I can't help but notice that all the writers I love have at least a bachelors degree. Is it truly just as easy to get a book published if you have no degree?
I know you don't technically need a degree to get published but....
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Of course it is. So long as you write well, that shouldn't matter. Possibly many writers have BA's (though I am truly not sure of that), and maybe in gleaning the knowledge they did in university that helped with their writing, but that isn't the only way to learn.
So long as you have an excellent grasp of the language, understand the rules and how to break them, and bring something exciting and fresh to the table, there is no reason why you shouldn't get published. After all, very few people write their degrees in their query letters unless it pertains to the subject matter of the book, so how would an agent/publisher be any the wiser?
So long as you have an excellent grasp of the language, understand the rules and how to break them, and bring something exciting and fresh to the table, there is no reason why you shouldn't get published. After all, very few people write their degrees in their query letters unless it pertains to the subject matter of the book, so how would an agent/publisher be any the wiser?
I don't think publishers ask or care about this, as long as they like your book. My publisher has never asked about my education and if I was querying a new publisher about a novel, I wouldn't mention it. You do get a lot of writing practice at university, but it isn't necessarily a relevant kind of writing.
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I agree. My major is interior decorating and I have no desire to earn a BA in English. I'll take a few classes to brush up my skills, but nothing major.
I do have a BA in English and several post grad degrees. My agent/editor have never discussed my education at all.
I tried to get my bachelor's in Comparative Literature, thinking it would be great training for a writer. Oh, dear. What a mistake. If ever anything was designed to kill the joy of writing, it's studying great writers in an academic setting...
So I dropped out of college, worked for a while, then went back and got a degree in history and a teaching credential. The benefit of a college degree is it can help you get a job that will pay enough for you to live while you are learning to write.
Other than that, agents and editors only care about your education if it qualifies you as an expert in your field. If you want to write the next Presumed Innocent, having a law degree helps. If you want to write about Kung Fu, having a black belt from the Shao Lin Temple helps.
So I dropped out of college, worked for a while, then went back and got a degree in history and a teaching credential. The benefit of a college degree is it can help you get a job that will pay enough for you to live while you are learning to write.
Other than that, agents and editors only care about your education if it qualifies you as an expert in your field. If you want to write the next Presumed Innocent, having a law degree helps. If you want to write about Kung Fu, having a black belt from the Shao Lin Temple helps.
I'm working toward a degree in Literature not because it's necessary, but because I'm not as interested in anything else. So far it's been introducing me to work I might not have otherwise read, and with my focus on creative writing, I'm getting a lot of practice in.
Of course, I'd like to teach some day, so the degree and certification helps that end. As far as getting published? Absolutely not. There is no rule that says a degree or college education is needed in order to become a writer.
In fact, I should think that majoring in something entirely different would be more beneficial than an English/Lit degree.
Of course, I'd like to teach some day, so the degree and certification helps that end. As far as getting published? Absolutely not. There is no rule that says a degree or college education is needed in order to become a writer.
In fact, I should think that majoring in something entirely different would be more beneficial than an English/Lit degree.
Well, my undergraduate degree is in civil engineering, and my graduate work was in geotechnical engineering, and I'm sure none of that helped me one whit in landing my first contract. The only time I think it would matter is if you're writing non-fiction, or if your degree is directly related to what you're writing (i.e., you hold a degree in theoretical physics and are writing an SF book that deals with that). I would think graduating from a writing program like Clarion would mean more than having a degree.
In short, I wouldn't worry about it. You don't have to have a college education to write well (and, in fact, having a literature degree can work against you in that respect, because you learn to write things that "have literary merit" as opposed to things people actually want to read), or to sell what you write.
-- Marcy
In short, I wouldn't worry about it. You don't have to have a college education to write well (and, in fact, having a literature degree can work against you in that respect, because you learn to write things that "have literary merit" as opposed to things people actually want to read), or to sell what you write.
