How much money do novels make?

Jamesaritchie · Jun 17, 2007

Scenario

Anthony Ravenscroft said:
How about this scenario, only somewhat exaggerated from normal reality.

Your book gets sold to a house. Their marketing people go great guns, & sell 1,000 copies to each&every B&N and Borders and Hastings and Books-A-Million under the sun, plus 5,000 copies to every Wal-Mart, Sam's, & Costco. Your publisher is ecstatic, takes all these advance orders, & not only prods them to order more but gets all sorts of orders from mid-tier outlets.

The house gives you $15 million. Your book rockets to the top of every list. Your next book is rushed into editing & you get pressure for #3.

Three weeks after it's released, 95% of the chain-store copies are pulled & returned. From the big-box stores, it's 98%.

If you didn't read your contract properly, you not only give up the advance on the returns but have to pay for their disposal. Then again, your agent made 20% & has no intention of giving that back to you. Your literary career is a giant smoking crater about the size of Hudson's Bay.

And you're far more likely to have this experience than that of, say, Rowling or King or Robb or Koontz or....

That scenario has never happened, and never will happen. Not one piece of it is anything like realistic. It isn't just exaggerated a million times over, it's pure fantasy.

dantem42 · Jun 18, 2007

Anthony Ravenscroft said:
Your book gets sold to a house. Their marketing people go great guns, & sell 1,000 copies to each&every B&N and Borders and Hastings and Books-A-Million under the sun, plus 5,000 copies to every Wal-Mart, Sam's, & Costco. Your publisher is ecstatic, takes all these advance orders, & not only prods them to order more but gets all sorts of orders from mid-tier outlets.

------------------

If you didn't read your contract properly, you not only give up the advance on the returns but have to pay for their disposal. Then again, your agent made 20% & has no intention of giving that back to you. Your literary career is a giant smoking crater about the size of Hudson's Bay.

And you're far more likely to have this experience than that of, say, Rowling or King or Robb or Koontz or....

Hmm. I have my doubts. I think they're both equally as likely as the sun turning into a black hole this week and gobbling up the earth.

No publishing marketers, no matter how savvy, are gong to get the Borders and B&N's of the world to overstock in that manner. Everything else in the place would have to be tied to it -- window displays, floor displays and whatnot. It's just not gonna happen unless you've got color glossies of the store managers in flagrante delicto with barnyard animals.

And my redoubtable agent has told me -- only an agent with a brain hernia would allow a contract where the advance was subject to return in any way, shape or form, or where the writer was subject to any other costs of the publication process.

aruna · Jun 18, 2007

Delarege said:
I never understood why a publisher would hand out an exorbitant advance. If the book is going to pay out that much in royalties, a low advance isn't going to cause the author any loss. The money just comes later.

The thing is, royalties only start coming in much later, maybe three years after the book has been acquired. A publisher of a promising first novel probably wants that writer to keep writing, which is only possible if he/she can buy time. It's hard to write if you've got money worries. So I understand a big advance as a way of keeping the writer's head above water financially in order for him/her to write books 2 and 3.

Also, a large advance helps to create media buzz. It then becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy,. It shows the media that the publisher believes in the book.

I never knew that big publishers in the US pay only $7500 advance. It seems to me that in the UK it is much, much more for a promising first novel. How are you supposed to keep going on $7500 minus agents fees, minus tax?

aruna · Jun 18, 2007

Will Lavender said:
Foreign rights have been important for me. I didn't know a thing about them before my novel was sold, and now the foreign sales are a big part of why I'm going to be able to stay home and write next year.

For me too. Royalties from foreign sales have kept me going long after the British advances ran out.

RoccoMom · Jun 19, 2007

But there are some first-timers who did get excellent advances, and I believe they even post on this forum. it can happen.

jchines · Jun 19, 2007

Tobias Buckell did a great survey for first-time novel advances in SF/F. The median advance came out to $5000 ($6000 with adjustments for inflation.)

You can see that survey at http://www.tobiasbuckell.com/2005/10/05/author-advance-survey-version-20/

For me, domestic and foreign advance money put my first novel up to around $10,000. Not enough for me to quit my day job, especially after my agent's commission and taxes, but I'm not going to complain, either.

AndreaGS · Jun 25, 2007

What a great thread! I've been rather ignorant on the subject; for some reason I thought the most I could ever expect as an advance was $2,000. I expect to keep a day job for a while, so some of these numbers are really encouraging.

How much money do novels make?

Jamesaritchie

dantem42

aruna

On a wing and a prayer

aruna

On a wing and a prayer

RoccoMom

jchines

Got the hang of it, here

AndreaGS