Ending? What ending?

Cranky · Jul 31, 2008

I've finally figured out what the real problem I've been having with actually completing work. Novels, at least.

Endings. I have no bloody clue where my stories end. I can come up with the beginning and the middle, but as for the end? Nope. Nothing. Big blank screen.

Part of it is inner editor crap, but mostly it's just a lack of ideas. Yes. How lame.

Anyone got some good techniques for coming up with a good ending? Brainstorming doesn't seem to work for me (having that stupid inner editor which I've not yet been able to shut up doesn't help), and I run into the same problems with synopses and outlines, too. I get to a certain point where I just go, "Uh, so now what?"

Or is it just a fatal flaw? Is it something I should just "know" how to do? Stupid question, I know, but I am frustrated enough to not care about that.

quickWit · Jul 31, 2008

Whatever conflicts you have in your story need resolution of one type or another, right? Isn't that a good place to start? Identify what your conflicts are. If you've already resolved them (in your outline, synopsis or previous chapters) maybe you're A) Resolving them too early or B) Trying to make your work longer than it needs to be.

Don't know if that's what you mean, but that's where I'd start.

Captshady · Jul 31, 2008

That's my problem ... coming up with conflicts.

Example: A book about a bum, and his (hopefully) witty cynical observances of people sitting on a park bench in a downtown area.

I can't come up with a conflict (and hence an ending) to save my life.

sunandshadow · Jul 31, 2008

I also tend to totally lack ideas for endings. I've found two ways to cope: 1. Make a list of types of endings in others books so I at least know what my options are, then pick an example ending to emulate. 2. Write an ongoing story, one which isn't intended to end. If for some reason an ending is truly necessary later I can divide what I have written into appropriate lengths after something vaguely ending-like has happened and edit a bit to strengthen it.

Prozyan · Jul 31, 2008

Just write "The End" at some random point in the book. Really, any point will do. There is your ending.

Hey, you didn't say it had to be good!

Seriously, Kevin Smith has some good things to say about endings. His original ending for Clerks had some guy coming into the Quick Stop and killing Dante. He's said he wrote it that way originally because he didn't understand endings and thought they had to be . . . well, endings. But at test screenings, it played as too sad and depressing, especially in light of the rest of the film.

So he changed it and learned that an ending isn't necessarily the end of a character's story, but simply the end of all current conflicts.

sunandshadow · Jul 31, 2008

Captshady said:
That's my problem ... coming up with conflicts.

Example: A book about a bum, and his (hopefully) witty cynical observances of people sitting on a park bench in a downtown area.

I can't come up with a conflict (and hence an ending) to save my life.

A conflict is anything any character is dissatisfied with. What's the bum not satisfied with? How about the people on the bench, what are they not satisfied with?

zornhau · Jul 31, 2008

Captshady said:
That's my problem ... coming up with conflicts.

Example: A book about a bum, and his (hopefully) witty cynical observances of people sitting on a park bench in a downtown area.

I can't come up with a conflict (and hence an ending) to save my life.

Sorry. No conflict, no story... even short stories that seem to have no conflict are really conflicts between, e.g. reader expectation and what happens.

In a novel, conflict isn't something you just bolt on at the end, it's what sucks the reader into the novel so they can enjoy your cynical tramp.

Ways around the problem with respect to the tramp:

Tramp is player in somebody else's story: Real story is about somebody else. Tramp is a catalyst for the story, but for trivial reasons. Same sort of structure as the old Sam Spade stories.
Tramp as observer: The tramp tells somebody else's story.
Tramp as hero: Tramp faces some sort of external challenge and overcomes it.
Tramp as antagonist: Somebody tries to change the tramp

Cranky · Jul 31, 2008

Prozyan said:
Just write "The End" at some random point in the book. Really, any point will do. There is your ending.

Hey, you didn't say it had to be good!

Seriously, Kevin Smith has some good things to say about endings. His original ending for Clerks had some guy coming into the Quick Stop and killing Dante. He's said he wrote it that way originally because he didn't understand endings and thought they had to be . . . well, endings. But at test screenings, it played as too sad and depressing, especially in light of the rest of the film.

