Killing a POV Character

Andrhia · Jan 10, 2008

I seem to recall stumbling across some wisdom that you shouldn't kill your first/an early POV character, or at least not right away, because the readers have become attached and will verily hate your guts.

So, hm. In the process of rearranging chapters into a better order, and chopping such thrilling introductory scenes as "heroine decides to go eat breakfast," I've realized that the almost-first POV character now is somebody who gets capped by the fourth chapter.

This is throw-book-at-wallery, yes? And I should take a good, hard look at telling the same scene from the POV of one of the other characters present who are there for a longer haul?

Or am I misremembering or misconstruing this advice?

DeleyanLee · Jan 10, 2008

I've never heard that advice, but if it's true then writers of Mystery and Thrillers and serial killer fiction are so royally screwed with the start of their books, they might as well not bother to write a word.

I'm just trying to picture what Jaws would've started with if not that girl going for a skinny dip and then getting eaten by the shark. Just isn't working for me, y'know?

Claudia Gray · Jan 10, 2008

I think it depends. If the ill-fated POV character is the only one/main one that the readers will have connected to at this point, then I think you might have unhappy or alienated readers. If, on the other hand, this character is part of a group and only bears part of the readers' attention and affection, then killing that person off very early might prove especially shocking and motivate readers to go on, because they'll want justice for this character.

JustGo · Jan 10, 2008

Personally, I love it when the writer kills off a major character early on. Makes me think the book is a lot less predictable.

Paichka · Jan 10, 2008

Jaws was slightly different, as the tasty half-nekkid morsel wasn't a POV character. You didn't care about her, except that you knew she was in for a bad end within the first few frames on screen.

I'm killing off a major POV character in my WIP. I think as long as it works with the storyline, you can justify it. Your readers won't forgive you if it's gratuitous, or it seems at odds with the plot.

I just read a book recently that killed off a major POV character in the last chapter, last couple of pages. I'm still irritated with the author (Jodi Piccoult) because there was no REASON to do it. The main storyline had been resolved without this character's death, and it just seemed like an out-of-nowhere unnecessary plot development.

There are plenty of novels where POV characters die, and it works. Take Stephen King's The Stand. By the end, only two POV characters are left standing. *heh-heh, a pun*

You get the idea. If it works, do it.

HeronW · Jan 10, 2008

Many stories start in Ch. 1 with one person's POV just so that person gets to see what dire end he's coming to. Ch 2 picks up with an MC's POV, who may or may not be related to the body end of Ch. 1, who's supposed to solve the problem of the rising body count.

kuwisdelu · Jan 10, 2008

It depends. If you kill off the only character the reader has gotten attached to so far without really, really good reason that's fairly clear, then the reader will be rather annoyed. Just think if Hamlet died at the beginning and how completely a lame story that'd be.

On the other hand, if you have another good character the readers can attack to ready to take up the story, it may not be so bad.

I guess the point is, if you have Narrator A and Narrator B, don't leave a bunch of story told by Anonymous between their two halves of the story. When Narrator A falls, Narrator B should be ready.

WriterInChains · Jan 10, 2008

I'm with JustGo. Give me a believable surprise & I'm a fan for life. I love it when a book surprises me (which happens less & less all the time), but feels like it couldn't have happened any other way.

In one book I loved (that keeps popping into my head at random times even a year after I read it!), one of the 3 main characters dies a chapter or two before the end. By then I was half in love with him, & it hit me pretty hard. So, yes, I LOVED it! I'll buy everything the author ever publishes now -- and I hope I'm not the only one who feels this way because it looks like I'm about to do something similar in my WIP.

Andrhia · Jan 10, 2008

You're all making me feel a lot better. By the time this POV character dies, you've already been introduced to a couple of major POV characters that run through the whole book, so the death isn't leaving the reader untethered.

And it's a nice piece of writing, too, to start the story off with, so I was feeling sorry for myself for possibly needing to rework it.

