"On Serious Literature" by Ursula le Guin

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Susan B

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Seems like a simple operational definition of current genre literature could be: Would a serious, well-educated adult feel a little apologetic about reading it? Consider it kind of a "guilty pleasure"?

You hear people "confess" they like: comic books, mysteries, sf, erotica, chick-lit.

You don't have to "confess" to reading poetry, literary fiction, history--or genre lit from days past, like Dickens!
 

dolores haze

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While I agree that genre fiction can be serious, I do think that some books are just mindless fun, and not serious at all.

I had the same thought as I eyed my stack of romance novels, and my husband's stack of sci-fi (which he proudly refers to as "pulp"). Serious books? Not really. Seriously popular? Absolutely.
 

Susan B

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I had the same thought as I eyed my stack of romance novels, and my husband's stack of sci-fi (which he proudly refers to as "pulp"). Serious books? Not really. Seriously popular? Absolutely.

Except here's the thing: I don't think they are necessarily any less "serious" or well-crafted, just on the basis of category alone. But there are clearly differences in how they are perceived.

Or another test: Do you feel guilty for confessing you've never read something?
 

Summonere

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Oh, Medievalist, I got one for you that modern genre categorizers struggle with:

Perdido Street Station
China Mieville and others authors like him describe their work as "new weird," in which the aim is to mish-mash genres. In other words "speculative fiction by another name." Haven't read PSS, by the way, but have read his King Rat and enjoyed it.
 

JAlpha

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But are these really genres (epistolary, bildungsroman, etc.) or are they just forms of literary expression or plot? I'm not a scholar so I'm just asking -- what is the definition of genres, and how is it different than the commercial definition (such as SF, romance, etc.)?


This definition of genre from Notes in the Margin's Glossary of Literary terms http://www.notesinthemargin.org/glossary.html#g is my favorite . . .

genre
“Used to designate the types or categories into which literary works are grouped according to form, technique, or, sometimes, subject matter. The French term means “kind,” “genus,” or “type.” The traditional genres include tragedy, comedy, epic, lyric, and pastoral. Today a division of literature into genres would also include novel, short story, essay, television play, and motion picture scenario. [. . .] Critics today frequently regard genre distinctions as useful descriptive devices but rather arbitrary ones. Genre boundaries have been much subject to flux and blur in recent times, and it is almost the rule that a successful work will combine genres in some original way” (Source: Harmon & Holmon, 231).

The related term genre fiction refers to several types of popular fiction such as thrillers, westerns, mysteries, romance novels, and science fiction. Each type has its own set of standard characteristics that most novels of the type exhibit. Genre fiction is often used pejoratively to mean something like “mere genre fiction,” which refers to a formulaic novel that rigidly follows the conventions of its type and exhibits little creativity.
 
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dolores haze

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Seems like a simple operational definition of current genre literature could be: Would a serious, well-educated adult feel a little apologetic about reading it? Consider it kind of a "guilty pleasure"?

You hear people "confess" they like: comic books, mysteries, sf, erotica, chick-lit.

You don't have to "confess" to reading poetry, literary fiction, history--or genre lit from days past, like Dickens!

Interesting. Personally, I'm way beyond regarding my genre reading pleasure as a guilty one, though the snobbery of people who only read serious lit can be a little galling. It's just as irritating as the genre only reader who would mock someone for reading a "serious" book. "Why do that to yourself?" asked my friend, who reads ONLY romance novels, when I told her about the personal memoir/holocaust book I was reading.
I think the divide between "genre" and "serious" is a little silly myself, and is why I posted Le Guin's essay. I've read too many "serious" books that were also "genre" novels to buy in to the artificial divide.

But I don't think all genre novels are "serious", though they may be well crafted and be about a serious subject.
 
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dolores haze

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This definition of genre from Notes in the Margin's Glossary of Literary terms http://www.notesinthemargin.org/glossary.html#g is my favorite . . .


genre
“Used to designate the types or categories into which literary works are grouped according to form, technique, or, sometimes, subject matter. The French term means “kind,” “genus,” or “type.” The traditional genres include tragedy, comedy, epic, lyric, and pastoral. Today a division of literature into genres would also include novel, short story, essay, television play, and motion picture scenario. [. . .] Critics today frequently regard genre distinctions as useful descriptive devices but rather arbitrary ones. Genre boundaries have been much subject to flux and blur in recent times, and it is almost the rule that a successful work will combine genres in some original way” (Source: Harmon & Holmon, 231).​


The related term genre fiction refers to several types of popular fiction such as thrillers, westerns, mysteries, romance novels, and science fiction. Each type has its own set of standard characteristics that most novels of the type exhibit. Genre fiction is often used pejoratively to mean something like “mere genre fiction,” which refers to a formulaic novel that rigidly follows the conventions of its type and exhibits little creativity.​

Thank you, JAlpha.
 

Celia Cyanide

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Except here's the thing: I don't think they are necessarily any less "serious" or well-crafted, just on the basis of category alone.

I agree with you. I found it amusing that Romance as a genre was often ridiculed as crap at my college. Yet it never occured to them that a lot of what they were reading--Jane Austen, Shakespeare, The Brontes--had a love story as the central focus of the plot, which is technically what makes a book a Romance.

But I do not agree that all literature is serious. I don't think that a book is serious just by virtue of it being a book. Just like anything else, music, movies, etc. Some of it is junk, some of it is serious, and some of it is mindless fun.
 

maestrowork

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The discussion on what is "genre fiction" somehow resembles the discussions on what is "literary fiction." ;) Seems like there's a classical definition, and then there's a current market definition.

As far as "serious" is concerned, who gets to decide?
 

maestrowork

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I agree with you. I found it amusing that Romance as a genre was often ridiculed as crap at my college. Yet it never occured to them that a lot of what they were reading--Jane Austen, Shakespeare, The Brontes--had a love story as the central focus of the plot, which is technically what makes a book a Romance.


Interesting indeed. Barnes & Noble categorizes my book as literary/literature and Borders categorizes it as "romance." It certainly is not a "genre romance" in the same vein as a Harlequin line, but at the same time, I can't really deny that there is a love story, which means it IS romance. Like Medievalist said upthread, most books can be categorized into different genres. I guess the idea is, how many genres can a book fit into? And if a book crosses literary, romance, and SF/F, for example, would it be considered "serious" then? Or what really is "serious" vs. "pulp"? And then when you mix in the definition of "commercial" vs. "literary" we have a whole different ball of yarn.
 

Celia Cyanide

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I suppose it would depend on where it would be most likely to be seen and picked up by readers. For example, if your book were at my college book store, it would not be in the "romance" section, because students would be less inclined to look there.

I always say I don't want my story to be categorized as YA. But I suppose that if it were to be published, some places would put it there, because it is a very popular genre.
 

maestrowork

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I suppose it would depend on where it would be most likely to be seen and picked up by readers. For example, if your book were at my college book store, it would not be in the "romance" section, because students would be less inclined to look there.

A lot of times it's not up to us to decide. Whether it's the publisher's, the distributor's, or the book seller's decision... for example, I had no control over Border's decision to shelf my book as romance. Chances are, people who are into the "genre" romance won't pick up my book, and people who may be interested in my book won't go to the romance aisle. Again, I, as the author, have no control over this.

Still, who or what defines something as "serious" and not? Is it how the book is shelved? Marketed? Or how the readers react? And which readers?
 

Soccer Mom

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:popcorn: I like my fiction like I like my food. Sometimes I want steak. Sometimes I want a candy bar. But I like (and pay for) both.
 
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