Xbox One

Looks like the hard drive is non-replaceable.

Well, if you want to see positive reception, follow the links on this wonderful Kotaku article:

"Hey, I've just pulled my head out of my ass and HOLY COW! People all don't think the way we've been insisting they all think all along! Something must be wrong here!" *returns head into ass*

Really, I think "head-up-assery" is the best way to describe a lot of the "critics" I've seen who base their whiny complaints off of misinformation and ignorance. There's plenty of people who seem to think Microsoft didn't mention any games at all or at least want other people to believe that they didn't.

lilyWhite said:

Really, I think "head-up-assery" is the best way to describe a lot of the "critics" I've seen who base their whiny complaints off of misinformation and ignorance. There's plenty of people who seem to think Microsoft didn't mention any games at all or at least want other people to believe that they didn't.

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While there may some "head-up-assery" going on, from what I can tell, the negative reaction is primarily coming from gamers, i.e, the people who are the initial adopters, the people who go to midnight launches, the ones who care about console gaming. While they may be a small group, they are the ones who build up a new console's install base, usually paying a higher price than the average consumer who waits for the new box to become more affordable.

Microsoft offered very little that appealed to gamers yesterday. And while E3 is a few weeks away, the reveal gave a lot of people whose primary interest in a gaming console is the games, the impression that the new box is not primarily about gaming. Microsoft did mention a few games, only through prerendered video, there wasn't anything unexpected on that front. Whether or not Microsoft is being savvy by trying to be an all in one box is yet to be seen, but if they can't get gamers interested, I don't think it will go the way they expect.

As far as misinformation is concerned, Microsoft contributed their fair share. Contradictory reports of internet connection requirements and used game fees are the big issues for gamers. All of the other things it does, which there are still some questions (Is it a DVR? Is it a cable box? Are there cable providers attached or will you be able to use your own provider? Will any of these features work outside of the US?), won't amount to much--regardless of the mainstream-media's tendency to ooh and ah over The Next Big Thing.

I've never owned an X-box. I've got a PS3, a PS2 and Wii.

Why? I'm not going to pay to use the internet on my gaming system. I already pay for Netflix and Amazon Prime and my Internet Bill. That's more than $60 a month without adding on their pointless little fee.

Plus, I don't have cable. Seems like a pointless feature, IMO, when cable is going out of style. A lot of people only have cable to watch the news and HBO. I'm just waiting for HBO, AMC, and the-like to break apart from the cable package. I'm certainly not going to pay $50+ for 100 channels I never watch. Bad move for them, IMO.

The only thing that really pisses me off about Sony is the lack of backwards compatibility. And that you have to pay to update in the background.

But, I'll admit I'm biased. I've never cared for Call of Duty. I don't play sports games. I've got a Wii so I really don't need Kinect. Smartglass is neat and so is voice control (though my friend's doesn't work that great, tbh), but who really cares about using your gaming system in place of the DVR? You still have to pay to use Comcast's service.

8 gigs... hmmm. Not bad, I guess. I mean, my computer has 16. Kind of wishing they'd just release a decent emulator so I could build my own system and play the games on a custom mac pro.

I'm probably not going to get either. I'm happy with the Ps3. If anything, I'll buy another iphone or the newest macbook next year before I upgrade to a system that I'll only be able to afford 2 games to play on.

Do you have to pay the live fee to use Skype, too?

It looks like Indies will still, for the most part, be getting the shaft from Microsoft.

Which is an interesting (and not necessarily wise) move considering their competitors are aggressively courting indie developers to self-pub their games on the PS3/4/Vita and Wii/U.

thebloodfiend said:

I've never owned an X-box. I've got a PS3, a PS2 and Wii.

Why? I'm not going to pay to use the internet on my gaming system. I already pay for Netflix and Amazon Prime and my Internet Bill. That's more than $60 a month without adding on their pointless little fee.

Plus, I don't have cable. Seems like a pointless feature, IMO, when cable is going out of style. A lot of people only have cable to watch the news and HBO. I'm just waiting for HBO, AMC, and the-like to break apart from the cable package. I'm certainly not going to pay $50+ for 100 channels I never watch. Bad move for them, IMO.

The only thing that really pisses me off about Sony is the lack of backwards compatibility. And that you have to pay to update in the background.

But, I'll admit I'm biased. I've never cared for Call of Duty. I don't play sports games. I've got a Wii so I really don't need Kinect. Smartglass is neat and so is voice control (though my friend's doesn't work that great, tbh), but who really cares about using your gaming system in place of the DVR? You still have to pay to use Comcast's service.

