Is there such a thing as erotic horror?

[Kerr]

Hi everybody. I have a short story close to the finish line. It somehow came out of one of Soccer Mom's prompts. Who knew. I don't read erotica so I got the password to have a look around. Looks like according to the post in the doorway, that my story has really overstepped even the erotica SYW. I concerns a man who can't believe his luck that he's getting picked up by a beautiful redhead, but she turns out to be much more than he could ever imagine.

It's erotic, I guess, in the same vein as Species. I stopped at a key point, but the horror is buildingand I fear the sex will end badly for him, lol. I was thinking only to write a short story. Short horror is not generally so sexually graphic. Is there a market for this kind of thing? Am I wasting my time?

[Stacia Kane]

Poppy Z Brite seems to think there is, so... :)

[JanDarby]

I think I've seen some at either cleansheets.com or the erotica readers and writers site (always forget the URL -- google erotica readers, and you'll find it). Or maybe fishnetmag.com.

It's definitely seen in the "erotica" market (as opposed to the "erotic romance" market, which is different). You'd just have to do some extra research for a market.

JD

[kropedykrop]

Check out the "Hot Blood" series. Amazon has some reviews...

[bluntforcetrauma]

I think I'll write one, got the perfect title:

Here Come Those Effin' Monsters! :?D

[thmilin]

oh yeah, erotic horror this is a big genre, especially of the "dark goth" fan base. there's a whole slew of folks who like blood and gore mixed in with their sex, however, as you guess couples don't end up happily ever after.

the tricky thing with finding them is that they are often overlapped with other categories like dark fantasy, gothic horror, etc. where the romance/drama/blood/romance of a horror story are absorbed into the subgenre (fantasy, gothic). an example is "dracula" which is categorized under various genres, some of them just plain old horror, but which we all know includes sex with vampires.

- poppy z brite is definitely one author.
- clive barker (hellraiser, anyone?)

most current "dark" vampire/lust anthologies and collections (not the romantic flirty ones or the action horror ones like laurell k hamilton).

you can do a search for genre keywords with bn.com and amazon.com:

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_ss_b/103-6011557-8639817?url=search-alias%3Dstripbooks&field-keywords=erotic+horror

the tricky thing for you is to evaluate if you began a horror story that turned into a piece of erotica, set in a horrific situation/scene/locale. this would target those of darker inclinations who enjoy erotica more when it involves terror, pain, pushing the edge, and extreme situations.

or, whether you're still writing a horror story that simply contains erotic elements. this would feed those who like the fear and adventure of a scary situation but who are not seeking out sex/erotic elements. in this case, you're looking for adult readers who wouldn't mind the sexual content or be distracted by it, and you would have to meet their needs with a well-crafted horror story, notwithstanding any sex scenes.

in either case, you will have a large market to tap, you'll just have to explore which genre best fits your story. you'll have to be especially careful with pursuing the latter so that you publish where you'll be welcome. for example, if your story is really erotic horror, which is entirely different from horror with hot sex in it, you may get cold rejection from readers who were expecting something entirely different.

an example is what's happening with laurell k hamilton's work right now, which began very low on the sex, with hints of sexuality, and lots of violence, buttkicking, vampires, killing, and gore. by book 3-5 she was adding in tons of sex and all her relationships with her buttkicking team were built on sex or the potential for sex. which offended a lot of readers and made them bail on her because they had not signed up for erotic horror, which is frankly what her series turned into (which i was completely fine with :).

i should note that there are "grades" of erotic horror ... some of the stuff out there is really dark and violent, and would make laurell K hamilton's stuff seem like butterflies and spangles.

so what you might do is post your story or share it with others to see how truly "erotic" it is for readers. if they don't feel it's so erotic, then you know you're better off pursuing the horror genre and you'll just have a sexual theme in your story.

[veinglory]

To my mind erotic horror needs to have generuine horror elements. Poppy Z Brite often does but others often don't. I can think of a few examples by plot but couldn;t Google up the names. One involved a blob-like creature that kind of masturbated people to get them to stay still while it amalgamated them into a group entity. There was an anthology called Alien Sex that was erotic and horror in most of the stories.

[Kerr]

Thanks everybody. thmilin, you kind of lost me in that explanation, the story plopping out of a prompt, and all. It's not the norm and took me by surprise. It didn't even start as horror, just a guy waiting for a taxi in the rain. Then it just kind of took over, the guy not so nice, a woman becoming monstrous. I scared myself. I sat there wondering, What? Horny? Sick? Hate men? What? But what fun! I was enjoying myself more than I had in a long time.

I gave what I had so far to my daughter to read yesterday. She reads all my stuff. She said the same. "Now, you're starting to scare me, Mom."

She had a strange look in her eye, it might have come from a new light she was seeing me under. Fact was, though, I had to keep track of the baby because she was too busy reading. Usually it's the other way around, she can't stay focused lately.

