yelled, "Land!," or yelled, "Land!",

Ken · Mar 12, 2008

Was wondering about this sentence:

When the guy on the poop deck yelled, "Land!," everbody began to cheer.

Punctuated correctly?
Most likely not.
Please help if you can.
thnx
ps No "poop" puns plz.

DeleyanLee · Mar 12, 2008

Take out the comma.

Haggis · Mar 12, 2008

DeleyanLee said:
Take out the comma.

Yep.

John Paton · Mar 12, 2008

As a matter of correct grammatical form, never place a comma meant to puncuate a sentence within a set of quotation marks. Never.

I almost fainted when I saw you had done that !!

DeleyanLee · Mar 12, 2008

John Paton said:
As a matter of correct grammatical form, never place a comma meant to puncuate a sentence within a set of quotation marks. Never.

Come again? Are you saying that

"That's not the way it happened," Mary said.

should be

"That's not the way it happened", Mary said.

or am I misunderstanding you?

HeronW · Mar 12, 2008

Try:
The guy on the poop deck yelled, "Land!" Everybody cheered.

Omit:' when' makes it immediate action.
End with the exclaimation mark
y in everybody
omit: 'began to' again immediate action
and cheered rather than cheer.

John Paton · Mar 12, 2008

Yes you are misunderstanding moi.

The context that anis has used differs from your use.

"That's" is a punctuation of a word whereby

When the guy on the poop deck yelled, "Land!," everbody began to cheer.

is the punctuation of a sentence.

Ken · Mar 12, 2008

sorry. Should've mentioned that I had to keep to one sentence, as the action is the climatic scene.

So following your advise I guess it should read:
When the guy on the poop deck yelled, "Land!" everbody began to cheer.
Still seems a bit awkward, as if there needed to be a pause before everybody, but I guess it'll do. Thnx everybody

but maybe I will think about the 2 sentence deal?

John Paton · Mar 12, 2008

anis - there is nothing stopping you from using a comma outside and following the quotation marks.

This is grammatically correct although it does look a little ugly.

When the guy on the poop deck yelled "Land!", everbody began to cheer.

Ken · Mar 12, 2008

Good to know, and interesting, too, how aesthetics enters into how the rules of writing are applied, to an extent.
!", does indeed look awkward.

ps Time to get that thumbed through punctuation book of mine out and commit to memorizing it - yet again

Bufty · Mar 12, 2008

If the action is the climactic scene, Heron's two-sentence suggestion is preferable to my eye.

The only reason you 'had to keep it to one sentence' is your opening the sentence with 'When'. That type of opening will always lengthen a sentence because you have to go on to say what occurs after whatever it is that causes you to say 'When'.

Drop the 'when' and the 'had to...' disappears.

anis said:
sorry. Should've mentioned that I had to keep to one sentence, as the action is the climatic scene.

So following your advise I guess it should read:
When the guy on the poop deck yelled, "Land!" everbody began to cheer.
Still seems a bit awkward, as if there needed to be a pause before everybody, but I guess it'll do. Thnx everybody

but maybe I will think about the 2 sentence deal?

Ken · Mar 12, 2008

I see the logic to that. thnx.
I'll experiment around,
with what I've learnt here,
and report back.

Appalachian Writer · Mar 12, 2008

I like Heron's revision. I'd use it if I were you.

Craig Gosse · Mar 12, 2008

anis said:
Was wondering about this sentence:

When the guy on the poop deck yelled, "Land!," everbody began to cheer.

Hmmm - the way I was led to understand this, it should actually be:

When the guy on the poop deck yelled 'Land!', everybody began to cheer.

...or:

When the guy on the poop deck yelled, ("Land!"), everybody began to cheer.

Since you are describing what somebody said, rather than having a character say it directly, it's not dialog - it's a quote. That's why you would use the first example. The second, you are actually having the charater say the word, but it is an aside to the main sentence.

In other words, your sentence, as constructed, really should be: When the guy on the poop deck yelled, everybody cheered. What he yelled, in context of this sentence, has to be 'shoe-horned' in. Personally, what I would have gone with would be:

"Land!" The man on the poop deck yelled; and everybody cheered.

That's my two cent's worth.

C. Gosse

Ken · Mar 12, 2008

2 cents?
More like 2 thousand $ worth!

donroc · Mar 12, 2008

If he yelled, why do you need an exclamation mark? That's like wearing a belt and suspenders -- for a guy, that is.

Ken · Mar 12, 2008

Great observation donroc. Didn't really think of that. But there's a reason why I stuck the exclamation mark in, without realizing about the belt.
I was trying to make the sentence have a dialogue-like feel, to fit in with what went before. The exclamation mark was an easy way out, now that I'm faced to admit it. So what I really need to do is rework the entire sentence and turn it into a mini-monologue spoke by the guy on the poop deck, which will be a chore and a half and probably keep me up half the night. But what's got to be done, has got to be done. So off I go, sigh...

Craig Gosse · Mar 12, 2008

donroc said:
If he yelled, why do you need an exclamation mark? That's like wearing a belt and suspenders -- for a guy, that is.

An exclamation need not be a yell; nor a yell an exclamation. They are neither redundant, nor mutually exclusive. As such, it is correct to use both. Consider:

' "You're gonna die...', Mark yelled.' (Taunt)
vs.
' "You're gonna die!", Mark yelled.' (Threat)

... in that 'Yell' is just an indication of volume:

' "You're gonna die...', Mark said.' (Taunt)
vs.
' "You're gonna die!", Mark said.' (Threat)

' "You're gonna die...', Mark whispered.' (Taunt)
vs.
' "You're gonna die!", Mark whispered.' (Threat)

"You're gonna die?", Mark gasped.
(*Grin*)

Ken · Mar 12, 2008

And Craig, alas, has a point too.
Taking his example and elaborating on it,
if you just used the exclamation to emphasize the character's emotional state it wouldn't sound quite right, either:
"You're gonna die!", Mark said.
Then again maybe that does work, better than: "You're gonna die!", Mark yelled.
The jury is still out.

Having taken off the sentence's suspenders we've tightened its belt a notch.
Yeouch!

Ken · Mar 13, 2008

Going to go with Del & Haggis' suggestion and change it to:

When the guy on the poop deck yelled "Land!" everbody began to cheer.

Thanks to those two, and everybody else too.
Will look to use your useful tips on other occasions.

donroc · Mar 13, 2008

"?!"

dpaterso · Mar 13, 2008

anis said:
"You're gonna die!", Mark said.
Then again maybe that does work, better than: "You're gonna die!", Mark yelled.

Please don't add an extra comma after the closing quote mark. It has no business being there.

Neither of these examples work for me. In the first, "said" is too weak. In the second, the exclamation mark already suggests he's yelled/shouted this, so saying "yelled" again seems like an echo.

Consider using an action line instead to set up who's speaking so you don't need to use a speech tag at all, e.g.

Mark aimed his pistol at Evil Bob's head. "You're gonna die!"

Read everything you can get your hands on -- novels, newspapers, magazines -- until you get control of these dialogue punctuation basics.

-Derek

KTC · Mar 13, 2008

I was going to scream at you to remove the !, but it looks like I was beaten to it.

seun · Mar 13, 2008

Exclamation marks are overused. They make me angry!

dpaterso · Mar 13, 2008

!, you.

-Derek

yelled, "Land!," or yelled, "Land!",

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