Completed Novel...now what??? HELP!

WistfulWriter7 · Dec 29, 2007

Hello all,
I very new to this site and I just lost myself for a few hours reading things I didn't really need to know. =p So, I figured, I would simply ask my question. I just finished my first novel. It is a fantasy-fiction novel and I need advice about what to do next. I have edited it to the best of my abilities and have passed it on to other readers to do their worst. I'm not trying to be full of myself, but I've gotten very little criticism that my novel is fundamentally problematic and, like most writers, I believe deeply in work. But, I can see, writing the first draft was the easy part. I was wondering what to do now? Please share any and all wisdom. There is nothing I want more than to be a published writer. I've even begun the squeal! I couldn't stay away. Thank you all in advance, Jen

WistfulWriter7 · Dec 29, 2007

oops, *I am very new to this site

wow, first few words and already typos...this is probably one of my bigger problems...luckily for me I have a friend who is obsessed with spelling and grammar to help me!

blacbird · Dec 29, 2007

WistfulWriter7 said:
I was wondering what to do now? Please share any and all wisdom. There is nothing I want more than to be a published writer.

Step 1: "Forgive me, Father, for I have sinned . . . "

caw

James D. Macdonald · Dec 29, 2007

First:

Start work on your next book. Don't even think about leaving your house before you've written two pages.

Next:

Go to a bookstore. Find books on the shelves that are similar to yours. Find the publishers. Learn which agents represented them. Get those publishers' and those agents' guidelines. Follow those guidelines to the letter.

Repeat for your second book.

And your third.

And your fourth.

And so on.

jclarkdawe · Dec 29, 2007

As well as working on your next book, and if you're really brave, you might want to go to the share your work (SYW) forum here (the password I believe is "vista"). There's a fantasy forum there where you can post your first chapter. (Before you do, take a look at some of the other postings so you know what you're in for.)

And if you have the courage of the damned, develop a query letter and submit it to the query letter forum in SYW. There, with gentle, loving hands, we'll kindly shape your query into something that might get an agent interested in your book. (Those of you ROFL about the gentle and loving hands, let her keep her illusions a bit longer.) To get your manuscript to an agent, you'll need to develop a query letter, which involves different skills than writing a novel.

Best of luck,

Jim Clark-Dawe

veinglory · Dec 29, 2007

It is a good idea to get some impartial readers to look at it. Even otherwise very frank and blunt friends will not tell you everything you need to know about a manuscript. There is SYW here, also critters.org and critiquecircle.com

Stijn Hommes · Dec 29, 2007

If you just finished your novel and already know it's a problematic thing, you need to do editing (with or without the SYW forum) before you go any further down the chain with this work and start sending it out to agents or publishers. A novel is rarely truly finished after its first draft.

Also, the fact you called your work a "fantasy-fiction novel" irked me. Novels are fiction by default, especially if they're fantasy. You should simply call it a fantasy novel if you want to avoid annoying editors as well. I should know, because the reason it bothered me is that it's a thing I've acquired from listening to business professionals.

The best of luck with your novel. I hope I've provided some useful notes.

dawinsor · Dec 29, 2007

You can also trade critiques at the Online Writing Workshop, which is specifically for speculative fiction. And when you're ready to search for an agent, you can consult agentquery.com for suggestions that you then check against Backgrounds and Bewares here.

Straka · Dec 29, 2007

I highly suggest having other writers read your query. I crafted mine with the help of a friend who is good a grammar but not a writer and the writers here ripped it a new one. ;-)

Listen to James. Don’t stop writing. I didn't start queering agents until I had 4 books written but that was my choice.

You could also try sacrificing a small goat to the publishing god.... just a thought.

scarletpeaches · Dec 29, 2007

Straka said:
I highly suggest having other writers read your query. I crafted mine with the help of a friend who is good a grammar but not a writer and the writers here ripped it a new one. ;-)

Listen to James. Don’t stop writing. I didn't start queering agents until I had 4 books written but that was my choice.

