Making a fictional language

maxmordon · Feb 20, 2008

Well, I guess some people have already asked advices but making a quick search didn't gave me lots of results but some interesting things I decided to make my own thread about my languages (so far, my language)

Right now I can't give examples because I don't have my notes close; but is supposely what is left of the language of a slaved people whose tounges and lips were cutted off by their masters to them not spread their culture and knowledge to future generations. Is mostly based on suffixs and preffixs and a friend of mine pointed out some grammatical similarities to Japanese (althrough the language has barely consonants, mostly H, G and K and the French R) also one word has several meanings. For example:

"Eh" Doesn't just means "I" but also, "I am", "I live", "I exist" and "I inhabitate"

Also the languages lacks of prural You, They and Us. Having instead saying something analogous to French "on"

To say "We hate them" is something along like "On here dislikes on there" (there is no 1:1 relation, I just hate when fictional languages has those things or avoid quirks; just make them look artificial)

Paichka · Feb 20, 2008

Cool idea.

For my WIP, I gleefully pirated Old English, Middle English, Welsh and Old French for loanwords. Depending on what region of my country the characters are from, and what their social standing is (nobility vs. smallfolk) they have different speech patterns.

The idea is that the nobility all speak proper English because they've been educated that way by their tutors, who are all priests, for lack of a better word.

Commoners speak English with a varying degree of warping, with the most extreme warp seen in 'lowtongue', a highly isolated dialect -- IE, early on someone sees a sign around the next of a criminal that says, "GYLTIG OC RAEP" on it (guilty of rape).

Interesting thread. What was your question, again?

cethklein · Feb 21, 2008

If it's an alien language, take existing foreign languages and mash them together. I'm doing that in book two during a scene. What's fun about it is you can then have those words say something funny. Example in the story you could have someone translate what someone says as "He said the plans are stored on the lower level" But in reality the actual words used could mean "Man, i sure like to eat pie" in Farsi.

Great for those of us who like to slip in Easter eggs.

JimmyB27 · Feb 21, 2008

I personally go for the slacker's route of not bothering to try

Seriously, I actually think it makes more sense that way. If the POV character speaks the language in question, you can just write it all in English, perhaps noting that they are speaking a different language. If he doesn't speak it, well, think about the last time you heard someone speak a different language. Did you hear distinct words, or just a garbled stream of stuff you couldn't make head nor tail of? For me, it's always the latter, so, writing from your character's POV, it seems to make more sense to me to write something like 'He heard them gabble on in Gallian', rather than have him perceiving the whole words.

maxmordon · Feb 21, 2008

There wasn't any questions; just seeking advice from expirienced people and testing it to seek its flaws

And no, is not an Alien Language... though I think I can introduce a thing or two... My last attempt to make a Romance-Based language when I was really bored at school has some eggs like the word for left, sinister was "Sinastre" or the word for spouse was "Despodo/Despoda"

maxmordon · Feb 21, 2008

JimmyB27 said:
I personally go for the slacker's route of not bothering to try
Seriously, I actually think it makes more sense that way. If the POV character speaks the language in question, you can just write it all in English, perhaps noting that they are speaking a different language. If he doesn't speak it, well, think about the last time you heard someone speak a different language. Did you hear distinct words, or just a garbled stream of stuff you couldn't make head nor tail of? For me, it's always the latter, so, writing from your character's POV, it seems to make more sense to me to write something like 'He heard them gabble on in Gallian', rather than have him perceiving the whole words.

I would felt the word incomplete if I didn't have a language; the point of view changes but I felt it would be more realistical if the people attempting to learn English used English with ther grammar and such; also I want to have some roots for names, not just some Tolkien Ripoff

Oddsocks · Feb 21, 2008

JimmyB27 said:
I personally go for the slacker's route of not bothering to try
Seriously, I actually think it makes more sense that way. If the POV character speaks the language in question, you can just write it all in English, perhaps noting that they are speaking a different language. If he doesn't speak it, well, think about the last time you heard someone speak a different language. Did you hear distinct words, or just a garbled stream of stuff you couldn't make head nor tail of? For me, it's always the latter, so, writing from your character's POV, it seems to make more sense to me to write something like 'He heard them gabble on in Gallian', rather than have him perceiving the whole words.

True, but a fictional language can definitely still have uses. One is names. Yes, these could be translated, but if a place was named long enough ago, then it's likely the current name will come across to characters more as an independent, name-like word than as a compound or whatever it is, due to sound changes that have occurred in both the name and in the language since.

It's also good if you don't want to have to translate character names into English and have characters called 'hope', 'courage', 'home-by-the-lake', etc.

It can also give you ideas about culture and the perspective of your characters. It says something interesting about the cognitive categories a person has when they speak a language that differentiates colours only into 'warm-light' (white, yellow, red) and 'cold-dark' (blue, green, black), or one that has separated out categories for white, black, yellow, red and blue-green, or one like ours that separates not only blue from green but also pink from red from brown, or a more complex one still with categories also split off for light blue, blue and dark blue on analogy with English's red, pink and brown.

