French accents

Unless you want the character to be comedic, I would advise against trying to write the character's accent phonetically. You say the accent is "affected" - are they are a French speaker, or are they pretending?

If they are French, I think throwing in the odd French phrase to remind the reader is fine. I'd just mention in narration that they have an accent, and maybe have them use phrases that someone with English as their first language would not use - for example, tenses are slightly different in French - you may notice that French speakers, although they speak English fluently, might use phrases like "I am living here since 2 years", or "I have washed my hair last night", because those phrases, literally translated, make sense in French, but sound slightly odd to English speakers.

oooooh said:

Any French speakers here? Or francophiles?

How do you approach a character who speaks english but with an affected accent, such as french?

I'm writing a character but the only example I really have to go on is Madame Maxime from the Harry Potter books. Basically what I do is I throw in words like 'vot' (for what, although I'm thinking this one sounds a bit off), and 'zees' (this), and 'vee' (we), and things like that, with the occasional 'ma cherie' but also other french phrases.

Am I butchering the language? Are there any other good examples of characters with French accents I should check out?

Thx.

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Personally, as a reader I would be insulted by the use of cultural stereotypes. I abandoned one author of Roman HF because he insisted on non-Roman characters speaking like 'me no speakee Latin.' It was as though Achebe or Rhys had never happened. Do the French actually speak like that? I have a few French friends, and they could speak pretty good English (with a gorgeous French accent.)

If it were me, I would just say something like 'she said with a distinctively French accent.'

I'm writing a French character right now, too. For the most part, I don't address the accent, but make it obvious by other character reactions that his pronunciation is different.

If you really want to write it how it sounds, there are a few characteristic sound changes between French and English:

1. H isn't pronounced, so horse becomes orse, but there will be a hint of the h at the beginning
2. th is pronounced 't' so three becomes tree
3. single 'i's in words are pronounced 'ee', sobill may sound more like beel.

The trick is that they won't do this with every word that has those sounds in them--only the ones they have more trouble with, or learning incorrectly the first time. So you might have someone who has no problem with the'th' sound for most words, but has a couple of words they always get wrong (maybe they pronoune three correctly, but thorough is always torough).And they will default to their native sounds when drunk.

I have similar words in french that I pronounce incorrectly, despite pronouncing the same sound correctly in other words. I'm fluent, but it comes from having been taught at one point by someone with poor pronunciation.

I have quite a few foreign characters in my shorts. What I've found is that accents are really hard to pull off.

A couple of things that worked for me....

Contractions - Instead I'll or I'm, go for I will and I am. Even very advanced speakers often miss contractions.

Word Order - Most languages put certain words in different positions in a sentence. "I always go to the pub" could be "I go always to the pub."

Grammar - As mentioned, the present perfect is one that most non-native speakers can't get to grips with. Likewise, will instead of going to, simpler structures in general

Phrases - One or two phrases in that language can go a long way, or alternatively, literal translations of phrases, especially idioms.Often, extra words are added or omitted. For example, in German you would say, "We will meet us." "I remembered me to do this."

Prepositions - One thing that is very hard to get right. "I am in holiday", "I saw them at Saturday" etc.

Don't overdo it - A few sprinkled here and there are better than something every other line. The point that the person is foreign will come across very quickly and not interfere with the ease of reading. Some mistakes are more common than others, depending on the nationality. A quick check of some basic phrases online will give you some clues if you don't know anyone from that country.

If you're not going for a funny-foreigner comedy act, you're much better off:

1) NOT trying to show an accent phonetically. It pretty much never works, and it annoys readers too

2) Simply stating that the character has an accent.

3) Occasionally indicating the accent through things like word order, skipped or extra words, or idiomatic phrases that literally reproduce key features of the speaker's native language. GraemeTollins has some good suggestions.

4) Occasionally sprinkling the accented speech with a foreign word or phrase

Word choice and word order will get you a lot farther than spelled-out dialect.