But I think given the context of everything that happens... it'll be OK. Yay!

Thanks again!

~grace~ · Jan 12, 2008

I'm glad you started this thread, Andrhia, because now I don't have to.

Can I refine the question to ask how we think this will work in YA? Does that make a difference?

Basically in my YA fantasy I have two POV characters, and I'm using the death of POV1 about halfway through to drastically change POV2's way of thinking/comfort level. Up to this point they've had equal space in the novel, but now POV2 takes over entirely. Basically it's POV2's story all along, I'm just giving the reader POV1 so that we all understand POV2 better, but in a way that makes it look like simply a split narrative so that when POV1 dies, it is hopefully unexpected and powerful.

Any thoughts? Observations? Queries? Complaints?

Sage · Jan 12, 2008

As long as POV2's been a POV character off and on throughout the book--which you say it has--I don't see any problem with that.

jscribbles · Jan 12, 2008

JustGo said:
Personally, I love it when the writer kills off a major character early on. Makes me think the book is a lot less predictable.

Tthis topic always makes me think of the first Scream movie (which I saw in the theater when I was like 16). I was all excited that Drew Barrymore was in it, and when she died in the first few minutes, I was like, "F***! NOW what's going to happen?" And I honestly remember being enthralled with the rest of the storyline.

Not to liken your book to a Scream movie, but if you're willing to kill off a pretty major character right off the bat, you'll probably have my attention.

katiemac · Jan 12, 2008

Tthis topic always makes me think of the first Scream movie (which I saw in the theater when I was like 16). I was all excited that Drew Barrymore was in it, and when she died in the first few minutes, I was like, "F***! NOW what's going to happen?" And I honestly remember being enthralled with the rest of the storyline.

I know there are a couple fans of the show LOST here, so I'll throw this out for consideration:

As I understand it, in the original pilot, the main character Jack was going to be played by Michael Keaton. They were going to promote the series as Michael Keaton's new show, yay, and then kill him off. (If you've seen the pilot with Matthew Fox, you can actually tell where Jack was supposed to die.) It was going to be a big audience shocker, but the studio eventually chickened out of the scenario (or decided the character was more valuable than they realized). They were afraid it would hurt the show to push the audience's affection on Jack - also the POV character - then kill him.

This setup, however, I feel like would have felt extremely manipulative, for shock value only. (They've since killed other characters for shock value, but that's nother story.)

Really, you should be okay as long as you're not trying to manipulate the readers.

kuwisdelu · Jan 12, 2008

Andrhia and grace: For what it counts, in my opinion, you both sound like you're in pretty good shape. Best of luck!

Pike · Jan 13, 2008

~grace~ said:
I'm glad you started this thread, Andrhia, because now I don't have to.

Can I refine the question to ask how we think this will work in YA? Does that make a difference?

Basically in my YA fantasy I have two POV characters, and I'm using the death of POV1 about halfway through to drastically change POV2's way of thinking/comfort level. Up to this point they've had equal space in the novel, but now POV2 takes over entirely. Basically it's POV2's story all along, I'm just giving the reader POV1 so that we all understand POV2 better, but in a way that makes it look like simply a split narrative so that when POV1 dies, it is hopefully unexpected and powerful.

Any thoughts? Observations? Queries? Complaints?

Taking out my wee-wittle nugget of knowledge...

I think that any thing goes in a novel as long as it moves the story along towards a fulfilling end. Killing off a major character to show a different dimension of another Character sounds like a great idea. What's not to love about motivating your MC? Obstacles should pave their road and get steeper to climb. Death is a real hum-dinger.

Pike

ChaosTitan · Jan 13, 2008

katiemac said:
I know there are a couple fans of the show LOST here, so I'll throw this out for consideration:

As I understand it, in the original pilot, the main character Jack was going to be played by Michael Keaton. They were going to promote the series as Michael Keaton's new show, yay, and then kill him off. <Snipped>

This setup, however, I feel like would have felt extremely manipulative, for shock value only. (They've since killed other characters for shock value, but that's nother story.)