You could also try sacrificing a small goat to the publishing god.... just a thought.

So that's where I've been going wrong...

Irysangel · Dec 29, 2007

If it is your first novel, people might not give you harsh feedback. I'm sorry, but it's true. There's so much "I'm proud of you!" syndrome going around that people will pick on the small things, but not the gaping plot holes that would hurt your feelings if they told you about them. I had the exact same problem. I sent my first novel off to a reading group and everyone said "Oh, it's great! No problems!"

This was encouraging - but frustrating. I did join an online group that had NO interest in sparing my feelings and they immediately ripped it to shreds...and it deserved to be shredded. So please do take everything with a grain of salt and look for a perfect stranger or two to be mean to your work.

nevada · Dec 29, 2007

Straka said:
You could also try sacrificing a small goat to the publishing god.... just a thought.

Thats ba-a-a-a-ad advice. :e2bouncey

(pretend that's a goat. we're all writers, we can do that)

Someone had to say it.

Shady Lane · Dec 29, 2007

Completed Novel 1 ----> Completed Novel 2

yayyy flowcharts.

seriously, awesome job finishing the first one! You've already come a lot farther than must people who want to be published.

Dustry Joe · Dec 29, 2007

Black rooster much more pleasing to the loa than goat.

If you have another novel in mind, I would say to toss this one in a drawer and write the second one. Then, a couple months later, go back and start editing, re-writing, and just generally musing on the the first one.

Submit some sections for review on sites like this one. There are also sites more specialized for fantasy, etc.

Once you get the feeling that it's really a product that can sell, not just your maiden voyage, training exercise, follow some of the advice above for locating agents, etc.

They don't beat a path to the door of first novels, sorry. But there's a chance yours is one that will.

Good luck

slcboston · Dec 29, 2007

James D. Macdonald said:
Go to a bookstore. Find books on the shelves that are similar to yours. Find the publishers. Learn which agents represented them. Get those publishers' and those agents' guidelines. Follow those guidelines to the letter.

It's this bit that's always puzzled me: how do I find out which agent/agency represented authors whose work I feel is similar to my own?

Publishers are easy, as those are listed on the inside of the book, but agents seem to be harder to track, at least in my limited experience.

johnzakour · Dec 29, 2007

This should help some:

http://www.querytracker.net/

Dustry Joe · Dec 29, 2007

Indeed.

Also, take a look at some first novels by these writers: very often they mention their agent in the dedication.

I frequently google things like "Chuck Palaniuck, literary agent, email" or some such.

Also many of the agent lists sites search by keywords. Authors usually appear on their list of clients and therefore engage the search.

IceCreamEmpress · Dec 29, 2007

Dustry Joe said:
Also, take a look at some first novels by these writers: very often they mention their agent in the dedication.

Yes, except I think you mean "acknowledgments" rather than "dedication". I can only remember ever seeing two books dedicated to agents--one to Carol Brandt and one to Esther Newberg.

Dustry Joe · Dec 29, 2007

Ah, yes, that's the word I was fumbling for.

(Okay, okay, I can't spell it and don't want to have to read seven posts about how spelling things wrong on a writer's forum is a sign of the End Times)

Edward G · Dec 29, 2007

I finished my first novel recently as well. I've querried about 30 agents and heard back from about 15-20 of them, all form rejection letters, which means there's absolutely no way to tell why they rejected it.

Frankly I think it's a good story. My wife thinks it's a good story, but I must admit, it's just another story; there's absolutely no reason why it should be published over some other essentially well-written story in the same genre. It doesn't rise above the competition, even in my own estimation. It's worth reading, but there's no reason someone should take a chance on me as a new author with no track record based on what they see in my query or first three chapters.

