how can people afford to write for so little?

C.bronco · Oct 17, 2008

ladyvincenza said:
I heard Bill Maher say: "Pay peanuts, get monkeys," or something like that.
I realize I'm not the only one to say how lame it is that people expect writers to work for very little money, or for free! I mean, what is that? Do you expect to throw a rock and hit a good writer, or even a competent one? (I pay the people who do work for me. Do you expect your hair dresser, accountant, plumber to work for free?)
My question is, how can people afford to write for such a low rate? I see some offers for a penny a word, some even less. One person wanted to commission me to write a novel for something like $400 (I didn't take it). Another offered me 5K to write an ENTIRE psychology textbook (in two months!). I told them I couldn't afford it and they raised it to 7K. I didn't take it. That's particularly bad when you consider how much money text publishers have. They have expensive books and a captive audience.
Others, if you were prolific, you might earn $12, if they throw enough at you (like some blogging jobs).
I made the bad move of writing a long piece for a reference book. It was a lot of work and took a long time, but I thought it would be a feather in my cap (it wasn't, not really). It paid $250, which is probably something like $2/hr. How do they find people to write these? I think most of the writers were academics, and I know that academics don't get a whole lot of prestige getting published in encyclopedia.
Well, I could go on and on about offers I've taken and left, but my question is, like for the encyclopedia, who takes them?
Sarah

I LOVE monkeys!!!!! And I've been writing for free since I was 8. It seems as though I am incredibly dense. Oh well.

TheAntar · Oct 17, 2008

inkkognito said:
I see many jobs on Craiglist and other sources that I would never do because the wages are insanely low. I love to write, but it also has to be worth my while. I work with magazines that pay a good price, so I would see it as a waste of time to work for pennies.

However, I did just sign up for Demand Studios even tho' they only pay $15 an article. The articles are short and on topics I know well, so I can knock one out in 20 mins. (and a pretty decent quality too...I wouldn't want schlock with my name on it plastered all over the web). That means $45 an hour for something I can do in between other assignments. It's still lower than I make from magazines, but it's enough of an income supplement to make it worth my time.

I live in Canada. Apparently I was accepted at Designstudios until they found out I'm canadian and now I can't write for them. Bleh. Don't they just paypal you anyway? Why can't I work from up here?

/rips out hair

Flick Montana · Oct 18, 2008

If you make over 400 a year, you have to fill out tax forms. If they are based in the US, they probably can't hire you.

acousticgroupie · Oct 18, 2008

I think the people with good full-time jobs can afford to take the smaller stuff when it's on the side. Or if a spouse already provides the big needs.

Otherwise, I don't know!!

Storyteller5 · Oct 18, 2008

TheAntar said:
I live in Canada. Apparently I was accepted at Designstudios until they found out I'm canadian and now I can't write for them. Bleh. Don't they just paypal you anyway? Why can't I work from up here?

/rips out hair

I hear you. It's hard finding a starting point when so much information is posted from the US and you keep running into the border.

The_Grand_Duchess · Oct 19, 2008

zenwriter said:
I’m afraid I still don’t see it. As a freelancer, you build your own security net. If you are earning $10 an hour, that amounts to $1600 a month if you work 4 weeks, 40 hours per week. That is not including what you need to pay in taxes. Any sort of emergency – needed dental work, a pet that needs a hospital stay, a month of flu – can mean being suddenly in the red. Freelancers also have to pay for their own work equipment – computer, Internet hookup, etc. as well. There are many jobs in the freelancing world that do pay very well, so I just hate to see freelancers settle for less. Businesses do really well for themselves hiring freelancers and it seems to me that some of that should trickle down to the writer.

I agree that some jobs that pay a smaller amount per page or per article can add up to a decent wage.

I guess when it comes to writer’s wages, it is to each his or her own.

I agree with you that any thing like an emergency would put the freelance in the red but the same stands true for workers who don't have benefits to begin with. And as for equipment, (computer, internet) most people would have that anyway. Although if you just get a laptop with wireless then you can just steal the internets from other sources. Like your neighbors.

Its not that I don't agree that people should be paid more for what they do but you also have to think that sometimes it is just about the money. Sure I would want all my work to be a masterpiece but when somebody needs diapers (or food or whatever) those 15 articles for $4 a pop look mighty good. Les than two hours of work and suddenly the cash is there for whatever it is you need.

That's all I'm saying.

(oh and no worries about the 'you" thing. We all do that from time to time

)

Button · Oct 19, 2008

veinglory said:
People charge as much as they can. Those with skills and sense charge more. I really don't see the point--at all--of villifying those who work for less, or for free.

I agree.

Some individuals here might not ever work for less than $10 an hour, but other people can and do and live comfortably doing so. Trying to make people feel like idiots for being paid less is pointless. This is also comparing apples to oranges. There's different types of writing that pays a different levels and people will move toward the writing that they are most comfortable with.