8 gigs... hmmm. Not bad, I guess. I mean, my computer has 16. Kind of wishing they'd just release a decent emulator so I could build my own system and play the games on a custom mac pro.

I'm probably not going to get either. I'm happy with the Ps3. If anything, I'll buy another iphone or the newest macbook next year before I upgrade to a system that I'll only be able to afford 2 games to play on.

Do you have to pay the live fee to use Skype, too?

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For the current Xbox, yes.

I will be getting PS4 anyway.
I already own a Vita so that should be fun.

lilyWhite said:

Well, if you want to see positive reception, follow the links on this wonderful Kotaku article:

"Hey, I've just pulled my head out of my ass and HOLY COW! People all don't think the way we've been insisting they all think all along! Something must be wrong here!" *returns head into ass*

Really, I think "head-up-assery" is the best way to describe a lot of the "critics" I've seen who base their whiny complaints off of misinformation and ignorance. There's plenty of people who seem to think Microsoft didn't mention any games at all or at least want other people to believe that they didn't.

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Some of the information given has been contributed by MS themselves. And yeah, there were a few games mentioned, I guess. If you're really into EA games and Call of Duty, then you were more than satisfied yesterday. However, many gamers out there are tired of the next Call of Duty and EA games. Not to mention they cut into the announcement to mention more TV-related stuff: Halo TV Series and game/TV combo. Then they went right back to TV.

My friend who is a gamer, imports a ton of games from Japan, said she's not getting the Xbox One. Why? She was disappointed in the direction MS went. And as much of a fan as she is of Forza, Forza 5 isn't getting her to buy the next xbox.

MS is thinking about its coastal US consumers. That's who half the stuff they announced yesterday are aimed for. And as a gamer, if I'm getting a new console, I want it primarily for games. It's nice when a console can play DVDs and Blu-ray, yeah, but I don't want to watch TV on it. I don't want it cluttered with TV-related stuff. It's irritating enough with the 360's dashboard cluttered.

There's also the issue of the non-replaceable 500gig HDD. 500gig isn't that much in terms of games. Sure, you can attach an external HDD to it, but that's a hassle in itself. Most gamers want to be able to replace the HDD when it gets full. Not fiddle with an external one.

I'll wait until E3 to see what MS might have up their sleeves, if there's anything up there BESIDES TV-related. If they go right back to TV and skip out on the games again, leaving only a little section for it, I doubt ton of gamers are going to be very pleased.

kyocrisis said:

For the current Xbox, yes.

I will be getting PS4 anyway.
I already own a Vita so that should be fun.

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That's annoying. There's absolutely no reason you should pay a subscription fee to use a product you pay a separate fee for. Unless they offered an all inclusive bundle. Like Skype, Netflix, and Gamefly for $20 a month.

I'm waiting for either system to come with a SSD.

I've seen a few articles saying the X-Box one will be an Apple TV killer. I think that's kind of missing the point, though. People aren't going to buy an X-Box to be a media server with the live fee and people don't buy an Apple TV to be a gaming system. When I had an Apple TV, I used it to connect to my iTunes library and, of course, to work with Airplay.

Besides, Apple has always, IMO, had a better interface for things like that. Microsoft has always generally sucked for media interface. Windows Media Player, for me, is useless. Especially because I have an iPhone. And I don't know many people with a Zune. I think they should stick to gaming and not pissing people off with a new OS.

If the Apple press conference even hints at an iTV, I think they're going to be fucked in that regard. Apple can get away with their lack of customization and the ugly/simple/pretty aesthetic. I don't think something that should primarily be for gaming can do that.

So Phil Harrison tried (again) to clear up comment re: used games and sharing games and ... it's not looking good.

"What we're doing with the digital permissions that we have for Xbox One is no different to that. If I am playing on that disc, which is installed to the hard drive on my Xbox One, everybody in my household who has permission to use my Xbox One can use that piece of content. [So] I can give that piece of content to my son and he can play it on the same system."

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Hopefully that means multiple users on one system won't have to pay twice for the same content. Which, frankly, is a relief to me personally. But things look pretty grim as far as trading and borrowing games with people not tied to your personal console.

"I can come to your house and I can put the disc into your machine and I can sign in as me and we can play the game," he explained.

"The bits are on your hard drive. At the end of the play session, when I take my disc home - or even if I leave it with you - if you want to continue to play that game [on your profile] then you have to pay for it. The bits are already on your hard drive, so it's just a question of going to our [online] store and buying the game, and then it's instantly available to play.