So he changed it and learned that an ending isn't necessarily the end of a character's story, but simply the end of all current conflicts.

True enough. I'm thinking, after reading everyone's responses, that my problem isn't really the ending per se, but the conflicts or lack thereof, in my stories.

Good food for thought.

kuwisdelu · Jul 31, 2008

Ah, yes, the best thing to do is definitely identify your conflicts, if you haven't yet. If they're not obvious--and they don't have to be--figure out what they are. If they're not very existent, flesh them out. Endings are a lot easier once you know your conflicts. Still hard, but definitely easier.

JLCwrites · Jul 31, 2008

Or you can just have your MC die. That will put an end to things.

quickWit · Jul 31, 2008

TurkeyLurkey said:
Or you can just have your MC die. That will put an end to things.

Not if it's a ghost story.

Bubastes · Jul 31, 2008

Yes, definitely work on the conflict end. That may solve your ending problem right there and also make the story more engaging. Two problems solved for the price of one.

Good luck!

Cranky · Jul 31, 2008

TurkeyLurkey said:
Or you can just have your MC die. That will put an end to things.

Most definitely! :roll:

Cranky · Jul 31, 2008

MeowGirl said:
Yes, definitely work on the conflict end. That may solve your ending problem right there and also make the story more engaging. Two problems solved for the price of one. Good luck!

Yes. Seems so obvious now, but wow, it was just sailing right over my head. Seriously. *headdesk*

Well, now I've got a place to start, and that's always a good thing.

JLCwrites · Jul 31, 2008

I keep thinking about the ending of Return of the King. I thought the destruction of the ring should have been the final scene. (Although I know others would argue with me on this.) I think Tolkien just wanted to tie up some loose ends down in Hobbity land... but it made the ending too long. IMO.

She_wulf · Jul 31, 2008

Captshady said:
That's my problem ... coming up with conflicts.

Example: A book about a bum, and his (hopefully) witty cynical observances of people sitting on a park bench in a downtown area.

I can't come up with a conflict (and hence an ending) to save my life.

A bum that makes cynical observances about people sitting on the park bench downtown...maybe a millionaire in disguise. I know, lame, right?

But think about this for a moment - his conflict is with "rejoining" the human condition since it seems to fail so often in his eyes, but the real conflict is within because he has failed to join.

A little deep, I know.

Something must force him to change. Either he joins or departs, moves on or remains. There has to be a moment where he is forced to act (perhaps witnessing a crime, or a person notices him and tries to change his plight) his resulting action or resistance is the story conflict. Bits and pieces of his personality are revealed by the observations of the passersby.

Just a thought.

Prozyan · Jul 31, 2008

TurkeyLurkey said:
I keep thinking about the ending of Return of the King. I thought the destruction of the ring should have been the final scene. (Although I know others would argue with me on this.) I think Tolkien just wanted to tie up some loose ends down in Hobbity land... but it made the ending too long. IMO.

Amen.

kuwisdelu · Jul 31, 2008

TurkeyLurkey said:
Or you can just have your MC die. That will put an end to things.

I do this too often. I need to force myself to write some stories where no one dies. It's not like I just kill them off for the sake of it. They're always meaningful, powerful deaths (I hope). It just seems everything I write ends in death...

TurkeyLurkey said:
I keep thinking about the ending of Return of the King. I thought the destruction of the ring should have been the final scene. (Although I know others would argue with me on this.) I think Tolkien just wanted to tie up some loose ends down in Hobbity land... but it made the ending too long. IMO.

The strange thing is I thought it worked pretty well in the book. The battle for the Shire wasn't even addressed in the movie, and yet the movie's ending felt like it dragged on way longer than the book.

Cranky · Jul 31, 2008

I've never yet brought myself to finish LoTR series. The movie ending dragged on and on, though. *shudders*

Quossum · Jul 31, 2008

^^^ Hear, hear! I liked the Cleansing of the Shire okay, but why did the movie, without including it, seem to go on and on?

