to series or not to series...

While you see the book as a series, you have to plan as if the second book will never come out. If something strange happens and your next book isn't picked up/published/whatever, could your readers still read the first book in your series and feel like they had a good solid story there with a conclusion? Would they be angry at you for leaving them hanging if your second book never came out?

I like to recommend the Star Wars method for writing. A New Hope had a start, a middle and a conclusion. Sure, the Empire was still out there, Darth Vader hadn't paid for his crimes, Han Solo still owed money to Jaba, Luke hadn't won the girl's heart and he still needed a lot of training to "become a Jedi Knight".

But -

If The Empire Strikes Back had never been made, Star Wars would still be ranked up there as a major movie. It set records for staying in theaters for over 100 weeks in some places. Why? Because people felt like they got their money's worth.

TESB was actually a better movie, but people walked out of the theater mad when it came out. Why? Because it ended in a cliff hanger and we knew we'd have to wait another two-three years before it was resolved. The problem was, Lucas could do that because most of us had invested so much time in the Star Wars universe with "A New Hope" that he knew we'd come back for #3. If he'd pulled that with Star Wars to begin with, I don't think the first movie would have done as well and the second wouldn't have had the lines waiting for it like it did.

So, to make a long story short (too late!), look at your series and figure out can you tie up an arc of your overall story in one book. If so, that's your first book. Note, I'm not saying tie up all the loose ends, but give the audience a beginning, middle and conclusion to something, even if it's defeating a minor villain only to find out there's really a bigger bad guy over the horizon.

What Richard said. The readers should be able to read the first book, be satisfied with the story, and still want to see more of the world you've created, without being forced to read more to find out an important unresolved story line.

Personally I despise series.

But recent successful debuts show that non-stand alone series are a valid bet.
Name of the Wind, First Law and Prince of Nothing all have inconclusive first books (I was unlucky to purchase all three - oh well, you live you learn).

By comparison, Lies of Locke Lamora and Kushiel Dart, also first books in series, did have a solid conclusion, which made me happier, though I only liked Locke and hated Kushiel.

So you can really go any way you like about it, if you judge by the history. My usual take on this, as mentioned in a few other posts, is that the writer should write A Story they want to write. How long it is - doesn't matter. If the story is worthy, it will get picked up and editors will help you split it properly.

There's a publishing angle to this (which others can speak to) and the readers' angle.

If you are going to write a story with seven intertwined poltlines, do so with extreme caution. Readers will be very disappointed if there is no payoff for their time invested. You should have a conclusion (to greater or lesser degrees) in each book (especially the first) to make the journey worthwhile instead of a series of cliffhangers. Otherwise you are setting up a big payoff way down the line, which most readers won't stick around for - we are fickle and impatient.

And, echoing other advice, write your story, make it interesting. If it turns out to be 1 book, or 17, you will know when you are done, not when you start.

Talking to agents on Twitter, most are looking for a solid first story, but they're going to ask "is there more to this story you can tell?" It's apparently getting harder to sell a new author to publishers who's going to tell a high fantasy story followed by a sword and sorcery story followed by a SF story followed by another independent sword and sorcery.

It seems publishers want to build a writer and their world together and then have them "experiment" with other genre once they're established.

Richard White said:

It's apparently getting harder to sell a new author to publishers who's going to tell a high fantasy story followed by a sword and sorcery story followed by a SF story followed by another independent sword and sorcery.

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As someone who is currently working on a gothic fantasy, an epic space opera, a steampunk horror adventure, and a Regency romance with robots in, this just sent a cold shiver down my spine. Brrrr. I'm not sure I have the attention span to only play in one world, or one genre.

Series sell, but they sell on the strength of the first volume.

s.thorne said:

As someone who is currently working on a gothic fantasy, an epic space opera, a steampunk horror adventure, and a Regency romance with robots in, this just sent a cold shiver down my spine. Brrrr. I'm not sure I have the attention span to only play in one world, or one genre.

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Pen names are how many authors have managed multiple-genre disorders.

go 10 go!

10trackers said:

I was thinking about having it be a series deal, though. Either have it be a series, or not have it be published at all.

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At the risk of sounding rude, pitch it like that to an agent and you'll end up on the not published side.

I'm kinda with Capital. In some ways I don't like series. At least I don't like it when they deliberately leave the ending open. Think of it this way. Write book one as if it can stand alone. When people read it and get a sense of conclusion, they'll become more likely to be invested in it when the next comes out.

End book one with a deliberate series mentality (ending reads like "to be continued.") I can all but guarantee you'll lose people. You need to get a few books in to get the reader fully invested in the characters before you can get away with leaving them dangling.

Rmg, I normally dont like series either, but when the author can pull it off Im glad for it

rmgil04 said:

At the risk of sounding rude, pitch it like that to an agent and you'll end up on the not published side.