I said that it looked like she was really into it. She said she was, it's good. Of course, she always says that, like encouragement, but this time she looked it, if you know what I mean. So, I guess I'm frightened because I just opened a door that I hadn't known was there. I do always have a problem with pushing the horror in the ways that the horror folks like it pushed, but mixing it with sex, a few lewd thoughts and various vulgarities definitely brings the pot to a rollicking boil.

Okay, now I think I'm geared to go put an end to this man. I'll be back.

[thmilin]

ahoy!

Thanks everybody. thmilin, you kind of lost me in that explanation, the story plopping out of a prompt, and all. It's not the norm and took me by surprise.

hmm, i'm not sure what you mean by "the story plopping out of a prompt" unless that had nothing to do with me being confusing. :)

sorry about that, i was running all my thoughts together to basically say, you have to figure out what you ended up writing first. whether it is truly horror, with sexual elements, or erotic horror. whichever it is, yes, you'll have a market. the rest of the post was all just examples and supporting commentary. ;)

i think it's a good thing you're scaring yourself! and i'd never be so brave as to let my family or even closest friends read my work for the very reason you stated - now your daughter may or may not be looking at you in a new light based on your work! but again, that's mighty brave, and i admire it and wish i had the same guts.

mixing it with sex, a few lewd thoughts and various vulgarities definitely brings the pot to a rollicking boil.

i personally agree and am very attracted to those very aspects. sex is a very real, raw, and visceral activity. it is not always flowers, perfume, sun rays, and murmured love words.

i'm excited for you that you're exploring this new aspect to your writing, and wish you lots of juice!*

* juice = creative power, endurance, discipline, and deftness

[Kerr]

hmm, i'm not sure what you mean by "the story plopping out of a prompt" unless that had nothing to do with me being confusing. :)

i think it's a good thing you're scaring yourself! and i'd never be so brave as to let my family or even closest friends read my work for the very reason you stated - now your daughter may or may not be looking at you in a new light based on your work! but again, that's mighty brave, and i admire it and wish i had the same guts.

i personally agree and am very attracted to those very aspects. sex is a very real, raw, and visceral activity. it is not always flowers, perfume, sun rays, and murmured love words.


I guess I was confused because last night I really hadn't thought further than the fact that the story crossed over my own limits. I reread what I had written and, yes, it's beyond horror. It definitely crosses into erotica, and this without yet reaching climax. lol Hence, my terror and need to show my daughter what I'm working on. This goes against my grain. I'm still wondering what I'm doing in here. I feel writing erotica is akin to stripping to support the kids. What will I tell them later? How will I account for myself, live with myself if they are suddenly ashamed that I'm their mother/ grandmother. My daughter's thirty. If I can write it, she can handle reading it. But if I write it, and continue to write it--if I publish it, make a name, how will they feel if someone one day writes Kerr is so-and-so. Best I face that now while I'm only considering. If she had reacted strongly the story would have been over.

The writing, though, made me feel alive with abandon, carefree, reckless. Young? But no, I didn't finish. I fell asleep. And today I've been sick. Perhaps tomorrow. Thanks for listening as I consider through this same strange new world.

[thmilin]

kerr, i think you're going through what all erotica writers go through, what all writers who may socially be seen as "crossing the line" go through.

but it's a core question to being an author. did you ever write a story or an essay or a paragraph filled with truth you had to read or share with others? did the subjects of your story squirm or react to how you perceived them? even with fiction, we capture truths on paper, gathering details and images and reflecting them back to the world, and some people don't like it. they are creeped out by what we make, the skill and power we have. it's easily ignored in the day to day but when it's YOU and YOUR family it becomes very personal and suddenly you feel very beholden.

i think we can all understand and relate to what you're going through.

now, i began reading erotica at a very, illegal, young age. the kind of age that would make most adults uncomfortable. i came to it on my own. i began writing it at 10 or so. i KNEW what i wanted to write, even as a child. and the whole time, i knew it would be seen as taboo, wrong, gross, scary, shameful, etc. etc.

in writing erotica, you realize others are going to judge you. they are going to make assumptions about who and what you are and what your mind is capable of. they're going to put you in a box, or remove you from the mental "i understand this" box and put you in the "i don't understand or trust this box."

like anything else you might choose in your life, kerr, that is their problem - and only yours if you make it yours. family notwithstanding, you have every right as a human being and artist to create, to create what moves you, what breathes life into your very soul, what makes you burn with inner joy and power.

if that happens to be scifi, fantasy, horror, erotica, thrillers, whatever it is - that is your sacred inborn talent, and nothing to be ashamed of.