"The bits that are on the disc, I can give to anybody else, but if we both want to play it at the same time, we both have to own it. That's no different to how discs operate today."

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I mean, yeah, that is how the whole disc system works in theory. But what about when I give my old games to friends when I'm done with them? Or for families that do (like he said in the first part) have multiple consoles? It's pretty doofy to expect them to pay.

There were also a few follow-ups regarding whether the XBO requires an always-on internet connection:

"Some bits of the system will work offline," he said. "I think the key point to make is that Xbox One requires an internet connection, but it does not need to be connected all the time. We think that most of the biggest games on Xbox One and most of the games and experiences and services you want to use will be internet-connected."

Everybody got that? Xbox One requires an internet connection, but not all the time.

"I don't want to trivialise the issue because I know people are passionate about it, but I think most people will realise that the vast majority of content and experiences that they will want to enjoy on Xbox One will be the ones that have an online connectivity," he continued.

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Basically what we already knew - they want to push the social and streaming aspects of the system. Which, you know, cool. Most of the games I like will probably remain single player, so whatever.

cryaegm said:

And yeah, there were a few games mentioned, I guess. If you're really into EA games and Call of Duty, then you were more than satisfied yesterday. However, many gamers out there are tired of the next Call of Duty and EA games.

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And that's probably why they mentioned games that weren't CoD or EA games, as well as the mention of upcoming exclusives.

There's also the issue of the non-replaceable 500gig HDD. 500gig isn't that much in terms of games. Sure, you can attach an external HDD to it, but that's a hassle in itself. Most gamers want to be able to replace the HDD when it gets full. Not fiddle with an external one.

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So they can fiddle with the "internal" hard drives whenever they need to swap hard drives to access different content?

I don't see them getting SSD's for awhile, at least next gen I'd presume since these are already confirmed.

Also your friends can't borrow your games, they can only play if you are there with them. Which essentially means NO USED GAMES ON XBOX without paying a fee, or rather, paying for the full game.

This solidifies PS4 for me.

lilyWhite said:

And that's probably why they mentioned games that weren't CoD or EA games, as well as the mention of upcoming exclusives.

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Some of the games were mentioned after the reveal (Assassin's Creed IV, Thief, Watch Dogs; however, those were a given that they would be on the Xbox One before it was revealed). Destiny was mentioned after the reveal, too. The ones that Microsoft mentioned were Forza 5, Fifa (EA), Madden (EA), NBA 14 (EA), UFC (EA), Quantum Break, and Call of Duty: Ghosts.

Anything else I'm missing? Because that's a bit all I can find besides the Xbox One having "15 exclusive titles", and a "historic IP" from Rare that they didn't mention the title of. Again, I'll wait for E3, but so far, none of those games mentioned during the reveal have interested me.

So they can fiddle with the "internal" hard drives whenever they need to swap hard drives to access different content?

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A lot of them from the get go will change out the hard drive for a bigger one and save their content there (makes more sense to upgrade the HDD to something bigger if you got, say the 4 gig 360 slim). The 360 HDD is quite easy to mess around with, anyway. All you have to do is "pop off" the HDD on the non-slim models (launch models, I don't know about) or remove the cover and pull the HDD out in the 360 slims. It's not like the PS3 HDD, but then I'm not sure what the HDD for the Xbox One is like. I guess it doesn't matter, anyway, since it's non-replaceable.

If the HDD was bigger than 500 gig, it wouldn't be such a big deal. Computer wise, with regular tasks and that isn't aimed at gaming, 500gig is a great size, maybe a little too big for some people. For gamers? 500 gig, especially for a new generation console like the Xbox One, it's a little too low. Then again, we don't know for sure how big the size of each game is; however, if you're saving and installing the disc to the HDD, it's going to go through 500 gigs quick. That's not to mention system updates.

*reads the thread*

Man I'm glad I'm a PC gamer...

Zoombie said:

*reads the thread*

Man I'm glad I'm a PC gamer...

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Boom. Zoomers wins again.

For my part, I have no skin in the console game, but if I was getting such conflicting reports about the next game/upgrade for my machine, I'd wait for the release and some trusted reviews before spending my green. Mind you, this is exactly why they offer pre-order deals and bundles... just in case it's not quite up to snuff.

Even without conflicting reports, you should definitely wait until after the release and some reviews come in until buying a new system.