And, of course, all the other ways in which language can provide information about cognitive categories and interpretations that might differ from what we generally assume, because they're our own.

Zelenka · Feb 21, 2008

I've been shamelessly stealing bits of other languages for my world, mostly Gaulish, Brythonic, and other root languages that English has borrowed from so that it has an 'old' feel to it, compared to the modern English my characters speak, kind of going down the Tolkien road in a way. I've not got anyone speaking that old language at all, but it's helped my naming conventions and given me a consistent system for naming geographical locations. For the other countries on the Continent, I've mostly used old European languages, things like Venetian, that are almost like Italian and so convey that sort of sense, but still have an archaic feel.

Where I came across a problem for languages is that my whole magic system and, in a way, the religion of the place is very language based. They work off the theory that God created the world because He named it, that the language God spoke had the power to command nature and to conjure things from nothing. Magicians think that if you could trace language back to its roots, find the common ancestor of all language before the different tongues diverged, then that would be close to the language man learned from hearing God and his servants, and that would give them power over matter.

Whether that's true or believable or not, I needed a 'magical language', so I went with Indo-European roots, again so that it's related in a way to the language (English) that my characters speak, as in it 'feels' as if it could be a distant ancestor. Several magicians have composed 'grimoires' (in the proper sense, in that the word is derived from 'grammar') to try and systemise it, but really I don't have much by way of structure for it. I don't want to use loads of it anyway as for one thing, it'll be annoying for the reader probably and secondly, whenever it's used it's usually for brief spells.

DonnaDuck · Feb 21, 2008

As opposed to creating an entire language, I'm probably just going to go with accents and made-up words for some animals, places, things and other stuff like that. Put enough of it in there that it feels authentic without goings nuts with it. I also like the idea of changing word-use over time, like morphing the name of a kingdom or country in order to suit the changing dialect. Thus far there isn't any speaking in the history of my story so no worries there yet but I do think it a good idea to have the castes speak differently. It would only be natural in any way of life. At this point in my story, though, I feel it unnecessary to create an entirely new language but giving meaning to names sounds interesting.

maxmordon · Feb 21, 2008

JessRamage said:
I've been shamelessly stealing bits of other languages for my world, mostly Gaulish, Brythonic, and other root languages that English has borrowed from so that it has an 'old' feel to it, compared to the modern English my characters speak, kind of going down the Tolkien road in a way. I've not got anyone speaking that old language at all, but it's helped my naming conventions and given me a consistent system for naming geographical locations. For the other countries on the Continent, I've mostly used old European languages, things like Venetian, that are almost like Italian and so convey that sort of sense, but still have an archaic feel.

Where I came across a problem for languages is that my whole magic system and, in a way, the religion of the place is very language based. They work off the theory that God created the world because He named it, that the language God spoke had the power to command nature and to conjure things from nothing. Magicians think that if you could trace language back to its roots, find the common ancestor of all language before the different tongues diverged, then that would be close to the language man learned from hearing God and his servants, and that would give them power over matter.

Whether that's true or believable or not, I needed a 'magical language', so I went with Indo-European roots, again so that it's related in a way to the language (English) that my characters speak, as in it 'feels' as if it could be a distant ancestor. Several magicians have composed 'grimoires' (in the proper sense, in that the word is derived from 'grammar') to try and systemise it, but really I don't have much by way of structure for it. I don't want to use loads of it anyway as for one thing, it'll be annoying for the reader probably and secondly, whenever it's used it's usually for brief spells.

I have, in this continent, 3 main beliefs: One group worships a female nature goddess that consider sacred all bodily fluids; a monotheist religion considering the name of God made uncapable to be pronounced by human as goats and horses can't pronounce our human names, that God is not one but the endless geometrical faces that we pray and is not the same face we pray on the gallows that the one we sacrifice ourselves on the battlefield, a bitheist religion based on the concept that there is no good or evil per se; just happen that some people born blessed by the courage of father sunlight and others with the intelligence of mother moondark

The slaves' beliefs are that the Sun God (same father sunlight from their owners) wants to have a balance and that's why we have free will... and that's why the get their freedom throwing animal corpses to the rivers and poising their masters while they hid on some swamps

maxmordon · Feb 22, 2008

By the way; my language is heavily related to this older thread

maxmordon · Mar 15, 2008

Well, I finally can provide some examples; but still, the language is still very simple (I haven't develop a way to say "go" yet)

Kehgee-gee okuònko oh-oe eg?

Meaning: When I will be in your house/home?

Literally saying: Time (question particle) people's place yours I (Future particle added)

I actually have translitarated to Spanish and now I try to do it to English, the ò represents how the French O is said. By the way, there is no verb To Be. Instead they decline the subject depending on the time (eg, eh, ek) (I will be, I am, I was)

Another example

Gokoo garohokoo ogao garáe garOOeek

Meaning: The young soldiers died at war
Literally: Young killermen grand killing (declined with a particle meaning at, on) [they] died

arodriguez · Mar 17, 2008

im working on a language entirely composed of cuss words, curse words, racial slurs, and politically incorrect jargon. i think you will love it.

maxmordon · Mar 18, 2008

arodriguez said:
im working on a language entirely composed of cuss words, curse words, racial slurs, and politically incorrect jargon. i think you will love it.

