my teens and studying contemporary literature extensively, there's not a whole lot of difference in the content. The situations and ages are different, but the book can be just as literary and deep as a mainstream adult one, often more. Also, the age most people target seems to be higher than it actually should be. A lot of "upper YA" is more labeled that way for parent's sake than for the readers. The biggest difference, in my opinion, between adult and YA is that teens won't put up with some of the indulgent things adult authors do. The writing has to be tighter and more to the point most of the time.

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I am Shady Lane and I approve this message.

First, see the links Sage posted. They will have a wealth of information.

But, to address some of your points:

PsiScript said:

Hi: My, what many would term 'YA paranormal romance,' is 104K words and too edgy for youth under sixteen (in general). Then it's probably upper YA, or edgy YA. But Are you sure it's not appropriate for under 16? Many, many upper YA books, even very edgy ones are, considered 14+. Make sure you have read a lot of upper YA - you might be surprised about what is perfectly acceptable in YA these days .

I expect the industry will officially acknowledge (or has already done so) there is a need at the upper scale of YA for mature literature. it's called upper YA, and already exists. Upper YA is flourishing.

I read somewhere that they are calling that grey area (between YA and Adult) Crossover. My understanding of crossover was any book that bleeds over into another category. As others have said, this is something people call books after they've found wide appeal, but it is not a genre.

The readership is there, between YA and Adult, so of course it should be recognized. There is sufficient percentage of adults who never leave YA. I myself, never quite got back on track after having left the YA section. I ran into too much garbage to sift through in the adult section.

And there has been nation-level uproar among parents who find their kids checking out novels in the YA section that are too mature for them. Actually, there really hasn't been. This is a myth. There is a very vocal minority who would like to believe it's true, and who foster that myth as truth. But challenges are not up, AFAIK. A vocal minority is always challenging some books - and wanting attention for doing so. But there really is no national movement or uproar.

So, is it official? Is the grey area Crossover? If it is, that may not be definition enough. How about MYA? Mature Young Adult.

YA is YA - and I'd bet that your book is solidly YA. As long as there are not graphic sexual description, it's probably YA.

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inkspatters said:

There's this bookstore I shop at that actually has a crossover section. I just had to step into this thread to say that, because I've never seen it before and I was wondering whether it was common. Anyone else seen a crossover section?

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I've never seen that before - I've seen book stores with no YA/Teen section (ie, just a fiction section) and I've seen some with teen sections right next to the adult section. And I've seen some that stock certain books in both the teen and adult sections. But I've never seen a "Crossover" section.

Danthia said:

There is no defined crossover genre, although there is a new publisher aiming novels at the 20-something market (forget who though). St. Martins Press is accepting submissions for New Adult books, ie, with early-twenties characters. But AFAIK, they're the only ones recognizing a genre between YA and adult. Everyone else seems to be pretty much sticking with adult and YA.

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Go read a ton of upper YA and then consider where your book falls. I'd bet it is YA.

~suki

Yep, really. I only realised because I was looking for Will Grayson, Will Grayson in YA and they didn't have it, so I asked someone (because seriously, how can you not stock WG, WG) and they were like "Oh, we put it in the crossover." It was weird, but I guess they don't want adults to feel odd walking into the YA section or something?