Serious trouble at school...

jennifer75 · Mar 13, 2008

So my almost 6 year old was caught telling his classmate that he was going to bring a you know what to school tomorrow and that he was going to "take care of" him and his family.

I got the news 3rd hand...maybe 4th...not sure if kid told teach, teacher told Principle, Principle told dad, dad told me....or if teacher heard and reported it herself. Either way, it's bad.

I'm totally confused on which approach to take. I spoke a little to my son today and he started to cry when I told him he had hurt their feelings and that he must not say such mean things...etc.

However tomorrow I have a meeting with the school to determin a course of action.

Have any of you had to deal with anything even remotely similar to this, if so how did you approach your child? Keep in mind, he's just barely turning 6.

reigningcatsndogs · Mar 13, 2008

Oh Jennifer :Hug2:

Do you have any idea what brought it about? Has someone been making his life miserable to the point he feels he has to say something to bring some attention to the problem?

I did have to deal with something like this with my younger son. He is high-functioning autistic and was bullied terribly. In grade two, he came home and said he wanted to kill somebody because he couldn't take it anymore. I think little guys sometimes say stuff out of frustration, and to get an adult to notice. In my case, he told me (it wasn't said at school or to the other students) but I did bring it to the school's attention so they would appreciate the extent of his frustration. My son had no intention of hurting anyone, but they hear it so much on tv, he thought repeating the comment was the only way to get us to understand.

I'll be praying for you tomorrow that everything goes okay and you can get to the bottom of what is really going on for your baby.

kellytijer · Mar 13, 2008

Where do you think he got it from? I ask because I've had an embarrassing moment with my daughter. When she was at her Christian kindergarten the principal claimed she taught several children the "f" word. Not as serious as your situation of course, but still kinda bad. She got in pretty big trouble from us and the school.

I knew exactly where she got it from: my husband who is the f-bomb dropping king of the world.

So sorry to hear about this, :Hug2:

.

Good luck

jennifer75 · Mar 13, 2008

I think my son, like many others, is a sponge at this age and hears and questions and repeats everything. He mimics his father like crazy and it drives me nuts. Not that he's heard his father say those words, but he has been asking me "what does ... mean, what does .... mean" and I never quite know what to say, except that it's mean, it's naughty, it's not nice, and we don't repeat it....but he's asking everyday, or saying something only to then look at me for my reaction....he's the kind of kid who will say "i wont say shit because shit is a bad word, and thats why we dont say shit" having said it three times.

He is a boy, and he wants to play with guns. He doesn't understand why I wont let him, and I don't know where - other than the television - that he would have realised killing is an action associated with a gun...let alone what killing means.

I'm clueless.

And I'll tell you one thing, it has changed immediately my feelings on what he watches on television. I will make major changes in his television privelidges that is certain.

I'll keep you posted on what happens tomorrow. I talked to my son a little - wasn't sure which approach to take with him, but wanted to address it.

He had started the conversation with "mom you can't say bad words, if you do I'll say I want a new mom"...and I took the opportunity to say "if you say mean things, i'll want a new son". And he immediately started to cry. I said, you can not say mean hurtful things to people, it hurts them. It is not nice, and it is mean, and u need to think about that. I asked him if he understood, and he cried "i don't want to say mean things" so I just reassured him that he doesn't have to, doesn't need to, and shouldn't. I then told him he needs to apologize to the kid, and the teacher tomorrow, that he will never say such mean things again.

I think at the moment, that is all I can do. I don't approve of the Admin Principles teaching methods, she's already expressed feelings about my son that I don't approve or agree with, and I've heard from his rec center that he is not the first student that she feels has a problem and that i shouldn't be alarmed.

He's 5. I keep telling myself that...but what is normal for 5????? What is normal for a 5 year old BOY?????

I think I'm doing a good job.

frimble3 · Mar 13, 2008

I wonder if it would help if you took it out of the 'not nice words' category, which may upset grown-ups, but don't really mean anything, and explained that his words scared people. Maybe it's not good to give him the idea that his words have that power, but if he's ever been really scared by something, maybe he'll understand why people are taking this more seriously than him saying 'f-' or 's-'. Even 'mean' words: you're ugly or stupid is not the same as threats of violence. Does he even really understand what is implied by 'take care of' or is it just something cool that tough guys say on TV?

JamieFord · Mar 13, 2008

Ah, geez.

My son was suspended in kindergarten for saying, "My mom is gonna kill you" to his best friend. Another kid heard it and told the teacher. He was sent home for making a "life threat" toward another student. It was totally taken out of context and the principal felt bad, but "rules are rules."

I wouldn't overreact. Little kids say goofy things. If he's hurting animals or exhibiting unusually destructive behavior I'd worry. Otherwise talk to him and move on...