Another film that used this scenario well was Deep Blue Sea. Granted, it wasn't a terrific film, but by giving Samuel L. Jackson top billing and utilizing him in the trailer, the scene where he's eaten by a shark halfway through was a huge surprise (and pretty damned funny).

It's always a risk to kill off a POV character halfway through, but it can be done well (and has been done well). However, if you can't pull it off effectively, it could make the reader hurl the book across the room.

seppuku05 · Jan 13, 2008

I think you can do anything in order to get an effect. If you can do something well, then you should do it.

Killing of a POV character would be kind of interesting, because you build up a relationship with your POV character and all of your opinions will have revolved around them. When they die, you will hate the killer (not necessarily the writer

) but it will fuel them to want to know what happens to the victim and see that justice is brought. Of course, disappointing them is something you might want to avoid, your POV character's death then needs a purpose.

In the story I'm writing I kill an important character at the beginning (after setting up the two main character's relationship), but it's through the other character's reflection and memory the reader will make the connection with that character. The death of the character allows for all of the things torturing the other to occur, and by killing her the main sympathy is drawn and the memory is just adding salt into the wound.

David I · Jan 14, 2008

Paichka said:
Jaws was slightly different, as the tasty half-nekkid morsel wasn't a POV character. You didn't care about her, except that you knew she was in for a bad end within the first few frames on screen.

Umm, you are aware that Jaws was a bestselling novel well before it was a movie, right?

althrasher · Jan 14, 2008

David I said:
Umm, you are aware that Jaws was a bestselling novel well before it was a movie, right?

Umm...does that matter? Her point remains the same.

Birol · Jan 14, 2008

The content of the book was decidedly different than the content of the movie. POVs are also handled differently in film than they are in books.

Paichka · Jan 14, 2008

David I said:
Umm, you are aware that Jaws was a bestselling novel well before it was a movie, right?

A bit snarky of you, but yes indeedy, I was aware. I read the book before I saw the movie, in point of fact. And I wouldn't say WELL before -- Jaws was published in 1974, and the movie was out by 1975. Its screen appeal was almost instantly recognized, though Spielburg disliked the novel's characters and said he wanted the shark to win.

My point remains: in the book, the first few victims of Oh So Big and Toothy were nothing more than scene-setting cannon-fodder. Killing off the "random red shirts" (trekkie reference) isn't going to peeve off the readers, because that's what they're EXPECTING in a genre novel of that type. This thread is about killing off major POV characters, which tasty-morsel was not. I don't even think she was a POV character, but I can't remember honestly.

BOTTOM LINE to OP: If killing off a major POV character works in the narrative, do it. If your betas think it's a cheap shot, you may wish to rethink it.

Just my 2 cents.

SageFury · Jan 15, 2008

Andrhia said:
I seem to recall stumbling across some wisdom that you shouldn't kill your first/an early POV character, or at least not right away, because the readers have become attached and will verily hate your guts.

So, hm. In the process of rearranging chapters into a better order, and chopping such thrilling introductory scenes as "heroine decides to go eat breakfast," I've realized that the almost-first POV character now is somebody who gets capped by the fourth chapter.

This is throw-book-at-wallery, yes? And I should take a good, hard look at telling the same scene from the POV of one of the other characters present who are there for a longer haul?

Or am I misremembering or misconstruing this advice?

Whats sad is that many want to see a pov char killed just because like stated in this topic, its unexpected. I hate when they kill chars I'm attached to off but I don't hate the writers for it and still go on with their next stories.

HOWEVER I do hate writers that kill animals... Its just always been a touchy subject with me. Rather see a person die than an animal.

katiemac · Jan 15, 2008

HOWEVER I do hate writers that kill animals... Its just always been a touchy subject with me. Rather see a person die than an animal.

Oh, I'm the same way. Can't stand it.

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