Fine If It Works or Beyond Annoying?

WendyNYC · Dec 19, 2007

My WIP is told from 3 POVs: grandmother, mother, daughter. The primary story is about the mother. So far, I'm about 90 pages into it and it's been written in 3rd person limited, but a very intimate POV from the grandmother and mother's perspective. Each POV gets it's own chapter, so it's clear when "heads" are changing.

Now I'd like to add the daughter--she's a teenager and I'm considering switching to 1st person. Would that be wildly annoying, 90 pages into a book and all the sudden it's *BAM* "I" this and "I" that? I could keep it in 3rd limited if needed.

Thoughts?

scarletpeaches · Dec 19, 2007

It might be jarring, but...if it works, it works.

Hey - if it's good enough for James Patterson, right...?

Prawn · Dec 19, 2007

It could work. It's all in the execution. Why are you bringing it in so late?

In Cormac McCarthy the Road, about halfway thru the book it shifts form the father's perspective to the son's perspective for one scene, then shifts back. We don't hear much more from the son until the final scene.

It can be done.

JustGo · Dec 19, 2007

I could see it being a major issue for readers - like Scarlet said, it could be quite jarring. Then again, it could just add variety and flavor. Give it a try and see if it works.
Ask a few of your early-stage editors if it works before getting too attached, though. A switch like that could lead the reader to having some major suspension of disbelief issues or the like. If it doesn't work, stick with 3rd limited - most people love consistency.

WendyNYC · Dec 19, 2007

Prawn said:
It could work. It's all in the execution. Why are you bringing it in so late?

She's been hanging around in the story, but she hasn't been integral until now. In the previous chapter, she did something incredibly stupid and I think the readers would be wondering why. But now you have me wondering if I should be sprinkling more of her motivations before this point when I revise. Hmmm.

maestrowork · Dec 19, 2007

Why not do it in three 1st person POVs? The problem I find is that you said the primary story is about the mother, and yet the first person is the daughter's. That automatically puts the daughter more on the center stage because now she actually has a direct voice and a closer intimacy with the readers.

Not that it won't work -- the Great Gatsby, for example, when the story really isn't about Nick Carraway.

That said, since the daughter is a teenager, I sense that there will be a lot of "I this and I that" as well as navel gazing: "Woe be me!" (We've all been teenagers -- we know how self-absorbed we could be). The extra intimacy may tilt toward the daughter, when the primary story is about the mother. And if you make the teenager more observant instead of self-indulgent, you run the risk of not appearing authentic.

Personally, I would probably either use 3rd limited through and through, or choose 1st person for the mother.

The only way to know is try it out and see. You know the story and the characters best.

Meerkat · Dec 19, 2007

What if you had a minor passage in the beginning, or even as a prologue, which was the daughter's POV, so the reader would subconsciously expect a reappearance?

WendyNYC · Dec 19, 2007

maestrowork said:
The problem I find is that you said the primary story is about the mother, and yet the first person is the daughter's. That automatically put the daughter more on the center stage because now she actually has a direct voice and a closer intimacy with the readers.

That's a good point. I definitely want her to sound like a teenager, and she would be describing her mother somewhat, but she'd also be talking about this stupid thing she just did.

Nakhlasmoke · Dec 19, 2007

I know in Alias Grace, M Atwood skips between third and first, why not have a read through that to see how she handles it. I'm sure other people could give you some other suggestions if she's not your cup of tea.

Anyway. I say, write it. you'll only know what works if you try. Sometimes what we try is a failure, but we still needed to learn why, and take chances.

scribbler1382 · Dec 19, 2007

Joe Konrath has done it. His main story is in 1st, with the odd scene/chapter in 3rd when we go into the killer's POV. The publishers were so concerned about it, though, that they put the killer passages in a different font. Might be a warning there.

a_sharp · Dec 19, 2007

Meerkat said:
What if you had a minor passage in the beginning, or even as a prologue, which was the daughter's POV, so the reader would subconsciously expect a reappearance?

This is what I was thinking, only different. An opening paragraph that's basically some observations by an undisclosed narrator who turns out to be the first-person daughter in the second paragraph. You don't have to open with I's or me's. That would allow your reader to segue in with you.

C.bronco · Dec 19, 2007

The Stand was told from several POV's, and that worked well. I say to give it a try and see how it works out.

maestrowork · Dec 19, 2007

a_sharp said:
This is what I was thinking, only different. An opening paragraph that's basically some observations by an undisclosed narrator who turns out to be the first-person daughter in the second paragraph. You don't have to open with I's or me's. That would allow your reader to segue in with you.