TerzaRima · Mar 14, 2008

Try not to let the school blow this up into a big deal. At the same time, I wouldn't be defensive with them. Tell them you've given him consequences, you appreciate hearing from them, and try to call it good.

Schools have gotten absolutely bananas over things like this, to the point that kids cannot work out aggression in developmentally appropriate ways.

HeronW · Mar 14, 2008

A lot of times teachers ignore the bullying and name caling that leads to this reaction by the victim. At five a child has limited social skills to fight back and latch onto the nearest thing that returns their personal power. Also at this age, children can't distinguish between fantast and reality. They lie, brag and make up things to change the subject, or as wishful thinking, or to get back at someone, etc. They also absorb information and reflect back everything they see, hear, etc without knowing what the consequences are. Talk to every adult at the school who's involved with your son, keep it low key. Good luck.

sheadakota · Mar 14, 2008

I agree with terzarima, schools have gone waayyyy overboard on this zero tolerance thing. when my son was five, he put a toy in his backback to take to school I wasn't aware of it - until I got a call from the principal.

The toy in question was something he made from two different toys- one being a plastic ring of keys, the other being a plastic knife from a plastic camping set. he called it his 'key monster' and was quite proud of it.

He was in no way using it as a weapon or threatening anyone with it- he only wanted to share his creation with his classmates.

Fortunately we live in a very rural area and the school he attends has only 99 students from grades K-through 5.

The principal did nothing more than call me to ask that I pick the toy up as he couldn't give it back to my son. He knew my son meant no harm and that was the end of it.

I read in the paper yesterday that a third grader was suspended from school and expelled from his honors program because he bought a pack of skittles from a classmate. Apparantly the school has a "healthy snack" program and no sugary sweets allowed- Man, I'm all for keeping my kids safe - but from evil skittles????

Perks · Mar 14, 2008

jennifer75 said:
So my almost 6 year old was caught telling his classmate that he was going to bring a you know what to school tomorrow and that he was going to "take care of" him and his family.

Yeah, hopefully the school won't overreact. The syntax is very stagey, almost 'Goodfellas' (not that I'm suggesting you let him watch that!) It doesn't seem at all what you'd expect from an angry six year old unless you named him Guido and he spends an awful lot of time with his Uncle Soprano.

I'd be very candid in the talk about what he said - Guns are extremely dangerous in the wrong hands, they are always forbidden to children, and even the mention of them can freak some people out. Threatening to hurt someone and their family will make you an outcast, because it's a hard image for them to get out of their minds once it's been said.

Stuff like that.

But, then again, some people don't agree with my brand of parenting, so let your family values guide you and good luck! Keep us posted.

RumpleTumbler · Mar 14, 2008

jennifer75 said:
So my almost 6 year old was caught telling his classmate that he was going to bring a you know what to school tomorrow and that he was going to "take care of" him and his family.

As a writer you should know how important words are. Teach him to follow up with action and not just dump empty threats on people.

Swat him on the ass, tell him he has embarrassed you by not following through. Hand him a sawed off Mossberg and a box of shells.

He'll know what to do.

auntybug · Mar 14, 2008

If he is that obsessed with guns Jen, honestly, and this may sound strange, but the best cure of it it to find a time & place he can target practice w/ a B.B. gun or something.

Things that are taboo are glamorized. Maybe if he gets to use it, it will become boring. My nephew glamorized guns & said he was always gonna shoot something. When he was given the chance to shoot a bird, he couldn't pull the trigger.

Just a thought.... boys will be boys. A parenting video I saw 100 years ago talked about the difference between boys and girls. You give 2 girls stuffed bunny's and they will treat them like babies - give them to boys and they will smash them together & holler "bunny wars!".... and they wonder why men get more handsome as they age & women just get older!

Sorry is I strayed from the topic... my son is now 24...I survived (& I am just statring to show the gray hairs.)

Keep us posted. *hug*

Inky · Mar 14, 2008

JamieFord said:
Ah, geez.

My son was suspended in kindergarten for saying, "My mom is gonna kill you" to his best friend. Another kid heard it and told the teacher. He was sent home for making a "life threat" toward another student. It was totally taken out of context and the principal felt bad, but "rules are rules."

I wouldn't overreact. Little kids say goofy things. If he's hurting animals or exhibiting unusually destructive behavior I'd worry. Otherwise talk to him and move on...

