How long does it take a Train to get moving?

Shane Fitzsimmons · Sep 14, 2007

Anyone know how long it would take a 3 - 4 car train with about 15,000 pounds of cargo aboard to go from 0 - 60 MPH?

Preferably a steam-powered locomotive, but I'll take any estimations I can get right about now.

johnnysannie · Sep 14, 2007

In the past few years, I've ridden several vintage steam trains and my best guesstimate would be somewhere around ten minutes. Sixty miles an hour would be quite a high speed for an old steam train, though.

The train starts slow and picks up speed; if there is an incline, it can pick up speed faster.

My grandmother's family were railroaders and honestly, I would think about 45 miles an hour was pretty top speed depending on the era and decade. To gain speed - on a steam train - basically you had to build up heat by making the fire bigger which in turn created more steam but too much fire in the firebox could be a dangerous thing.

Hope this helps!

Colin McHale · Sep 14, 2007

I can't really give you a clear answer here myself. But you might need to give a few more details to those who can: how big is the steam locomotive in question? How much horsepower does it have? Does it have a high tractive effort (better for pulling heavy loads)?

Is this a passenger train? 3 or 4 passenger cars filled with 60 people each would almost certainly exceed the 15k pound "cargo" you mentioned.

If it's a freight train--15k of cargo is almost nothing. Especially when divided by 3 to 4 cars. A single boxcar would outweigh that cargo by 2 to 3 times. Almost a empty freight train. If that's the case, I expect it would get up to speed rather quickly (assuming it's running on a straight line without any serious hills or grades).

Rich · Sep 14, 2007

You gotta give more info.

Colin McHale · Sep 14, 2007

johnnysannie said:
In the past few years, I've ridden several vintage steam trains and my best guesstimate would be somewhere around ten minutes. Sixty miles an hour would be quite a high speed for an old steam train, though.

The train starts slow and picks up speed; if there is an incline, it can pick up speed faster.

My grandmother's family were railroaders and honestly, I would think about 45 miles an hour was pretty top speed depending on the era and decade.

Like you said, it depends on the era and decade. But later era engines could and did exceed 100 mph. Some could even reach 120 mph. They're faster than you might think.

jst5150 · Sep 14, 2007

Well, with dinner, wine and foreplay, about three hours?

Shane Fitzsimmons · Sep 14, 2007

The story takes place in the future, and in the United States, so it can really be whatever kind of train it needs to be in order to reach some decent speed. The only requirements is that it needs to run off of coal power, and since pretty much all steam-powered trains in the United States have been replaced by better trains, I imagine this is a pretty old locomotive.

I see it as a freight train though. Aside from the engine car it really only needs two other cars attached to it, but figure at least one or two more cars for a bunch of people to pile into.

Cargo is somewhere between 10 and 100 people, a bunch of guns, and a 12,000 pound bomb.

It needs to travel roughly 50 miles. The faster it can go the better.

So I guess more specifically, what kind of steam-powered train would this need to be? How fast could it go? How long would it take it to reach top speed?

As far as terrain goes... I'm not really sure to be honest. I imagine it'd vary a lot. Might have to go up and down some hills, but there'd probably be a lot of flat space too.

Colin McHale · Sep 14, 2007

Maybe try:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2-8-2

or

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4-8-2

Both of these engines could pull freight at a pretty decent clip. Both would be overkill for your cargo, but they could reach max speed a lot quicker with a lighter load, of course. The 4-8-2, according to another site, could hit 80 mph.

Rich · Sep 14, 2007

You sure you want to write this, shane?

Shane Fitzsimmons · Sep 14, 2007

Why wouldn't I?

Shane Fitzsimmons · Sep 14, 2007

Also, does anyone happen to know how long it would take this mysterious train to back up about a mile, mile and a half from a fully stopped position?

Basically my train needs to be able to back up about a mile to get off of a side-track and then have the tracks shift so it can move forward in the right direction.

Siddow · Sep 14, 2007

You need to figure out how fast it goes, then do some math. Can't you google for it? Surely there are sites out there dedicated to steam locomotives. Plus, books in the library.

ALG71 · Sep 14, 2007

If you use an old steam powered locomotive, don't forget to use the different colored logs like old Doc Brown. (8

That's about all I can offer.

EDIT: Actually, if you live near a train yard you could always go ask the engineers at the station there. Tell them you're a writer and you're doing research for a book. Maybe even offer to buy one of them lunch while you interview them, if you need alot of information about trains. The old veteran engineers probably know tons about trains and not just the regular freight train engines.

And...woohoo this is my 100th post.

Rich · Sep 14, 2007

You're kinda looking for answers the easiest way you can, Shane. We're mostly writers, not engineers.

However, if you put the scene on a subway train I can tell you all you need to know.

Keep in mind that most here are here to help--not to go so far as wiping your ass.

Siddow · Sep 14, 2007

Ugh. You're in Wake County. I just checked the public library website. You're better off online. There's FIVE books about steam locomotives in your library. Only two of them in adult non-fiction.

But google turns up some interesting sites. I got good hits for 'speed of steam locomotives', one with a diagram of train parts. Get busy.

Shane Fitzsimmons · Sep 14, 2007

Better advice would probably have been for you two to simply say: "Ignore us, our advice is worthless. Our intentions are purely mean spirited ones."

If all the advice in this section of the forums is as worthless and spiteful as the two of yours, then it sort of makes me wonder why they put up a research section at all. Why not instead simply put up a banner that says: "If you haven't been able to find your answers, look harder."

Siddow · Sep 14, 2007

Shane Fitzsimmons said:
Better advice would probably have been for you two to simply say: "Ignore us, our advice is worthless. Our intentions are purely mean spirited ones."