my personal choice was to use my real name. i knew that one day i may have to deal with the fact that my real name was on a cover of a book that others would judge me by. but i also know that what i write i write for me, and for my reader, and for those who judge - it's not for them. so they can despise it, mock it, be afraid of it - but if they are too afraid to get to know it or respect it, then i am not going to waste my time being afraid of what they think of what i make, or me.

i understand that you have, to date, developed a certain "reputation" with your family, friends, community. you may not want to risk that reputation. if your fear is that strong, there are ways to write what you love or what excites you (that's not even necessarily a sexual excitement) and to maintain the reputation. then when you feel comfortable enough, perhaps after a few years of having done it, you can broach the topic with your friends and family and let them know that this is something you believe in, something that moves you, something you dont' want to stop doing - something that's a part of you.

as for strippers - if you feel that what strippers do is lowly and beneath you, then yes, you have a moral dilemma. but things are never black and white. some strippers are true artists. some are the kindest, smartest, bravest, most talented women, who happen to create magic by unveiling their bodies. some are probably crass, bitter, used up, trashy, negative beings. and some are probably saints.

as long as you are adding something GOOD to the world - adding something new and unique only YOU could give to it, what does it matter? if you are making art, art you believe in, why should you hide it away or never finish the story because someone else might not like the fact you wrote it? because someone else might not feel comfortable your brain is capable of going there?

if anything, that feels wrong to me. even if it's just between you and the computer, the story deserves to be written. if a story is in your head, it's alive. it deserves to live. that's why you're a writer. that is what you do. that is who you are.

i hope i haven't come off to preachy, but it just gets my goat to see someone so obviously enjoy creating something, something new and scary and different, but something that brings them joy and fear and excitement - and talk about not doing it at all, or being afraid of doing it at all, because of what others might think about the creation, or the fact you create it.

gets my goat, it does!! i'll shut up now. :)

I guess I was confused because last night I really hadn't thought further than the fact that the story crossed over my own limits. I reread what I had written and, yes, it's beyond horror. It definitely crosses into erotica, and this without yet reaching climax. lol Hence, my terror and need to show my daughter what I'm working on. This goes against my grain. I'm still wondering what I'm doing in here. I feel writing erotica is akin to stripping to support the kids. What will I tell them later? How will I account for myself, live with myself if they are suddenly ashamed that I'm their mother/ grandmother. My daughter's thirty. If I can write it, she can handle reading it. But if I write it, and continue to write it--if I publish it, make a name, how will they feel if someone one day writes Kerr is so-and-so. Best I face that now while I'm only considering. If she had reacted strongly the story would have been over.

The writing, though, made me feel alive with abandon, carefree, reckless. Young? But no, I didn't finish. I fell asleep. And today I've been sick. Perhaps tomorrow. Thanks for listening as I consider through this same strange new world.

[Kerr]

Tri,

Thank you, because I'm too old for this, and because I don't judge anyone harshly in this life but myself. It ties me up in knots sometimes and you've hit all the nails on the head. I think I will copy your post out and place it into my files to reread like a mantra whenever I feel my knees get shaky. I'm glad I got your goat. I say these things to myself, but it does ever so much more good to hear it from someone else.

[Elliot Cowan]

Dracula is often considered an erotic character (although I honestly don't recall that subtext in the book).
An ex of mine used to have erotic dreams in which Michael York in vampire mode would climb in through the window and "do things" to her.

[DWSTXS]

I think it's a very narrow genre. Sort of like Christian Erotica.

[Jordi]

The only books that I think may be erotic horror are Sherrilyn Kenyon's Dark Hunter series and Christine Feehan's Dark series. They both deal with vampires and vampire types, especially in the Christine Feehan books.

[HeronW]

erotic story collections: Hot Blood, Hotter Blood, Hottest Blood: Eds. J. Gelb & M. Garrett

[Keyan]

Anne Bishop's Black Jewels trilogy would qualify, IMO.

[thmilin]

Anne Bishop's Black Jewels trilogy would qualify, IMO.

mmm, i dunno about those. they're definitely a bit dark, but they're way more romance than horror or erotica. there's no eviscerated guts, screaming, impaling, disfiguration, cutting, etc.., and no penises, orgasms, bodily fluids, or full on sex scenes.

just more of the grand romance of the supernatural (vampires, magic) mixed with fantasy. like Sunny and the mona lisa series (romanticizing vampires in the genre standard of today). However, Sunny is way more explicit. Anne Bishop never goes that far, so i wouldn't call her erotica. don't get me wrong, i enjoy her, but she definitely doesn't seem after scaring and turning on people.

i did recently read a book called "control freak" by Christa Faust. It made me think strongly of erotic horror though it falls a bit short on the erotic side due to it being more of a murder mystery than a celebration of the erotic. the murder occurs in a bdsm world and the protagonist becomes a dom without meaning to. definitely has a lot of gruesomeness in it.