As a mother of a 25 year old son, this is great advice. My son was horrifically bullied for years. He finally grabbed a kid 'round the neck and smashed his head against the window of the bus. The bus driver actually applauded him. He'd been put through hell by this kid--as were many others. But my son never killed animals..infact, he was very soft hearted towards animals, and people with disabilities.
He has the last laugh. He not only became an Army Ranger, serving 4 tours in Iraq, but now does that Ultimate Fighting Championship stuff. Gah, can't watch. But it's nice to know he'll never be bullied again.

My point? Find out what set your little guy off. Was it simplistic: he wanted a turn on the swing/with the toys...whatever..OR was it that he's reached his end and can no longer take someone hurting him physically/mentally? At that age, he certainly reacted to SOMETHING. Before the school tries to label him, or pin this on you--the parents--and make him suffer the consequences of their bloody 'rules', they need to investigate because American law in the schools has changed. Because of students who've been bullied coming back with guns, there is now a ZERO TOLERANCE of bullying. I'd make sure your son isn't a victim. AND, just so ye' ken, sometimes the bully is the teacher...NOT another student. You'd faint dead away if you knew what some of these smile-in-your-face teachers do, once that class door is shut. Some can be real terrors in the department of belittlment, humiliation, intimidation....

Investigate. He reacted to something. Don't lie down & let the school try to convince you that you have a 'bad' kid. That's just a lazy principle finger-pointing. Your son's 5. FIVE. Oh yeah, someone made him feel badly...enough that he reacted with intensity.

Inky · Mar 14, 2008

auntybug said:
If he is that obsessed with guns Jen, honestly, and this may sound strange, but the best cure of it it to find a time & place he can target practice w/ a B.B. gun or something.

Things that are taboo are glamorized. Maybe if he gets to use it, it will become boring. My nephew glamorized guns & said he was always gonna shoot something. When he was given the chance to shoot a bird, he couldn't pull the trigger.

Just a thought.... boys will be boys. A parenting video I saw 100 years ago talked about the difference between boys and girls. You give 2 girls stuffed bunny's and they will treat them like babies - give them to boys and they will smash them together & holler "bunny wars!".... and they wonder why men get more handsome as they age & women just get older!

Sorry is I strayed from the topic... my son is now 24...I survived (& I am just statring to show the gray hairs.)

Keep us posted. *hug*

Oh, I forgot all about this. Yeah, Billy was majorly into guns when he was four. So, a friend of mine started taking him target shooting. He mastered a .45 semi automatic by the time he was 5. No, not embelishing. I was a single parent, so he grew up faster than most. What he learned was respect for the weapon, and you know what? He ceased walking around playing bang-bang with his finger. He ceased making fake guns out of anything he could find. It's like he understood the power behind a gun, the fear, and it was no longer a game to him. Now, he still loved his G.I.Joes and Ninja Turtles--gah--and all the accessories...but the gun obsession really died away.

jennifer75 · Mar 14, 2008

frimble3 said:
Even 'mean' words: you're ugly or stupid is not the same as threats of violence. Does he even really understand what is implied by 'take care of' or is it just something cool that tough guys say on TV?

Exactly, I don't see where the opportunity would have come up for him to hear the words "I'm going to kill you". So I don't know. He watches cartoons, and something called josh and drake....and that show that little miss pregnant spears is on which bothers me but he loves it.....he doesn't watch adult movies...or t.v.

jennifer75 · Mar 14, 2008

I asked my son last night what happened that made him say this, and I think what he told me was that the other boy wouldn't play with him or something...I think the other child is one of those "no you can't play with us" kind of kids. No harm in that, I've tried telling my son, if they wont play with you, play with somebody else. But again....HE'S ONLY 5.

The meeting was hardly that, the administrator talked to my son and I, basically repeating why he's in the meeting in the first place, how hurtful his words were and are, and the don't say it if you don't want it said to you kind of thing.....

My son looked aware of what was being said to him, and we didn't yell at him, we discussed why and what etc.

He was allowed to go to class, "they" discussed it and didn't want to pull him out for something like this that they know now was not a threat, and was a 5 year old reacting to something he didn't like at the moment. They did however tell him he'd have to remain in the classroom working on an assignment dring the school assembly and the party that would follow.

From there, he'll go to his usualy after school rec center, and play as he does any other day. So wether the punishment will phase him, who knows. Will he say it again to another child, hopefully not.

He apologized to the child, and to his teacher with my encouragement, and I also expained to the other child that my son did not mean to scare him or say what he said, and that he wants to be friends, and if they could shake on it. They did.

kellytijer · Mar 14, 2008

jennifer75 said:
Exactly, I don't see where the opportunity would have come up for him to hear the words "I'm going to kill you". So I don't know. He watches cartoons, and something called josh and drake....and that show that little miss pregnant spears is on which bothers me but he loves it.....he doesn't watch adult movies...or t.v.