The only issue is that then you're implying the narrator of the novel is the teenage daughter (albeit all grown-up, maybe). Nicholas Sparks did that with the Notebook but we knew the narrator was the old man at the beginning. If that's the case, it's good to go. If not, then you're setting yourself up. Also, adding a prologue for prologue's sake is not necessarily a good thing.

In Konrath's case, the protagonist IS the 1st person narrator, thus the occasional 3rd person (to show what the protagonist doesn't know) is fine. The narrative distance goes that direction. But if you're going in the other direction (getting more intimate) then my advice still stands: whose story is this?

a_sharp · Dec 19, 2007

MaestroWork said:
The only issue is that then you're implying the narrator of the novel is the teenage daughter (albeit all grown-up, maybe). Nicholas Sparks did that with the Notebook but we knew the narrator was the old man at the beginning. If that's the case, it's good to go. If not, then you're setting yourself up. Also, adding a prologue for prologue's sake is not necessarily a good thing.

I wasn't suggesting a prologue, Ray. I meant a chapter opening, such as this:

Chapter N

Walks in the park can be fun if you're with someone you like. And if it's not December in Minneapolis. Maybe it's a circulation thing with older people.

Gran was waiting for me by the fountain in her green wool coat...

The first paragraph might go deeper than my short example, so that by the time you reach the second paragraph your reader has made the transition and is prepared for the first-person framework that follows.

I suggested a telegraphed phrase, ending with "older people," to hint that this is no longer the mother's POV. And then in the second, the girl's name for her grandmother, whatever that is, lets the reader down on solid ground.

Of course my example doesn't fit the actual story, but it illustrates how one might avoid a jarring transition.

*Shrugs* Maybe it doesn't work...

scribbler1382 · Dec 19, 2007

C.bronco said:
The Stand was told from several POV's, and that worked well. I say to give it a try and see how it works out.

That was multiple viewpoints, but they were all in the third person, IIRC.

Richard White · Dec 19, 2007

I believe someone once said, there is no "right" or "wrong" technique when it comes to writing.

If it makes the story interesting/exciting/moving, then it's right.
If it slows the story down, is boring or confusing to the reader, then it's wrong.
Worrying about it to the point of not trying is wrong.
Realizing it's not working and realizing why it's not working is right.

JMNSHO. *grin*

scribbler1382 · Dec 19, 2007

maestrowork said:
In Konrath's case, the protagonist IS the 1st person narrator, thus the occasional 3rd person (to show what the protagonist doesn't know) is fine. The narrative distance goes that direction. But if you're going in the other direction (getting more intimate) then my advice still stands: whose story is this?

Interesting point. I didn't think of it that way. That would be jarring going in that direction, IMO.

ACEnders · Dec 19, 2007

I don't see any problem with it. I have several POVs (4), all 3rd person, and my betas haven't complained at all. There wasn't any other option for me to write this book. This is how it had to be, and it works.

I say give it a shot and see how it turns out. You can always change it later if need be.

mikeland · Dec 19, 2007

WendyNYC said:
She's been hanging around in the story, but she hasn't been integral until now. In the previous chapter, she did something incredibly stupid and I think the readers would be wondering why. But now you have me wondering if I should be sprinkling more of her motivations before this point when I revise. Hmmm.

I think you've put your finger on the real issue here. You've got a major character worthy of her own POV that you describe as "hanging around" for the first 90 pages. If that's how you view it, it is hard to believe the reader is going to have much of an impression of her. In my mind, that is what will make the POV shift, 1st person or 3rd, jarring.

But I think fleshing her out in the beginning is something for the revision, like you say. It sounds like right now you need to write the next chapter in 1st person so that you can hear what this character has to say. It almost feels like you need her to tell you how integral she is to this story. Nothing wrong with that. That's what first drafts are for.

WendyNYC · Dec 19, 2007

Thanks everyone. I'm going to give it a try. I can always rewrite it back into 3rd if it's not working.

The book I'm reading now, The Brief Wondrous Life of Oscar Wao, switches from 3rd to 1st, but the narrator in 3rd has SUCH a strong voice that you almost need a break from it.

James D. Macdonald · Dec 19, 2007

No one sees your first draft but you.

Fine If It Works or Beyond Annoying?

fiddle-dee-dee

Writing is finite,revising infinite

Digging through graves of giants

fiddle-dee-dee

Fear the Death Ray

Claims the loan was a gift

fiddle-dee-dee

yes

Write For You, Edit For The Reader

Somebody give me an A

I have plans...

Fear the Death Ray

Somebody give me an A

Write For You, Edit For The Reader

Stealthy Plot Bunny Peddler

Write For You, Edit For The Reader

Self-Banned

Call me Pookie

fiddle-dee-dee

Your Genial Uncle