Making villains out of people who are either doing it for fun or are comfortable with what they are being paid is just silly.

Take the jobs you want, leave the rest behind.

ladyvincenza · Oct 23, 2008

veinglory said:
People charge as much as they can. Those with skills and sense charge more. I really don't see the point--at all--of villifying those who work for less, or for free.

I don't vilify them at all. I'm asking how a professional writer can afford to do it.

Flick Montana · Oct 24, 2008

We can't ALL afford to do it. I don't have another job. All my money comes from writing and I can't pay the bills. I don't think many people who write for a penny a word CAN afford to do it. The math wouldn't make sense.

Think about it. A penny a word in a 300 word article. If it takes maybe 20 minutes to write, you have 9 dollars an hour. But that would mean having 24 articles AVAILABLE to write per day. I can barely get a couple. Even for people making five or ten cents per word, it still seems like a pittance.

MisterEThoughts · Jan 5, 2009

I definitely cannot afford it.

ShannonC_77 · Jan 6, 2009

TheAntar said:
I live in Canada. Apparently I was accepted at Designstudios until they found out I'm canadian and now I can't write for them. Bleh. Don't they just paypal you anyway? Why can't I work from up here?

/rips out hair

I found this out as well. It sucks sometimes - so many of the sites only accept you if you live in the states.

veinglory · Jan 6, 2009

Because they aren't professionals in a first world nation who need to make a living wage from that source. I would think that was self-evident.

bonobo_jones · Jan 7, 2009

ButtonTheCat said:
I agree.

Some individuals here might not ever work for less than $10 an hour, but other people can and do and live comfortably doing so. Trying to make people feel like idiots for being paid less is pointless.

Yeppers. I have a couple of ongoing writing gigs that may be considered low-paying, but I can make $10-15 an hour. And it's easy-peasy work. However I don't spend all day on these. I have some other writing jobs that pay quite a bit more, so my average hourly income is somewhat higher.

Honestly, if someone wants to write for two dollars an hour, it's no skin off my nose. Whether it's someone in India where $2/hour is great pay, or a stay-at-home mom happy that she can see her work published and make a little spending change on the side, what's the harm? These writers aren't going to go away, and nor should they.

caseyquinn · Jan 7, 2009

Well, keep in mind... many people work at a grocery store, movie theatre, fast food resturant as a profession for various reasons that is their line of work. They get paid minimum wage = 6 an hour.

If you can write and get paid 15 an hour by knocking out many small projects then what is the problem?

SouthernFriedJulie · Jan 7, 2009

This thread has bothered the heck out of me ever since it started. The idea that someone who takes less than someone else is not professional is just plain silly.

When you start out and are working your way up from nothing, you take what you can get. There is absolutely no harm or problem in it. The pay base for the 'upscale' writers should not go down. If a client decides to go with paying less and sends it to a writer who will take less, I guess that just means the client has a problem.

I started out by taking low, low paying gigs. It evolved to a point where I can now pretty much name my price with some of those same clients. One new contract of mine is very lucrative and comes from a client who I worked for in trade for products now and then. *GASP* I wrote pretty much for free!

Anyone who works their rear off, no matter what fee range can find themselves making a darn good living eventually. Maybe it takes a while. It took me over a year, BUT it came. Quality and going over the limit to provide great work pays off, no matter what.

So if you are feeling discouraged, don't. You can find higher paying jobs and use all of those low paying gigs as experience. Just don't find yourself tied to the low end forever. Keep looking for and applying to better jobs.

inkkognito · Jan 7, 2009

I've been pondering this topic a bit because I do some low-paying work even tho' I don't "need" to. I'm not going to get rich from my writing, but you can usually find a piece I've written on the stands in a big-box bookstore in any given month. I have two other businesses to keep me afloat, as well as a working DH who provides income and insurance.

Most of my low-paying work is done for enjoyment as much as for the $$. I've been blogging for years and earning maybe $100 a month from it, but the main pay is having an outlet. It started out as a personal journal that somehow picked up a following. Now I'm the Orlando Getaways Examiner for examiner.com and it looks as though the income level will be close to the blog, at least to start. Not a fortune, but I love to travel and write about it, so my examiner articles are as much a fun exercise for me as they are professional income-producers.

My magazine articles are my bread and butter and they feel like Work with a capital W. The low paying gigs are the fun stuff that just happen to bring in some income too.

how can people afford to write for so little?

C.bronco

I have plans...

TheAntar

Flick Montana

acousticgroupie

Storyteller5

Say something...

The_Grand_Duchess

I record everything.

Button

Resident in Question

ladyvincenza

user-set title

Flick Montana

MisterEThoughts

Writer

ShannonC_77

veinglory

volitare nequeo

bonobo_jones

Covered in dog hair

caseyquinn

Just happy to be here

SouthernFriedJulie

Hidin' the bodies

inkkognito

Onlyifyouwanttowillyoufin daway-Enya