My three year old son loves Zoey 101 too. What is it with that show that attracts the "too young," I wonder? I've never heard anything questionable on that show or Drake and Josh...maybe he picked it up from another kid? It'd be interesting to know.

My daughter, who's nine, complains because I don't let her watch Family Guy like some of the other kids in her class. The show concentrates on things sometimes that are just too adult for her, and I've stood my ground.

I'm glad the school isn't doing anything more drastic with your son. Speaking from my own experience, the punishment handed to my daughter really shook her up. It taught her that there are consequences for actions, good and bad, and that those consequences won't always be handed down by her parents. It was a good thing. Today she's a straight A student and popular with the right crowd. She stands up for herself with the wrong crowd too.

jennifer75 · Mar 14, 2008

kellytijer said:
My three year old son loves Zoey 101 too. What is it with that show that attracts the "too young," I wonder? I've never heard anything questionable on that show or Drake and Josh...maybe he picked it up from another kid? It'd be interesting to know.

I have no idea, I've tried telling him it's for older kids, and he shouldn't watch it and that I don't want him to, but he insists that it is OK and not bad.

He grasps the age requirements for some movies...he'll sift through our collection and hold one up, look at the back, and say "oh, I have to be 17 to watch this..." so he understands that there are things I don't want him watching.

But damn that Zoey...

My daughter, who's nine, complains because I don't let her watch Family Guy like some of the other kids in her class. The show concentrates on things sometimes that are just too adult for her, and I've stood my ground.

Family guy is waaaaaaay to offensive for a 5 year old. Shoot, I'm floored by some of the stuff that baby does...

dolores haze · Mar 14, 2008

Thanks for sharing this, Jennifer. I'm gonna sit down with my boys later and have a talk with them about this subject. Boys! They seem to have the ability and desire to turn anything into a gun-like object. Is it in their DNA or something????

Inky · Mar 14, 2008

Family Guy and SouthPark are ADULT cartoons...okay....'cept my daughters laugh until crying over both shows...and my youngest can do a perfect Cartman...always when I'm driving...I think she likes my having to pull over because I'm laughing too hard to drive.

Glad everything worked out for your son and that the school didn't go overboard--suspension. That would have been a bit much for a 5 year old.

I have to laugh--so glad my days of raising boys are over. Exhausting. Invest in pricey lotions. Why? Boys will give you worry lines.

I wouldn't punish him at home. He's a typical boy. Besides, at 5, he's probably already forgotten it and moved on.

sheadakota · Mar 14, 2008

Family Guy?? Man, I didn't even let my kids watch the Simpsons until this year -they are 9 & 10.

I even get offended from the Family guy (Well after I stop laughing that is-but I am offended

mscelina · Mar 14, 2008

I have no idea, I've tried telling him it's for older kids, and he shouldn't watch it and that I don't want him to, but he insists that it is OK and not bad.

I hate to sound like a snip here (glad everything is getting straightened out, by the way) but it sounds like he's making the decision on whether or not to watch this show. You're the mom; you make the decisions. If nothing else, it may help to reinforce the fact that there are consequences for what a child does--"I don't think this is an appropriate show for you, you're too young. it deals with issues you don't understand yet. For a while, son, you're going to watch the shows that I think are appropriate. Period."

jennifer75 · Mar 14, 2008

Inky said:
I wouldn't punish him at home. He's a typical boy. Besides, at 5, he's probably already forgotten it and moved on.

Exactly.

jennifer75 · Mar 14, 2008

mscelina said:
I hate to sound like a snip here (glad everything is getting straightened out, by the way) but it sounds like he's making the decision on whether or not to watch this show. You're the mom; you make the decisions. If nothing else, it may help to reinforce the fact that there are consequences for what a child does--"I don't think this is an appropriate show for you, you're too young. it deals with issues you don't understand yet. For a while, son, you're going to watch the shows that I think are appropriate. Period."

Well, I may be chicken shit, while that is the approach I WANT to take, I don't think I can enforce it...so I'm just going to take the t.v. away.

I'm a softy.

We are renting his room right now, through April, so he's in my room. When he returns to his, his t.v. will be gone. He needs to focus on other activities, and having a t.v. is way too big of a distraction for a 5 year old. T.V will be earned when homework is done, etc.

sheadakota · Mar 14, 2008

Ok- I now feel like the meanest mom in the universe- My kids have asked when they can have a TV- dvd player, phone ect in their room- I tell them when they can pay for the TV the hook-up, same with a cell phone- they can have one when they can pay for the calls- yeah- big fat meany mommy. Just my philosophy, mind you- not making judgements on how other people raise their kids. I make TONS of mistakes and have probably scarred then for ten life-times

Serious trouble at school...

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