I was reading an American book where they tried to "write" an London English accent and, being English, I kept thinking "uhhh that's not how we sound".
It's a skill that is very difficult to get right. For instance this book said the English person pronounced Banana as "ba-nah-na". To me, that's how it sounds in an American accent. We say it like "ba-narh-na", and I read Americans as saying it like "ba-naah-na", you know?

It's hard to write an accent because by definition, people pronounce letters differently. "vot" to a French person will read like "vot". They'll have no idea what you're on about. Also, french people don't actually have difficulty with "wh" or "th" sounds. It's actually a lot more pronounced like "whvat" They just vibrate slightly more on the h part of the word. They are still forming the same mouth movements.

The way to best "write" an accent is in the sentence structure. I have characters that have acclimatised and therefor speak English fine, but their sentence structure is far more formal and so it reads as though they are speaking a second language (at least I hope it does). Similarly, for my Irish character I don't try to "write" an Irish accent, but there a certain phrases that are common in certain cultures and not in others. A lot of Irish phrases aren't present in England and it's easy to recognise that the character is Irish because of the phrases they use.
In some areas up North in England they say "us" instead of "me". If a character said "You've been kind to us" when referring only to themselves, a familiar reader would know that the character wasn't a Southener.

I'd think to write a French character you're either going to have to just say "they spoke in a French accent" or you'll have to spend a lot of time interviewing/watching/listening to a lot of French natives speaking in English. It's the sort of thing that, if you get it wrong, you're going to offend.

ellio said:

We say it like "ba-narh-na",

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I don't know why, but that made me think of Austin Powers - possibly because he calls his car 'Shag-wah', when of course it should be 'Shag-you-uh'.

ellio said:

The way to best "write" an accent is in the sentence structure. I have characters that have acclimatised and therefor speak English fine, but their sentence structure is far more formal and so it reads as though they are speaking a second language (at least I hope it does). Similarly, for my Irish character I don't try to "write" an Irish accent, but there a certain phrases that are common in certain cultures and not in others. A lot of Irish phrases aren't present in England and it's easy to recognise that the character is Irish because of the phrases they use.
In some areas up North in England they say "us" instead of "me". If a character said "You've been kind to us" when referring only to themselves, a familiar reader would know that the character wasn't a Southener.

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And yes, this is very true, my dad is Irish but lives in England, and there are certain phrases that he confuses English people with - for example, he'll say "Your man (followed by name)" when he is just referring to someone that you know, be they a footballer or someone who works in the local shops. His friends tease him about this - "Why is he my man?" etc.

Having thought about this thread, the only none-annoying phonetic accents in dialogue I can think of that I have ever read were both Scots dialect by Scottish authors - Irvine Welsh and James Kelman.

My family is French, but most speak English fairly well, with varying degrees of accents. I agree you're much less likely to annoy or offend readers if you stick to differences in syntax and sentence structure rather than pronunciation, especially since some regions of France have linguistic variations. (My grandmother, for example, drags out any "o" and "u" vowel sounds she speaks, whether in French or English. She also pronounces the "th" sound less like "t" and more like "d.")

In this day and age nobody needs phonetics to imagine how a French character is speaking their dialogue.

If I know they are French and that they are speaking in English I'd rather understand what they are saying - I can add my own interpretation of how it is said.

Concentrate on word choice and sentence construction as has been mentioned above. And if they speak fluent English write the dialogue the same way you would write any other character's dialogue.

oooooh said:

Basically what I do is I throw in words like 'vot' (for what, although I'm thinking this one sounds a bit off), and 'zees' (this), and 'vee' (we), and things like that

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That's not how a native French speaker would pronounce those words. "W"s don't turn into a "v"s; in French, it's constructed by putting two other vowel sounds together -- it sounds like an English "w", just drawn out. The "th" sound in English I think turns into a harder "t" or "d".