-- Marcy
Thank you for the great answers. I'm so glad I asked. Each of you brought up points I haven't thought of.
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The degree in terms of having letters after your name is not relevant. But the degree as an experience that helped them develop their skills probably is.
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Take heart. Thousands of excellent writers never set foot on a college campus, or never finished their degree--Mark Twain, Truman Capote, Charles Dickens, F. Scott Fitzgerald, Woody Allen, and Ambrose Bierce to name a few.
When it comes to writing novels, publishers don't give a flip about your education. They look for great writing and storytelling, the rest is irrelevant.
When it comes to writing novels, publishers don't give a flip about your education. They look for great writing and storytelling, the rest is irrelevant.
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No one knows your educational background unless you tell them. All publishers care about is the writing. Period.
If college classes make you a better writer, fine. Take some classes. Having a degree won't change bad writing. It's not about credentials. It's about skill.
It's always about the writing. Always.
Jim
If college classes make you a better writer, fine. Take some classes. Having a degree won't change bad writing. It's not about credentials. It's about skill.
It's always about the writing. Always.
Jim
I sure hope it's irrelevant since I don't have a degree and don't see myself going back to get one.
In terms of writing fiction, no the degree as thing doesn't really matter.
In terms of what you know, and the ability to write and think, college does help you exercise and learn new skills.
But you can, absolutely, do that on your own. Read a lot. Read widely. Read in all fields and eras, and read Total Crap as well as good stuff. Write a lot. Revise a heck of a lot. Listen to people, lots of people, listen to what they think is important and what isn't, listen to the ways they use words.
In terms of what you know, and the ability to write and think, college does help you exercise and learn new skills.
But you can, absolutely, do that on your own. Read a lot. Read widely. Read in all fields and eras, and read Total Crap as well as good stuff. Write a lot. Revise a heck of a lot. Listen to people, lots of people, listen to what they think is important and what isn't, listen to the ways they use words.
Couldn't agree more. I took Classics with Ancient History and can hold my head up with the best of 'em in writing you a kick-a$$ assignment on the constitutional position of Augustus, or the introduction of the sumptuary laws of 17BC. But where does this help me with story-telling? Quite!
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I studied business management and commercial law because my parents told me I had to or I'd never get a real job. What a waste of time - I spent eight years in a career I hated and found my joy in something completely different.
Never listen to your parents when it comes to career choices...
Never listen to your parents when it comes to career choices...
I agree that it is all about how well you write. I think most people can benefit from a good writing class, but a bad writing teacher -- or bad critique group, for that matter -- is worse than none. A degree is absolutely not necessary.
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To be a writer? Not necessary.
To get a decent job to support yourself while you struggle to make it as a writer? Yes, I would recommend a degree in something you will enjoy doing. Hopefully something that nurtures your creative side. Think of writers like Patricia Cornwell, Scott Turow, Kathy Reichs. Their expertise in their non-writing fields is a huge asset in their books.
I really passionately believe that writers should live life fully, dive in headfirst to as much as they can, because all of that will make them better writers. So if a college education would benefit you in some way, you should go for it.
To get a decent job to support yourself while you struggle to make it as a writer? Yes, I would recommend a degree in something you will enjoy doing. Hopefully something that nurtures your creative side. Think of writers like Patricia Cornwell, Scott Turow, Kathy Reichs. Their expertise in their non-writing fields is a huge asset in their books.
I really passionately believe that writers should live life fully, dive in headfirst to as much as they can, because all of that will make them better writers. So if a college education would benefit you in some way, you should go for it.
I have noticed that creative people tend to be a lot more intelligent than average. Intelligent people tend to go to college to further their education in the field they are interested in. So, I think what you are seeing is not that a degree is required to be a writer, but a reflection on the intelligence level of writers as a group. You can see that here on AW, in general the members of AW tend to be a lot more intelligent than an average group of people. The intelligence bit breaks down at the level of the individual. So, no, you don't need a degree to be a writer.