What can I say? It's a good story, reads fast and keeps the suspense up, has an interesting take on a ghost, but it's just another story. It was my first. I feel like I learned everything over the course of last year. But without a doubt, it is the first pancake of the batch.

I'll probably self-publish, or go through a publishing company I know of who will get it up as a Kindle Book (no advance, royalties only), then I'll come in here and tell everyone about it. What else is there to do?

Toothpaste · Dec 29, 2007

Sorry Tom, exactly how is your personal tale helping the OP? I'm assuming you are implying she should self-publish because of your negative personal experience. Shall I share my success story as well as an implication she should "traditionally" publish? I don't consider your post particularly helpful. If you want to offer the suggestion of self-publishing, then do it, but don't offer your story as why one should self publish. There are a lot of good reasons to, however your individual experience has no bearing whatsoever on what Jen should do considering you are two completely different people.

badducky · Dec 29, 2007

Let me say this for the record:

Badducky is almost always against self-publishing, and I have yet to encounter anyone in five years of asking around that I thought to myself ought to be pursuing self-publishing.

The OP should absolutely not self-publish. Neither should Tom.

Do what Uncle Jim just advised you to do. Do it over and over again. And be sure to thank Uncle Jim for giving you the best advice you ever got.

Heck, I'll do it right now.

Hey, Uncle Jim, thanks for all your excellent advice!

edit to add: in case you didn't know "Uncle Jim" is massively multiply published novelist, and AW Sage, James D MacDonald.

Edward G · Dec 29, 2007

Toothpaste said:
Sorry Tom, exactly how is your personal tale helping the OP? I'm assuming you are implying she should self-publish because of your negative personal experience. Shall I share my success story as well as an implication she should "traditionally" publish? I don't consider your post particularly helpful. If you want to offer the suggestion of self-publishing, then do it, but don't offer your story as why one should self publish. There are a lot of good reasons to, however your individual experience has no bearing whatsoever on what Jen should do considering you are two completely different people.

I agree. It's not particularly helpful. But I have nothing to say that can help. You do, obviously, so you should tell us your story. I mean, you must have got an advance that you are not expected to devote to publication of the novel, right? John Grisham, apparently, had to go on the Colbert Report, a comedy show, to flogg his Playing for Pizza (which I read). He was trying to answer the questions and the commentator kept making jokes. It was debasing--and that's John Grisham. But that's not you, right? You got published, you got a good deal, you don't have to do your own publicity, and all is good. So share your story. I think I've been rejected. So what other choice do I have? Should I set my manuscript on a shelf, never to be read, and let the agents be my gatekeepers to my own dream?

I just wish we could talk honestly about this, without arguing or getting defensive.

Edward G · Dec 29, 2007

badducky said:
Let me say this for the record:

Badducky is almost always against self-publishing, and I have yet to encounter anyone in five years of asking around that I thought to myself ought to be pursuing self-publishing.

The OP should absolutely not self-publish. Neither should Tom.

No way! The OP may do fantastic and have great success. And let me be the first to say that I am following Uncle Jim's advice.

But I am a loser. The publishing industry doesn't want my story. Or if they would, it doesn't matter because the agents have pre-rejected it. So what should I do? Start on my next one? I am, and it's going to be a doosey! But what about my first one? Do you think I should toss it in the garbage? I mean really, what?

badducky · Dec 29, 2007

James D. Macdonald said:
First:

Start work on your next book. Don't even think about leaving your house before you've written two pages.

Next:

Go to a bookstore. Find books on the shelves that are similar to yours. Find the publishers. Learn which agents represented them. Get those publishers' and those agents' guidelines. Follow those guidelines to the letter.

Repeat for your second book.

And your third.

And your fourth.

And so on.

Tom, this is exactly what you should do. That's it. That's the secret. All it takes is a bit of patience, a bit of persistence, and a bit of effort.

Adrienne and I are both in our twenties, so it's not like it really takes >that< much time, if you write a good book.

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