Element vs. Element

Who would win a chess game, a defensive player or an offensive player? Well, a really good defensive player would beat a pretty good offensive player, and vice versa. A really good offensive player who's feeling well would beat a really good defensive player who's under the weather.

I think it would depend on other factors in addition to which element the character is invoking. How skilled is each character with their particular form of magic? How smart is each? How resourceful? How does the environment in which they're fighting contribute? How can each character use the environment to advantage? What else is on each character's mind? What expectations does each have about fighting someone with the opponent's powers?

And if the question is solely one of which element wins, then there's no room for character to play a role.

Dale

I pretty much agree with Dale.

One thing that bothers me though, aren't water and ice the same element, just in different states? As much as earth, air, fire and water have been done to death, that is what I think of when someone mentions 'four elements'. I do like the addition of electricity though.

Cheers, Lisa.

One thing that bothers me though, aren't water and ice the same element, just in different states?

As much as earth, air, fire and water

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I'd have to agree there, it gave me pause too. It's like saying that Air and Wind are different Beings, rather than one Being taking different forms, imo.

Mostly you hear your LAST four spoken of as "Elements"

Neither would I have a sense of which power is "stronger" (in a Rock/Paper/Scissors sense). I suppose if you wanted to be scientific about it: Fire cannot burn without oxygen/Air, can it? And Fire is a mere chemical action, whereas Electromagnetism is one of the Cosmic forces that shape the Universe (so ... Electricity would have a deeper power source to sustain it?)

Maybe to escape the Ice/Water similarity, instead of Ice your character can simply have the power to slow down or stop all atomic and molecular motion (that would be making everything Cold, not just Ice; you can shatter many solids by freezing them towards absolute zero, I think? at least, shatter rubber balls with liquid oxygen etc)

Just random quick thoughts.

Here's my 2 cents on the elements thing:

There are four of what we consider 'core' elements in Western mythology, and those are Earth, Air, Water, and Fire, with the sometime-addition of Spirit. In the far East, they add or substitute Wood, Metal, and Void. A common, but not necessarily well-known addendum, is that of the quasi-Elements: Fog/Smoke, which is a combination of Air and Water, Electricity, which is a combination of Air and Fire, Magma, which is a combination of Earth and Fire, and Clay, which is a combination of Water and Earth. Some people also add Light and Darkness.

One thing you should consider (and probably have, I don't know) in rating the strength of your Elementals is how closely their personalities relate to their Element and how this affects their relative strength. For instance, I once did an Elemental plotline featuring Earth, Air, Water, Fire, Light, and Darkness. All of them were fairly equally matched in Elemental Strength, but Fire was tempestuous, violent, straightforward, and brash, while Water was intelligent, creative, subtle, and adaptive. Water, therefore, trumped Fire every time they fought because he was, quite simply, smarter. Light had the conviction of her cause and a holier-than-thou attitude, but Dark was willing to stoop to any measures to win, so he usually did. Air went crazy and wound up getting himself sent to the Dead Realm through NO intervention of the others, and Earth was so stodgy and plodding that he never got into conflicts with the others anyway.

On top of that, you might consider basing the 'power' of each Element on the amount of it that exists in your world. If you're writing in Earth, for example, Water would be stronger than fire because it's so much more plentiful at any given time, and earth would be stronger than air because the total volume of earth in the planet is greater than the total volume of atmosphere (at least, I think it is. Globes throw off my math). Electricity would have once been a fairly weak element, occurring only during storms, but now that modern society produces so much of it, it's come into its heyday.

Hopefully one of those will spark an idea. Good luck!

I think I know the fire, ice, electricity, water system from final fantasy, where I think it functions more like: "burning up", "freezing down", "sourrounding/suffocating" and "penetrating/shocking". That is, I think these elements are dynamic rather than static.

Has anyone ever thought of perusing the periodic table for "elementals"?

A: I invoke the power of helium. You shall speak in a squeaky voice and everyone shall laugh at you.
B: [squeaky voice] Noooooooooo!
Everyone: *laughs*
B: *runs away crying*
A: Fear the power of helium!
Everyone: *shudders*

I've found an interesting few pages about elements and their abilities in The Astrology Bible. Maybe it'll be worth researching real world elements before setting off down your own path.

ice, fire, electricity, and water

ice fire: if the ice doesn't have much volume the fire wins because ice couldn't quench it fast enough

ice elec: elec no contest

ice water: unless the water can be made warm and in voume I think ice would win because the shards would shoot right thorugh the ice, of course the ice person could get drowned pretty fast or knocked down by high pressure

fire elec: electricity because it's faster and kills pretty instantly, assuming the voltage is high enough and has sufficeint amps.

fire water: water no contest (assuming the volume is good otherwise the water could be evapourated, allowing the fire to get through)

elec water: if the water is pure it wouldn't conduct so it could form a sheild, otherwise elec would win

Kenny said:

I've found an interesting few pages about elements and their abilities in The Astrology Bible. Maybe it'll be worth researching real world elements before setting off down your own path.

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Or look up Chinese zodiac on wikipedia. They have a section on elements and how they both overcome and aid each other. There elements are earth, wood, fire, water and metal (I think).

When I do elemental stuff, I create five elements; the usual plus wood.

And right now, I have it where their will and emotions really gives their power that extra oomph. So when fire and ice go up against each other, sometimes she melts his ice, but sometimes his ice is so powerful it can stop her fire.

Does this make sense? And does it sound plausible, in that whole 'if people had elemental powers...' way?

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I don't see why not. It worked for Avatar, the last Airbender ( here), all the powers are pretty balanced, but one beats another depending on all sorts of things.

Once again, it's more about how plausible your writing makes it.

dreamsofnever said:

Thank you all for the feedback!

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You're super-welcome, Dreams. I'm sure I speak for everybody when I say we're glad we could help.

IdiotsRUs said:

I don't see why not. It worked for Avatar, the last Airbender ( here), all the powers are pretty balanced, but one beats another depending on all sorts of things.

Once again, it's more about how plausible your writing makes it.

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If its good enough you can get away with it.

mmurphy said:

I create five elements; the usual plus wood.

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That's what she said...




Outside the box thinking when it comes to elementals:
http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0423.html