Question about adapation/montage

[Ivonia]

I had a quick question about montages and adaptations. First of all, I'm adapting my own work, since if anyone's going to screw it up, it may as well be me. I know that novels and movies are entirely different formats, and I'm trying to learn both of them so I don't make too many mistakes in either (such as movies are entirely visual and sound dependent, while novels let you play with all 5 senses, and maybe even some other ones).

Secondly, I realize that you will all say "Make sure the novel sells first". For this question, lets assume that the novel is a hit (or I wouldn't even be bothering with this question).

And thirdly, I'm currently planning on working Hollywood. I am writing the novel first so that I can begin establishing the world of the story the way I envisioned it (this story was originally going to be a spec screenplay first, but I'm afraid of the "giving up all rights" thing in a spec screenplay sale), and therefore set up familiarity to this world. Of course, if the novel(s) do really well (as in Harry Potter level), then I may just put off screenwriting all together for a lot longer than I thought. But for now, I want to eventually work in Hollywood too, which is why I'm posting here.

I've read novels and seen movies based on them, and for the most part, they're not terribly great. Usually, the movie has very little to do with the novel, or else it's just basically a copy of the novel "word for word" (in a sense).

So, for my story, I decided to do something slightly (or radically I guess, since I haven't seen this done too often, if at all) different.

Okay, in my novel, events will happen, and the perspective is largely restricted to what the hero sees (except in the beginning, when I have to establish the bad guys). He will enter the military (as a fighter pilot, and yes, this is crucial to the plot), and fight the bad guys, win some, lose some. Obviously the hero can't be everywhere at once, since this is a large scale battle (think Star Wars for a comparision).

In the book, the hero's fleet receives a distress call from another fleet in combat. Since they are the only fleet available, they head out right away, only to arrive too late. The hero sees the wreckage of the battle, and they try to salvage what they can from it. The hero also notices that the much larger prototype battleship the good guys had also fell in this battle.

In the screenplay, I would show the actual battle occurring. The prototype battleship was designed to counter the bad guys' big ship, and they engage in a big battle. Ultimately however, the good guys lose this battle, due to tactics that the bad guys use (which the hero's fleet will discover afterwards in the book).

Okay, you can see an example of how the screenplay and novel will cover slightly different areas, but still tells the same tale. Here's the other question about montage.

Obviously there needs to be a good reason for the two sides to have a war, and I did come up with one. I explain it through the hero's uncle, who gives him some last minute backstory and advice to the hero prior to him shipping out for training. The uncle tells the hero a little about the bad guys and what happened to them, and how they turned out the way they did when the war starts. He tells the hero about the bad guys' brutal civil war, and how one side (the bad guys) eventually won and took over.

In both the screenplay and novel, I have a prologue which covers the bad guys before they become bad. A group of scientists and their assistants are trying to find an ancient temple, and when they find it, they accidentally unleash an ancient demon from it. The demon kills all but one of them, and promises the one guy if he submits, the demon will give him power beyond his dreams. Being greedy, the guy submits.

In the novel, the uncle will give the hero backstory on what happened after this event (and yes, this is also vital to the story). However, to have a similiar scene in the screenplay seemed kind of boring/like info dump mode, so I decided to use a montage.

In the screenplay, immediately after the prologue ends, and where the opening credits would normally roll, I decided to put the bad guy's backstory into a montage. The montage will have many pictures which will show those same events the uncle talks about in the novel, and show people how the bad guy gains power through the demon. So by the time we get to the good guys, people will know what happened. Although the montage will have to be "dark", I planned on ending it with a sign of hope, in the form of a baby, who, when grown up, will also have an important role to play (the baby will grow up to be the hero's girlfriend. Her role will be revealed later in the story).

As you can see, although the novel and screenplay will both cover the same areas from time to time, they will also cover slightly different areas at some points. Since I know that film is a visual medium, I decided to show the story in pictures as much as possible. However, I didn't want to have it bastardize the novel too much either, hence the "covering different areas" than the novel. Although the hero will hear about these events in the novel, because he's not there, he doesn't know what's going on either. In the screenplay, people will get to see those events occur.