Generally, creative careers don't require a degree to be successful, because creativity can't be taught. However, learning the tools of the art is beneficial in that it gives one more freedom to be creative. If you know the rules, then you can pick and choose when to break them. And you don't need college to learn the rules.
Generally, creative careers don't require a degree to be successful, because creativity can't be taught. However, learning the tools of the art is beneficial in that it gives one more freedom to be creative. If you know the rules, then you can pick and choose when to break them.
And you don't need college to learn the rules.
I won't tell you where my education ended, but I don't have any degrees or anything else from post secondary schools. I was never in a university until the day I took my daughter to her dorm on her first day.
ETA: Maybe I should add here that I paid for her education with the money I made freelance writing on the side.
ETA: Maybe I should add here that I paid for her education with the money I made freelance writing on the side.
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Education can also give a person confidence. I knew someone who had her first short story published in the New Yorker when she was in her 20s. By the time she was 40 she had three anthologies of short stories published by a major publisher. But she always felt inadequate because she "only" had a biology degree from a minor university. Her feeling of inadequacy was real, even if to me sort of silly.
I also like JudScotKev's idea that you should learn to do something you enjoy. For 8 years I taught English and creative writing at the college/university level (mostly community college, where I had tenure). I was writing and publishing some, and then startled everyone by saying I was going to law school. People said, "But don't you want to be a writer any more?" Believe it or not, going to law school actually improved my writing, and opened up whole new worlds of things to write about. Besides, I make a heck of a lot more money for a few hours work then I did as a teacher, and don't let anyone fool you: The ability to earn a nice hourly wage doesn't hurt creativity. The danger is getting so swept up in career that writing gets shoved aside, but I've seen that happen just as often to people without higher education.
I also like JudScotKev's idea that you should learn to do something you enjoy. For 8 years I taught English and creative writing at the college/university level (mostly community college, where I had tenure). I was writing and publishing some, and then startled everyone by saying I was going to law school. People said, "But don't you want to be a writer any more?" Believe it or not, going to law school actually improved my writing, and opened up whole new worlds of things to write about. Besides, I make a heck of a lot more money for a few hours work then I did as a teacher, and don't let anyone fool you: The ability to earn a nice hourly wage doesn't hurt creativity. The danger is getting so swept up in career that writing gets shoved aside, but I've seen that happen just as often to people without higher education.
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That said, I think Toothpaste's initial response was the right one. (I quoted her below). All the rest is commentary:
Of course it is. So long as you write well, that shouldn't matter. Possibly many writers have BA's (though I am truly not sure of that), and maybe in gleaning the knowledge they did in university that helped with their writing, but that isn't the only way to learn.
So long as you have an excellent grasp of the language, understand the rules and how to break them, and bring something exciting and fresh to the table, there is no reason why you shouldn't get published. After all, very few people write their degrees in their query letters unless it pertains to the subject matter of the book, so how would an agent/publisher be any the wiser?
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Of course it is. So long as you write well, that shouldn't matter. Possibly many writers have BA's (though I am truly not sure of that), and maybe in gleaning the knowledge they did in university that helped with their writing, but that isn't the only way to learn.
So long as you have an excellent grasp of the language, understand the rules and how to break them, and bring something exciting and fresh to the table, there is no reason why you shouldn't get published. After all, very few people write their degrees in their query letters unless it pertains to the subject matter of the book, so how would an agent/publisher be any the wiser?
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I know of at least one person on AW right now who sold a book before graduating high school.
But it varies. When I was in high school I wouldn't have been ready to publish a book, although I was writing. I found that college really helped me out a lot. I took writing workshops and read a lot of things I wouldn't normally read. I believe it made me a stronger writer.
But it varies. When I was in high school I wouldn't have been ready to publish a book, although I was writing. I found that college really helped me out a lot. I took writing workshops and read a lot of things I wouldn't normally read. I believe it made me a stronger writer.