Illustration question

plunderpuss · Mar 18, 2008

I am unpublished/unrepresented. I recently finished a novel in which one of the characters is writing an illustrated wildlife guide, and each chapter starts with a page from the guide. I drew the pages myself (I'm not Boris Vallejo or anything, but it's not embarrassing either). I don't care if my illustrations are in the final product. I just care if including mine is going to make me look dumb.

Because I don't know: how do I submit this manuscript?

My instinct is to leave the illustrations at the beginning of each chapter, and then mention in the cover letter that I don't expect them to use my art specifically. But is that unprofessional? Would it be better to send just the prose to agents, and if I get representation, bring it up then? I do consider the guide pages a part of the book, so I don't think I'd like to sell it to a house that would cut those pages out.* That makes me think it would be a little dishonest to send the agent a book and then say, "By the way, here's part of the book I didn't show you."

BLAH BLAH BLAH. Anyway, I'm just not sure what is the most professional way to include this kind of content in a submission. What do you think?

* Someone said that no one is going to bother printing images in a debut novel anyway, and that I should shelve the project until I sell something else first. If it's true, I'll certainly do that.

Wolvel · Mar 18, 2008

I would leave them out. Agents are looking more for the written word than pictures. If it goes further than the inital query letter you may bring up the idea at a later time.

Gillhoughly · Mar 18, 2008

* Someone said that no one is going to bother printing images in a debut novel anyway, and that I should shelve the project until I sell something else first. If it's true, I'll certainly do that.

A novel with illustrations is likely more expensive to print than one without them. You might look around for info on the Net on how illustrated children's books are submitted.

As a first novel it's going to be a hard one to sell. Be working on your second so your head doesn't explode.

Good luck!

Matera the Mad · Mar 18, 2008

I would NOT include the illustrations. No way. (Even though I am somewhat of a professional artist.) I would find some modest, unassuming way to say that my vision of the book has an illustration at the beginning of each chapter. Then, when I had hooked the big fish...

plunderpuss · Mar 18, 2008

Wolvel - Thanks! Yes, I agree that it's not what they're interested in. I still feel like it would be sort of dishonest if they wanted it, and then afterward I was like, "Well, I'm not letting you sell it unless you find a way to include the illustrations." It really would be a deal-breaker for me. I need some way of mentioning it up front. So far, I think Matera might be right--just tuck it into the cover letter.

Gillhoughly - Fortunately, it's not really my first novel--it's my fifth. It's just the first one I've decided to try and sell

So no worries about my head exploding, haha! And I hadn't thought about using children's book guidelines, but that might be a good idea... I'll look into it. Thank you for the input!

Matera - Thank you. You sound very positive I shouldn't include them--may I ask why? I've never heard any anecdotes on this topic, so if you have some, even hearsay is better than nothing!

David I · Mar 19, 2008

It doesn't surprise me that all the advice you're getting is NO NO NO, NO PICTURES. I'd have to see your novel to be able to advise. It really depends on how much the "guide book" is woven into the actual thread of the novel.

For example, Vonnegut's Breakfast of Champions doesn't actually make sense in several places without his weird line drawings in the text.

Doing anything nonstandard runs risks. That doesn't mean you should never do anything nonstandard. But you should weigh the risk against the necessity. Do you need the illustrated pages for the novel to work for a reader, or not?

plunderpuss · Mar 20, 2008

David I said:
Do you need the illustrated pages for the novel to work for a reader, or not?

My instinct is to say yes, but then I'm annoyed with myself for writing something so unskillfully that part of the setting depends upon images rather than my prose, so that makes me want to say no. Hahaha!

I'll have to think about it so I can be sure. Thank you for the thought-provoking question.

Shweta · Mar 20, 2008

Here's a question. Would you be able to publish the book without the images and put the wildlife book pages up online as an extra tidbit for your readers?

JamieFord · Mar 20, 2008

Go to your local book store and take a look at Sherman Alexie's, Absolute True Diary of a Part-Time Indian. It's filled with illustrations, but they're perfect in context and magnify the story. If they work like that, leave 'em in. If they're just "illustrations," and the story works without them, leave 'em out for now.

David I · Mar 20, 2008

JamieFord said:
Go to your local book store and take a look at Sherman Alexie's, Absolute True Diary of a Part-Time Indian. It's filled with illustrations, but they're perfect in context and magnify the story. If they work like that, leave 'em in. If they're just "illustrations," and the story works without them, leave 'em out for now.

Yes! I'd forgotten about Alexie. And I bet there's a few more examples out there that have slipped my so-called mind.

Good call, Mr Ford.

Mythica · Mar 20, 2008

I agree to definitely omit the drawings, BUT! Have them on a website. I have many drawings of my characters on my website, but I wouldn't put them in a book.

If you put your maps and guides on a website, you'll have lots of traffic for when you're published. It's great for marketing since they would like web exclusives--something special--and people love that.

Good luck!

joyofcooking · Mar 21, 2008

Check out "The Invention of Hugo Cabret"

http://search.barnesandnoble.com/
The-Invention-of-Hugo-Cabret/
Brian-Selznick/e/9780439813785/

Illustrations galore.

There are a ton of agents out there - do a little experiment - send 10 agents a query letter and mention the illustrations you've done, and mention an illustrated novel or two that's already been published.

Then, do another query letter to 10 agents, and don't say anything about the illustrations.

Try both ways. I liked your skull goldfish BTW.

Soccer Mom · Mar 21, 2008

It's becoming increasingly popular in middle-grade fiction to have illustrations. There is a trend towards it, although not so much in adult. Personally, I like pictures in my books, but I"m shallow that way.

I wouldn't include them in the ms when I submitted it unless the story really, truly needed them. I love Shweta's idea of using them as promotional tidbits.

job · Mar 22, 2008

I'm going to disagree here with some folks whose opinions I respect.

Submit the drawings along with the ms.

An agent is perfectly capable of ignoring the drawings and looking at your text. The problem with submitting drawings is that it is the mark of an amateur.
You are an amateur. Take advantage of this.

You may find an agent who falls in love with the whimsy of your drawings. You may find someone who will ignore them and love your text. If an agent tosses your text aside because the drawings annoy him, you probably wouldn't have liked the agent anyhow.

girlyswot · Mar 22, 2008

I wouldn't submit the actual drawings but I would certainly mention (perhaps in the query letter, or perhaps when you are submitting the full ms) that you had envisaged illustrations at the beginning of each chapter and explain how they relate to the story. I'd do this in a way that makes it quite clear you don't expect them to use your drawings but that you'd like to talk to the agent about the possibility. But of course, it'll be the publisher's decision, not the agent's. So you're looking for an agent who believes in the need for the illustrations as much as you do and can sell that idea to a publisher who's counting the pennies it will cost to print them. Good luck!

Illustration question

plunderpuss

Patron Saint of Sarcasm

Wolvel

Write the Damn Book!

Gillhoughly

Grumpy writer and editor

Matera the Mad

Bartender, gimme a Linux Mint

plunderpuss

Patron Saint of Sarcasm

David I

plunderpuss

Patron Saint of Sarcasm

Shweta

gone

JamieFord

giving resonant directions

David I

Mythica

Expert Gerbil Wrangler

joyofcooking

Soccer Mom

Crypto-fascist

job

In the end, it's just you and the manuscript

girlyswot