I'm kinda with Capital. In some ways I don't like series. At least I don't like it when they deliberately leave the ending open. Think of it this way. Write book one as if it can stand alone. When people read it and get a sense of conclusion, they'll become more likely to be invested in it when the next comes out.

End book one with a deliberate series mentality (ending reads like "to be continued.") I can all but guarantee you'll lose people. You need to get a few books in to get the reader fully invested in the characters before you can get away with leaving them dangling.

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I wasn't too clear, my bad - I am quite ok with "to be continued" from the established authors (GRRM, Stephen King). Debuting authors of "first in NEW AWESOME quadriology" on the other hand, make me suspicious and reluctant. That said, as recent debuts show, a new author can be successful even with "to be continued" debut in series.
I honestly don't know how things work out on average with "first in series" pitches - maybe Name of the Wind was one huge exception/one of few outliers. So I am not sure if I can agree or disagree with rmgil's first statement on publishability.

Personally, I love series. If I fall in love with an MC, I like to know there are more of his/her adventures on the horizon for me to read. I'm thinking series like Doc Savage, The Shadow, Tarzan, John Carter of Mars, et al.

I don't necessarily like stories that I have to read in chronological order to get the gist of the whole story line though.

Capital said:

Personally I despise series.

But recent successful debuts show that non-stand alone series are a valid bet.
Name of the Wind, First Law and Prince of Nothing all have inconclusive first books (I was unlucky to purchase all three - oh well, you live you learn).

By comparison, Lies of Locke Lamora and Kushiel Dart, also first books in series, did have a solid conclusion, which made me happier, though I only liked Locke and hated Kushiel.

So you can really go any way you like about it, if you judge by the history. My usual take on this, as mentioned in a few other posts, is that the writer should write A Story they want to write. How long it is - doesn't matter. If the story is worthy, it will get picked up and editors will help you split it properly.

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When it comes to fantasy, I much prefer series over standalones. But there's little doubt it often makes for a more difficult sell to the publisher.

I'm hoping my series gets picked up fast, but Im not holding my breath atm since I havent even finished the first of the series..

Actually, there are plenty of debut authors who get a series sold. It's not that it's necessarily more difficult. I think there's a strong correlation there, but you need to consider the underlying factors. There's a website out there that shows what's been published in the fantasy genre over the last several years, and the debut standalones aren't all that much ahead of the debut series.

I'm sceptical of those lists because they don't include the total size of agent's stack of 1) incoming queries 2) unsuccessful takes.

The bottom line is - only exceptional work is published, standalone or series book 1 (which is further broken down into inconclusive book 1 like NotW or conclusive book 1 like Locke Lamora).

Conclusion: write an exceptional book. Don't worry about series, standalones, or other specifics until an editor is looking at it and making appropriate suggestions.

--OK before the replies start popping, I have to note that exceptional =/= critically acclaimed. I can't really say "write a mediocre book and hope it catches agent/publisher on their good day".

Richard White said:

Talking to agents on Twitter, most are looking for a solid first story, but they're going to ask "is there more to this story you can tell?" It's apparently getting harder to sell a new author to publishers who's going to tell a high fantasy story followed by a sword and sorcery story followed by a SF story followed by another independent sword and sorcery.

It seems publishers want to build a writer and their world together and then have them "experiment" with other genre once they're established.

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This is the vibe I'm getting myself and while I can understand it, it also makes me a bit sad. I've discovered I tend to settle in genres that are closely linked, but which are still different: YA SFF, UF/Contemporary Fantasy and Paranormal Romance. There is significant overlap between them, but they are different enough in many ways to be different genres or subgenres.

I like to jump around. Keeps things fresh for me.

But like I said, I can understand why publishers are slanted this way. it's audience and name building.

An editor recently told me that it's 'about pennies and pounds and being in for both'. Essentially, a brand new author needs to publish three books before you can tell if he'll soar, flop, or slide into the midlist. If they like the first one enough to publish, they'll certainly be looking for two more.

Seven books, on the other hand, may be more difficult to sell as an unestablished author. This is not to say you shouldn't try, but the odds are against it from the outset.

K.L. Townsend said:

This is the vibe I'm getting myself and while I can understand it, it also makes me a bit sad. I've discovered I tend to settle in genres that are closely linked, but which are still different: YA SFF, UF/Contemporary Fantasy and Paranormal Romance. There is significant overlap between them, but they are different enough in many ways to be different genres or subgenres.

I like to jump around. Keeps things fresh for me.

But like I said, I can understand why publishers are slanted this way. it's audience and name building.

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You can brand yourself as someone who writes a little in a lot of genres, but you have to be just that much better than you would otherwise.

I love series and I wish you could write it how you wanted. Unfortunately, that isn't how the ball rolls here.