But also -- writing out an accent phonetically is hard on the eyes. It always irks me when I pick up a book and the author has done this; I usually end up ignoring the accent and reading it as straight English. As others have said, if you feel the need to write out the difference in speech, just copying the grammar is a much better way to go.

I had a similar issue when writing a Swedish character. Actually, she lived in France, so she was speaking French with a Swedish accent . . . only it was all translated into English for the sake of the reader. Kind of confusing, LOL! In any case, I got rid of all contractions, so she would sound more formal, like a non-native speaker. I didn't give her any phonetic pronunciations, because like others above me have stated, it can get real annoying, real quick.

I would've liked to have changed her word order around, to better reflect her accent, or to have added native phrases that would help her sound more foreign, but I wasn't able to find anyone who spoke Swedish to help me out. It's probably fine without that kind of thing, but if you can pull it off, it will add an extra layer of realism to your dialogue.

As others have said, using a more typically French sentence construction will actually go a long way to making the character feel more French. Don't bother with the accent. Also it's Germans who are known to pronounce a 'W' as a 'V.' French people don't do that.

Remember slight differences in progressive tense. French people often say things like 'I go to work' instead of saying 'I am going to work.'

Just little things like that will help.

The use of dialect is more of a 19th century thing, when one of the expected uses of stories was that one person would be reading them to a group others, perhaps after dinner, perhaps in a workshop.

Then dialect functioned as stage directions for the reader. Not so much a thing now.

You can derive Rudyard Kipling's own accent from how he phonetically reproduced the dialect of Massachusetts fishermen, if you already know how said fishermen talk. (The dialect only works if you read the words with a plummy English accent.)

Yeah, trying to reproduce accents phonetically is nearly impossible to do correctly. Besides, different readers might interpret your "phonetic spelling" differently, and thus won't "hear" what you want them to hear anyway. The important part is that the character is French and has an accent, not how she/he forms his/her words. So, noting the accent in exposition, or throwing in occasional indicative phrases, will get across what you need to get across.

FWIW, my previous WIP was set in 18th-century France, but they were all native French speakers, so it was all "translated" into English, and nobody thought that anyone else had an accent. But to give a little atmosphere, I made the word choice more formal, employed some unusual sentence structures, and threw in a few French phrases (ma cher, mon Dieu, etc).

oooooh said:

That contractions thing is probably the most important thing I missed. Thanks.

I think I need to step back and reconsider a lot of things. Because I am slightly exaggerating the accent for comedic effect, and that's basically exploitation, isn't it? Also, from a logical viewpoint, wouldn't a French person living in England for the last twenty or so years have only a trace of an accent?

A lot of you mentioned that being reminded of an accent through the dialogue itself is annoying. I guess to me, in a way, it makes the character come alive, helps put their voice in my head. But maybe in not all instances is it absolutely necessary...

Just rambling to myself at this point, ignore me.

Ahhhh so many useful notes and ideas thank u thank u all :')

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Not necessarily. I like to cite the example of Bela Karolyi, the legendary gymnastics coach who defected from Romania circa 1980. To this day, he still speaks with a VERY strong accent. On the other hand, I have a Venezuelan friend who has been here (the US) for three years, and speaks like a native speaker--full command of the language and only a trace of an accent. He knew hardly any English when he arrived.

The degree of an accent for someone who moves to live in a new country really depends on 1) how well the person picks up languages and 2) the age at which they first moved. Adults will generally retain an accent, and younger teens and children might emulate the other country's speech nearly perfectly. I have seen exceptions to both cases, however.

My family moved to the US about 20 years ago, and my parents were already adults. My father is older than my mother, but he can do a perfect American accent, whereas my mother, though younger, still has a slight accent. Myself and my siblings were really small, so we were young enough to learn English practically as a first language, so we have American accents as well. However, we can also speak with our native accent. It tends to get stronger when we're around people of our own culture, like family, or if we're under emotional stress. There is a girl I know, though, who moved here when she was about 10, and has lived here for many years, but she still has a REALLY strong accent. It depends on the person.

