Differences in children's fiction

ascribe · Apr 14, 2008

Apart from the obvious difference in language, does anyone know if there are any major differences between British and American children's fiction?
Are some themes more popular in one country than another? Is there a difference in length, pov, content etc.
I'm wondering because it might be useful to know both for anyone looking to publish in the other country or even just to comment in SYW.

Elliot Cowan · Apr 14, 2008

When I moved to the US my girlfriend was just getting into Harry Potter and I would read to her in the evenings.
The first book, Philosopher's Stone is retitled as you probably know, but it also contains quite a few American changes throughout the book.
It is very odd to read something you know well and discover that it's different.
A bit like drinking diet coke when you mean it to be full strength.
They didn't bother to meddle with the rest of the series which suggests that some particularly British things are now generally understood.

I'd suggest that the Brits have a history of much gentler, but often more adventurous writing for children.
Here in the US, much classic childrens literature from Britain seems very distant and twee...

ascribe · Apr 15, 2008

Anyone know what kind of changes were made? It seems strange that they suddenly didn't become necessary. Maybe the film played a part in that.
I haven't read much American children's fiction but I was brought up on Enid Blyton. 'Twee' is a very polite way of putting it. I'd like to think we've moved on but perhaps we haven't got as far along the road.
Does anyone know if there've been changes to other books such as the Horrid Henry or Tracey Beaker series?

timewaster · Apr 15, 2008

[I'd suggest that the Brits have a history of much gentler, but often more adventurous writing for children.
Here in the US, much classic childrens literature from Britain seems very distant and twee...[/quote]

That hasn't been my experience. I have had to tone things down much more for the US than for the UK.

ascribe · Apr 15, 2008

What kinds of thing have you toned down? Are there things you've written that you know are unsuitable for the US or things you've written specifically for the US that wouldn't work in the UK?

timewaster · Apr 15, 2008

ascribe said:
What kinds of thing have you toned down? Are there things you've written that you know are unsuitable for the US or things you've written specifically for the US that wouldn't work in the UK?

I have written several YA novels which were jointly published by Bloomsbury and Bloomsbury US. The US editor was much more concerend about sexual content than the UK one. Violence has also been more of an issue for the US market.
I am a Brit so I write for a British audience primarily. The UK has neither a big library market nor a religious right which in practical terms means we have fewer marketing constraints, though a much smaller overall market.
YMMV

Hillary · Apr 15, 2008

Just wondering why you're asking... Because no matter what country you get published in, if foreign rights are sold, you'll have a foreign editor making all the necessary changes.

And I could be very wrong, but I don't think the styles of books being accepted are so widely different that one country would turn it down completely and the other would hand you a massive advance. (Though it's always possible!) Basically, in my opinion, the time to worry about differences is when your editor says "We sold the UK/US rights. Let's talk about THIS." You know? So are you having trouble getting published in one country and wish to try to submit primarily to the other? Because I'm not sure that is a solution, really. Again, I might be wrong.

Elliot Cowan · Apr 15, 2008

timewaster said:
[I'd suggest that the Brits have a history of much gentler, but often more adventurous writing for children.
Here in the US, much classic childrens literature from Britain seems very distant and twee...

timewaster said:
That hasn't been my experience. I have had to tone things down much more for the US than for the UK.

I was referring to classic literature here Timewaster, not necessarily what's being produced at the moment.

ascribe · Apr 15, 2008

Hillary said:
Just wondering why you're asking... Because no matter what country you get published in, if foreign rights are sold, you'll have a foreign editor making all the necessary changes.

And I could be very wrong, but I don't think the styles of books being accepted are so widely different that one country would turn it down completely and the other would hand you a massive advance. (Though it's always possible!) Basically, in my opinion, the time to worry about differences is when your editor says "We sold the UK/US rights. Let's talk about THIS." You know? So are you having trouble getting published in one country and wish to try to submit primarily to the other? Because I'm not sure that is a solution, really. Again, I might be wrong.

I was asking more out of interest than anything else. I'm not finding it easy getting published in the UK but I believe I've more chance having read more of the books. I haven't read much from the US at all.
Anything I do know (or think I do) I've picked up from SYW. It seems that the picture book length varies more for example. I just wondered if there were other differences that I wasn't aware of.