Zoombie said:

*reads the thread*

Man I'm glad I'm a PC gamer...

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Seriously. I've always been both a PC/Console gamer, but I'm so glad I just bought a new graphics card (which, if the rumors are true, is more powerful than the cards that will be in these consoles). I'm really not excited for this gen of consoles at all.

My "VIDYA GAMES!!" compulsion will probably drive me to own both of them at some point, depending on how good the exclusive titles turn out. But for the first time since the SNES/Genesis days, I won't be an early adopter.

cryaegm said:

A lot of them from the get go will change out the hard drive for a bigger one and save their content there (makes more sense to upgrade the HDD to something bigger if you got, say the 4 gig 360 slim). The 360 HDD is quite easy to mess around with, anyway. All you have to do is "pop off" the HDD on the non-slim models (launch models, I don't know about) or remove the cover and pull the HDD out in the 360 slims. It's not like the PS3 HDD, but then I'm not sure what the HDD for the Xbox One is like. I guess it doesn't matter, anyway, since it's non-replaceable.

If the HDD was bigger than 500 gig, it wouldn't be such a big deal. Computer wise, with regular tasks and that isn't aimed at gaming, 500gig is a great size, maybe a little too big for some people. For gamers? 500 gig, especially for a new generation console like the Xbox One, it's a little too low. Then again, we don't know for sure how big the size of each game is; however, if you're saving and installing the disc to the HDD, it's going to go through 500 gigs quick. That's not to mention system updates.

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And then you'd either have to a.) move everything on the original hard drive to the larger hard drive, taking up time and essentially wasting the space on the original hard drive; or b.) switch hard drives every single time you need to access something on the other hard drive. It'd also mean that you'd likely have to buy internal hard drives made for the Xbox One, which would likely be more expensive than standard external hard drives and made only to a specific capacity limit—the largest Xbox 360 HDD I've seen online is 320GB, whereas there are multi-terabyte external hard drives available nowadays.

lilyWhite said:

And then you'd either have to a.) move everything on the original hard drive to the larger hard drive, taking up time and essentially wasting the space on the original hard drive; or b.) switch hard drives every single time you need to access something on the other hard drive. It'd also mean that you'd likely have to buy internal hard drives made for the Xbox One, which would likely be more expensive than standard external hard drives and made only to a specific capacity limit—the largest Xbox 360 HDD I've seen online is 320GB, whereas there are multi-terabyte external hard drives available nowadays.

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Again, like I said, we don't know what the Xbox One's HDD is. And since its non-replaceable, it doesn't matter, correct? Besides, I rather take a little time away than take up more space. Sure, there are flash drives, but even the 360 needs a specific flash drive to work, and they're not very big, either.

ETA: I have many systems, so they're not all hooked up. I take the time to get a game I want to play out of my dresser (all of them took up a lot of bookshelf space, so I moved them there), get the controllers, memory cards, whatever, and plug those in, then I plug the system into the TV and the outlet. Removing the harddrive and putting in another one for the 360 takes just as much time if not more. If I know which save is where for what game, it won't take long for me to go get it and use it.

Jim at the Escapist weighs in, and he doesn't like the Xbox One at all.

Everything that was revealed about this system has done nothing but convince me I shouldn't buy it.

While I am waiting to see how it really operates when it released to decide if I buy it or not, as of right now there is nothing to suggest the Xbox One is worth the cardboard box it would be packaged in.

Apparently the way the second-hand market will now work is this: in order to sell second-hand games at all, you will need to take your games in to a retailer which is signed up to Microsoft's kinda market/DRM thing. (No more buying games from charity shops.) That way when the new customer buys the disc, the retailer can deregister and reregister it.

A fee is payable by the retailer, which some reports are suggesting is £35, and which of course will be passed on to the customer. So the minimum price of a second-hand game will now, apparently, be £35-£40.

That would, obviously, be such bullshit.

Torgo said:

Apparently the way the second-hand market will now work is this: in order to sell second-hand games at all, you will need to take your games in to a retailer which is signed up to Microsoft's kinda market/DRM thing. (No more buying games from charity shops.) That way when the new customer buys the disc, the retailer can deregister and reregister it.

A fee is payable by the retailer, which some reports are suggesting is £35, and which of course will be passed on to the customer. So the minimum price of a second-hand game will now, apparently, be £35-£40.

That would, obviously, be such bullshit.

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For Xbox One games.
Yeah let me tell you how much I want to buy a 1-2 year old game for that much, I don't think so.