I want to try and write both the novel and the screenplay in such a way that they complement each other, so that if peeps only want to read the novel or watch the movie, they will still get a good experience.

However, if they do both, they will see an even broader picture. I realize that doing this won't be easy, but do you think it could work. I really want to write a story that will be entertaining, hopefully raise some social/universal issues (such as everyone you meet may not neccessarily be bad, even "bad guys"), and most of all, be a story that will stand the test of time, so that if you were to read the book or watch the movie fifty years or two hundred years from now, it would still have meaning, unlike many films today which focus a lot on contemporary culture only.

I suppose I'm dreaming big, but hey, if it works out, then the payoff should be worth it right? And if this idea isn't big enough, why should I bother pursuing it (after all the things you guys say about "aim high" hehe :snoopy: ).

[dpaterso]

I realize that doing this won't be easy, but do you think it could work.
Yes. Essentially you're writing a big story but only selecting certain scenes for the novel and the screenplay, depending on which better suits each medium. Sounds like a complicated juggling act but it could make for an entertaining relationship between novel and screenplay. In theory.

It's the selling the idea to publishers and production companies part of the equation that makes me purse my lips. If the published novel proves successful enough to prompt sale of film rights and you have first crack at writing the screenplay, they're going to want an adaptation -- but you're not writing an adaptation. If you sell the screenplay and someone suggests a novel tie-in they're going to want a faithful rendering of the screenplay, not a different novel with a different storyline.

Writing both theoretically gives you twice the chance of finding success in the different markets, but I think you're dealing with two distinct products that may not have the opportunity to "come together" if one or the other finds a buyer. There may not be a payoff for both projects.

Shrug, my thoughts.

-Derek
My Web Page - naked women, bestial sex, and whopping big lies. (http://hometown.aol.co.uk/DPaterson57)

[NikeeGoddess]

I know that novels and movies are entirely different formats, and I'm trying to learn both of them so I don't make too many mistakes in either (such as movies are entirely visual and sound dependent, while novels let you play with all 5 senses, and maybe even some other ones).

this is true. that's why i'm suggesting you invest in screen adaptation books - they're very informative and probably more helpful than you might think. ie - they explain what works on film and what doesn't work and why. also, you may have to cut or combine minor characters.

Secondly, I realize that you will all say "Make sure the novel sells first". For this question, lets assume that the novel is a hit
not true. the success of the book is not as important as you might think. one of the reasons why novel adaptations are purchased is because someone else (a book publisher) thought the story was interesting enough to be published. they invested in you and the strength of you story BEFORE it went out to the public.

dp says:you're dealing with two distinct products
when you look for an agent - find one in a house that does both novels and screenplays. that way when she's done publishing your novel she's got a buddy in the screenplay department to send you to.

[Writing Again]

You don't have to "give up all rights" even if you sell the screenplay first... What you do is "Based on an original novel by" ... Whether the novel has sold yet or not. I imagine the novel could even be unwritten, but I would have at least a first draft done before I started submitting the script.

I don't know about learning both novel writing and script writing at the same time. I learned how to write novels while still a teenager... Just now learning how to write screenplays. They are such different animals that I'm not sure about trying to master both at once.

As to telling different stories, one the novel and one the movie, I fail to see a problem as so many movies adjust the story to the more general audience. Hannibal Lecter and Agent Starling found love together in the novels...Not so in the movies. In The Shining the cook died in the movie but not in the novel.

I found my last novel changed a lot in the screenplay and I tried to be as faithful to the story as the medium would allow.

Point...The chances of success for your first project are extremely slim...You might as well challenge yourself with the most creative concept you can find.

Go for it.

Just remember, don't be dashed if it does not work -- Use it as a learning experience and keep going.

[maestrowork]

I find adapting my novel to a screenplay challenging. Many things that work for a novel (including dialogue) doesn't for a screenplay. I have to expand something, cut something, and change dialogue, etc. And I've already written a book that's quite visual and cinematic already. Still a lot of work to do.

Certainly your book must sells first. It's good to get an agent who represents both books and scripts, but it's not necesary.