A creative writing professor challenged us to write a story with no conflict. I tried, but I petered out on it because it wasn't good or interesting in any way. The other members of the class had the same experience.

When I'm in the planning stage, I often come up with a character first. "Okay, there will be this guy...he raises sugar gliders. Cool! Oh, wait...what's his problem?" That's where your conflict comes in, and thus your potential ending as the character struggles to solve it.

--Q

TheIT · Jul 31, 2008

So far I've reached an ending on two novel drafts and have three more which are incomplete. I don't outline. I began writing each draft with a starting incident, a strong idea of the main characters and where I wanted them to end up emotionally, a few ideas of later incidents, and that was it. I wandered a lot in the drafts as I got to know the characters and came up with new things to throw at them, then eventually something clicked and the ending came into sight.

Think about it like riding a roller coaster. A lot of the ride is spent moving up and up, sometimes plateauing, but always moving, until eventually there's nowhere else to go but down. Movement = conflict and problems to overcome. Ending = resolution to the main question/conflict of the story.

Deccydiva · Jul 31, 2008

I have the ending sussed the same day I have the beginning outlined, then I have the long slog of getting from one to the other. My novel now being queried has a twist at the end which still makes me fill up when I read it. It should have the reader laughing and crying at the same time; it also leaves the way open for a sequel

*perceives collective shudder*

She_wulf · Jul 31, 2008

TurkeyLurkey said:
I keep thinking about the ending of Return of the King. I thought the destruction of the ring should have been the final scene. (Although I know others would argue with me on this.) I think Tolkien just wanted to tie up some loose ends down in Hobbity land... but it made the ending too long. IMO.

I'll bring up the Mooby Burger counter debate: Film or book?

Randal Graves: If Peter Jackson really wanted to blow me away with those "Rings" movies, he would have ended the third one on the logical closure point, not the 25 endings that followed.

In book context, LOTR's ending revealed the culmination of a different conflict altogether. Frodo's internal conflict which developed as a result of carrying the ring for so long.

So what he returns to his hometown a war hero and kicks bad guy tail out of the Shire? So what he has finished his recounting of the tale? So what he has witnessed a new era of peace? He is PTSD and can never really go back to the beginning where life was stealing mushrooms from Farmer Maggot.

He cannot live with the results of his near ultimate failure. He has failed to redeem Smeagol, he failed to drop the ring into the fires of Mt. Doom, and he failed to keep the Shire safe.

Although Tolkien did not detail Frodo's angst as the focus of the book, he showed it come to its conclusion. Which is where the story ends.

I feel he wanted to reinforce the notion that Happily Ever After doesn't necessarily happen for the wounded heroes. The king dies, Arwen fades in the mortal lands, Gandalf is gone. Even Samwise loses his best friend. War is like that.

sassandgroove · Jul 31, 2008

Cranky said:
Anyone got some good techniques for coming up with a good ending?

*lurking cuz I dunno either.*

JLCwrites · Jul 31, 2008

She_wulf said:
I'll bring up the Mooby Burger counter debate: Film or book?

In book context, LOTR's ending revealed the culmination of a different conflict altogether. Frodo's internal conflict which developed as a result of carrying the ring for so long.

So what he returns to his hometown a war hero and kicks bad guy tail out of the Shire? So what he has finished his recounting of the tale? So what he has witnessed a new era of peace? He is PTSD and can never really go back to the beginning where life was stealing mushrooms from Farmer Maggot.

He cannot live with the results of his near ultimate failure. He has failed to redeem Smeagol, he failed to drop the ring into the fires of Mt. Doom, and he failed to keep the Shire safe.

Although Tolkien did not detail Frodo's angst as the focus of the book, he showed it come to its conclusion. Which is where the story ends.

I feel he wanted to reinforce the notion that Happily Ever After doesn't necessarily happen for the wounded heroes. The king dies, Arwen fades in the mortal lands, Gandalf is gone. Even Samwise loses his best friend. War is like that.

Exactly... which was why I felt so blue after reading it. I was emotionally invested in the characters, and when the story ended on a melancholy note... I felt bummed.

Ending? What ending?

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