I'm a French speaker. As others have pointed out, if your character is comedic, you may want to emphasize pronunciation in a more or less stereotypical way. Otherwise, it might be a better idea to focus on the cultural aspects of your character and insert words in French here and there.

Just for kicks, I'll tell you something French speakers may have trouble with when they speak English.

If your character gets emotional, whether he's/she's happy or angry, he/she might let out more French words than usual. For example, he/she might say ''oui'', ''non'' or ''oh mon Dieu!'' when being surprised or amazed.

An easy trick: things have a gender. So talking about things, your character could refer to objects or animals using gender words. Talking about a butterfly that ''he is...'' but about the dragonfly ''she is...''. A table is a ''she'', a computer is a ''he''. There's no sense to it, though.

Phrasal verbs. If a French speaker wants to get rid of something in the garbage, he may have to figure out whether it would be proper to: a) throw it, b)throw it up, c) throw it out or d) throw it away and be in the difficult position of not being able to choose.


Accentuating words may be done incorrectly such as asking someone: ''Ow hawr you?'' (because the French speakers knows he should sound out an ''h'' somewhere in there but not have the right...timing). Or ''drying my air''.

Well, that's it!

I use dialect, syntax, rhythm, and flow. Dialect works very, very well, if you get it right. Syntax is also important.

And sometimes I do spell words phonetically. This also works well, if it isn't overdone. It's like cayenne pepper. Too much just burns your mouth, but a little bit adds spice and flavor.

oooooh said:

Any French speakers here? Or francophiles?

How do you approach a character who speaks english but with an affected accent, such as french?

I'm writing a character but the only example I really have to go on is Madame Maxime from the Harry Potter books. Basically what I do is I throw in words like 'vot' (for what, although I'm thinking this one sounds a bit off), and 'zees' (this), and 'vee' (we), and things like that, with the occasional 'ma cherie' but also other french phrases.

Am I butchering the language? Are there any other good examples of characters with French accents I should check out?

Thx.

Click to expand...

Most francophones do not speak in that way. You may want to try mixing the grammar around when that character speaks, and remove "plural S's" from his/her speech. A common "Frenchism" is a sentence like, "Me I go to the movie," instead of "I am going to the movies." Also, "Mon cheri," not "Ma cheri."

Something I forgot to mention in my earlier post. I've lived in seven countries and visited many more and have, merely by osmosis, learned quite a bit about the languages. Plus, I am a language teacher and, therefore, analysis of language is kind of my job.

I'm English, though, and grew up in and around London. I wrote a short which had a lot of London characters in it - a very particular type. Since I knew the way these people would speak, I really went to town on it. A friend of mine, whose taste I trust, told me she found it very annoying to read. She said something like, "I know they are from London. I got that three sentences in. Stop bashing me over the head with the fact that they are Londoners."

I think in the edit, I left in perhaps five or six "clues" with vocabulary and phrases, and left the rest up to rhythm.

I thought I was being authentic, when it turns out, I was just making it difficult to read.

Jus' me ramblins, you know, mate, from one of those geezers that finks it's all right to chuck in a bit less. More effective, like, innit? You know wha' I mean....., or

Just a thought from a subscriber to the "less is more" philosophy.

I speak four languages with varying degrees of facility. I have a few simple rules for this.

Give just a few hints of an accent. That will get the point across without forcing readers to read sentences which don’t flow easily.

Focus more on syntax than sounds. A Spanish speaker saying “I’m going to the store” in English might drop the “I” since it’s assumed in Spanish: “Going to the store.”

Tell rather than show. Say something like, “She said in her schoolgirl French. ‘I have a reservation. Does anyone here speak English?’ The male of the two clerks smiled and answer her in British-accented English. He said, ‘We both do. What is your name?’”

There are more techniques but those will work for most purposes.