Sounds interesting... do you think you can post examples without getting in trouble?

matt_the_cook · Mar 24, 2008

I'm in the middle of working on a language for my WIP. It's partially a mix of Persian and Urdu grammar with some original stuff thrown in. It's a whole lot more work than I ever thought!

GeorgeK · Mar 24, 2008

I would imagine that a language mutated by rampant lip and tongue mutilation would ultimately include pitch fluctuations like in Swedish and the Chinese dialect in Taiwan where an octave or two flux of a given vowel up or down could radically change the meaning but might be difficult to type with a western keyboard. I suppose tildes and apostophes might denote a pitch change. It's your language, do what you want, but from the reader's standpoint I'd rather not have to learn a foreign language to read a book, especially if there's only one book written in that language.

maxmordon · Mar 26, 2008

GeorgeK said:
I would imagine that a language mutated by rampant lip and tongue mutilation would ultimately include pitch fluctuations like in Swedish and the Chinese dialect in Taiwan where an octave or two flux of a given vowel up or down could radically change the meaning but might be difficult to type with a western keyboard. I suppose tildes and apostophes might denote a pitch change. It's your language, do what you want, but from the reader's standpoint I'd rather not have to learn a foreign language to read a book, especially if there's only one book written in that language.

It have those things, but it's hard to present it on English text. Since English lacks of tildes, something I am used to because Spanish uses tildes and French (that I am studying) also uses. Actually having studying English and currently studying French helps me with this.

I don't intend to write a book with fictional language, just want to shape their culture and speech manner, since people while learning a language will usually start out with the same grammar of their original language

yanallefish · Mar 27, 2008

In other words, you're looking more for a way that one group speaks as opposed to another? (for instance, an upper class would use different speech than a lower one, or there might be the addition of an ee sound at the end of words in some dialect or other)?

I'd suggest looking here for resources, even if you don't want to go too far into it; it's always a good idea to sound authentic *G* http://www.indiana.edu/~hlw/

and here: http://www.sungwh.freeserve.co.uk/sapienti/phon/ipasymb.htm

Cheers!

Axelle · Mar 27, 2008

Spanish uses tildes and French (that I am studying) also uses.

Er, did I miss something ? French doesn't have tildes, to my knowledge, except in a few borrowed words such as "cañon". Unless you mean the circumflex accent ?

Apart from that, when I need to make up a fictional language, sometimes I just pick whatever foreign language and I write it phonetically. That way my work is cut out for me (though the result would probably look very strange to native speakers of whatever language I pick).

maxmordon · Mar 27, 2008

Axelle said:
Er, did I miss something ? French doesn't have tildes, to my knowledge, except in a few borrowed words such as "cañon". Unless you mean the circumflex accent ?

Apart from that, when I need to make up a fictional language, sometimes I just pick whatever foreign language and I write it phonetically. That way my work is cut out for me (though the result would probably look very strange to native speakers of whatever language I pick).

When I said tilde, I meant all the accents over the vowel. Sorry, in Spanish we call tilde to ALL those lines you add on bowels and the one added for the Ñ

Hergé did the same thing for a fictional Indigenous language on Les Adventures De Tintin. The Arumbayas of The Broken Ear speak a phonetic transcription of a dialect of the working class of Bruxelles. He also developed a quite interesting Germanic-Slavic language called Syldavian for later books

maxmordon · Mar 27, 2008

yanallefish said:
In other words, you're looking more for a way that one group speaks as opposed to another? (for instance, an upper class would use different speech than a lower one, or there might be the addition of an ee sound at the end of words in some dialect or other)?

I'd suggest looking here for resources, even if you don't want to go too far into it; it's always a good idea to sound authentic *G* http://www.indiana.edu/~hlw/

and here: http://www.sungwh.freeserve.co.uk/sapienti/phon/ipasymb.htm

Cheers!

Thanks for the links! Yes I do intend to do that, but not yet. What I do intend is to create believable people from a fictional country with a culture that is somewhat a pastiche of different cultures and a try to be as original as possible.

There is another culture, which I haven't planning much except some cultural aspects about architecture, religion and military

Sarpedon · Mar 27, 2008

Vowels max, vowels.

And what kind of architecture terminology do you have?

maxmordon · Mar 27, 2008

Sarpedon said:
Vowels max, vowels.

And what kind of architecture terminology do you have?

Sorry, I only slept 3 hours last night

Anywho, This is the architecture thread I started a while ago

http://www.absolutewrite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=82533

Sarpedon · Mar 27, 2008

How fun! let me think about that and I'll get back to you.

When I was in architecture school, there was a wonderful series of books called 5000 years of housing. I've never seen it anywhere else but in architecture school, though. It had hundreds and hundreds of ink drawings of houses from all over the world, and every epoch.

MDSchafer · Mar 27, 2008

When it comes to make up fictional languages I follow one rule: Don't

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