Elliot Cowan · Apr 15, 2008

Interesting you should say that.
When I left Australia I chose to go to the UK because I always felt my work would be more likely to find a home there than the US.
My family is from the UK so I felt I had ties to the place.
My work is quirky in what I felt was a more British way.
And I was getting enthusiastic feedback from my friends in the arts in the UK more than those in the US.
I didn't manage to sell a single solitary thing.
The most I managed was a very good rejection letter.
I've been tackling US agents with the same material for only a month or so and already I'm getting positive feedback.
Shows what I know...

MsJudy · Apr 15, 2008

I would think that one of the differences is that Americans tend to be rather...provincial? As a rule, we don't learn foreign languages, or travel to other countries, or pay attention to world news and events. So I would bet that fewer changes have to made to suit a US book to a foreign audience than fitting a foreign book to a US audience. And as was already pointed out, the religious right in the US tends to voice its opinions. (Scrotum, anyone?) I've had parents complain because at Chinese New Year I hang a red dragon in my classroom and teach kids the Chinese Zodiac.

On the other hand, there are so dang many people in the US, people with money, that I would imagine it's much easier to find a niche for all kinds of things.

Elliot Cowan · Apr 15, 2008

JudScotKev said:
(Scrotum, anyone?)

I have one!

CDarklock · Apr 15, 2008

What I've noticed in British children's fiction as opposed to American is a generally better grasp of the reality that children not only grow up, but have grown-up ideas at an early age. Parents and authority figures are allowed to be properly oppressive in British literature, and children are overall more like real children rather than some strange christmas-special invention.

This didn't used to be as pronounced in the 1970s, but in the 1980s I had to more or less stop reading American children's and YA books. They just didn't ring true anymore.

Elliot Cowan · Apr 15, 2008

CDarklock said:
What I've noticed in British children's fiction as opposed to American is a generally better grasp of the reality that children not only grow up, but have grown-up ideas at an early age. Parents and authority figures are allowed to be properly oppressive in British literature, and children are overall more like real children rather than some strange christmas-special invention.

Probably very true.
Nice comment.

ascribe · Apr 16, 2008

JudScotKev said:
I would think that one of the differences is that Americans tend to be rather...provincial? As a rule, we don't learn foreign languages, or travel to other countries, or pay attention to world news and events. So I would bet that fewer changes have to made to suit a US book to a foreign audience than fitting a foreign book to a US audience. And as was already pointed out, the religious right in the US tends to voice its opinions. (Scrotum, anyone?) I've had parents complain because at Chinese New Year I hang a red dragon in my classroom and teach kids the Chinese Zodiac.

On the other hand, there are so dang many people in the US, people with money, that I would imagine it's much easier to find a niche for all kinds of things.

The way I see it, there might be more of a market but there's also more competition. I think I'd sooner be a small fish in a medium sized pool.

MsJudy · Apr 16, 2008

On a related note:

My latest edition of the American Federation of Teachers magazine (for you Brits--one of two national teachers' unions) has a debate between a retired teacher and a librarian over whether or not Captain Underpants should be allowed in classrooms and school libraries. Whether or not talking toilets are just too crass for our educational system.

Elliot Cowan · Apr 16, 2008

Yes, it's a difficult one.
I just spent a few minutes flicking through one on Amazon (I'd not see one before).
I really liked the writing style and would be pleased to have my kids read it but I'm not sure if it belongs in a classroom either...
I'd certainly have it in a library though.

ascribe · Apr 17, 2008

I vaguely remember there was a bit of fuss some years ago about a children's christian poetry book that had some reference to toilets in the title. I don't know whether or not it reached the classrooms but I bet it reached more children because of all the publicity.

jbryson · Apr 21, 2008

Gotta Ask

JudScotKev said:
On a related note:

My latest edition of the American Federation of Teachers magazine (for you Brits--one of two national teachers' unions) has a debate between a retired teacher and a librarian over whether or not Captain Underpants should be allowed in classrooms and school libraries. Whether or not talking toilets are just too crass for our educational system.

Sorry, but I gotta ask: Which side was which on?

MsJudy · Apr 21, 2008

The old geezer--um, I mean, retired teacher--felt talking toilets had no place in a classroom. The wise and currently employed librarian took the position that if Captain Underpants turned boys onto reading, then she'd be able to steer them towards better literature once they were hooked.

(oops...my bias is showing...)

Differences in children's fiction

ascribe

I...love...rejections

Elliot Cowan

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timewaster

present

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timewaster

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Hillary

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Elliot Cowan

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Elliot Cowan

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MsJudy

Elliot Cowan

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CDarklock

Yes!

Elliot Cowan

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MsJudy

Elliot Cowan

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jbryson

MsJudy