If all the advice in this section of the forums is as worthless and spiteful as the two of yours, then it sort of makes me wonder why they put up a research section at all. Why not instead simply put up a banner that says: "If you haven't been able to find your answers, look harder."

Are you talking to ME? I checked your library, dude. I don't know crap about speed of locomotives, but I was willing to help you look for the information you needed.

Shane Fitzsimmons · Sep 14, 2007

To be more clear though: I'm doing my research on google, and while I'm learning a lot about these things my questions seem to be too specific and the web is being of no use. I'm at work, so the library and bookstores are out of the question. For the first time I happen to see this section of the forums, where it basically is an invite to ask questions and have potential experts answer them. I thought I was using them properly.

To be told how to do my own research is obnoxious. I'm doing the research. I see no reason as to why this section of the forums can't be a resource too, especially since it seems that's what they're here for. I'm not asking anybody to look this stuff up for me, but if there's a guy around here who knows a lot about this sort of thing, then I see no reason why I shouldn't save myself what could be a lot of hours at the book store for a rather piddly detail, especially if somebody already has the information in their heads.

Rich · Sep 14, 2007

You didn't want research, Shane; you wanted somebody to write for you.

Shane Fitzsimmons · Sep 14, 2007

Siddow said:
Are you talking to ME? I checked your library, dude. I don't know crap about speed of locomotives, but I was willing to help you look for the information you needed.

It sounded like you checked my library to tell me that I'm an idiot for not looking myself. If you were seriously trying to be helpful rather than just trying to imply that I'm lazy like Rich did, then I'm sorry. I didn't see your rep message before I made that post, so maybe Rich's bile tainted the way I looked at your post.

Seriously, if I took your intentions the wrong way, I really am sorry. Given our recent interactions, maybe the misunderstanding is a bit understandable?

Siddow · Sep 14, 2007

Shane Fitzsimmons said:
It sounded like you checked my library to tell me that I'm an idiot for not looking myself. If you were seriously trying to be helpful rather than just trying to imply that I'm lazy like Rich did, then I'm sorry. I didn't see your rep message before I made that post, so maybe Rich's bile tainted the way I looked at your post.

Seriously, if I took your intentions the wrong way, I really am sorry. Given our recent interactions, maybe the misunderstanding is a bit understandable?

Your original post is a math question, so I assumed you didn't know the speed of the trains, or else you could have done the math. I assumed you didn't know the speed of the trains because you hadn't done enough research, so I was trying to help you find the answers you need to do the math, because I really suck at math.

Again, apology accepted.

How many times do I have to rep and un-rep you before you get forum-trained?

tjwriter · Sep 14, 2007

Rich said:
You didn't want research, Shane; you wanted somebody to write for you.

I'm just not seeing this, Rich. How in the heck could someone write for him based on the information here? The title of this forum is Story Research. Heck, sometimes I pop silly questions on the board that I could research, given enough time, but there is such a wide range of expertise on these boards, I'm sure someone's bound to know the answer.

Heck, a train buff could come along and give him more than enough details to find his answer. It never hurts to ask and see if someone knows.

Sorry, Shane, I don't know jack about trains other than the coal hauling ones near my mom's take off, back up, and stop at in a decent amount of time. It's lovely when they stop on the tracks and you're late for work.

johnnysannie · Sep 14, 2007

Shane Fitzsimmons said:
To be more clear though: I'm doing my research on google, and while I'm learning a lot about these things my questions seem to be too specific and the web is being of no use. I'm at work, so the library and bookstores are out of the question. For the first time I happen to see this section of the forums, where it basically is an invite to ask questions and have potential experts answer them. I thought I was using them properly.

To be told how to do my own research is obnoxious. I'm doing the research. I see no reason as to why this section of the forums can't be a resource too, especially since it seems that's what they're here for. I'm not asking anybody to look this stuff up for me, but if there's a guy around here who knows a lot about this sort of thing, then I see no reason why I shouldn't save myself what could be a lot of hours at the book store for a rather piddly detail, especially if somebody already has the information in their heads.

Dude, chill!

The point others are attempting to make is that you may not be doing enough of your own research. This particular forum is helpful to a point but there comes a time when a writer has to get out and do some legwork. The library - even in this cyber age - can be a big help. The suggestions about talking to engineers is very good also - if there are no railroads close to you, use the 'Net. There are many sites devoted to steam trains and steam train enthusiasts. You can find the information if you dig deeper.

In my area alone, there is the Branson Scenic Railroad, the Northwest Arkansas Railroad, and another in NW Arkansas. These are about an hour, two at the most from my front door. I have ridden these trains and the staff - mostly retired railroad folk are very informative. Contact them through their sites or make a trip to a steam train near you. I've ridden them in other places too - East Texas, Oklahoma, etc.

Please don't be offended but you remind me of a green news guy when I still worked in radio. He couldn't get the stories or any details so he would ask me to call and he could not understand why they would give the info to me and I finally told him, man, it's because I ask the questions!!!!!

Shane Fitzsimmons · Sep 14, 2007

Siddow said:
How many times do I have to rep and un-rep you before you get forum-trained?

Probably at least one more.

In other news, I've determined that the first five and a half miles of the trip is going to be on a slight incline, followed by a little less than seven and a half miles on a slight decline. Slight being like, maybe 15 degrees on the incline, maybe 10 degrees on the decline. The rest of the trip is mostly flat.

I've got all the workings for a good formula here except the actual acceleration capabilities of the damn train.

Shane Fitzsimmons · Sep 14, 2007

johnny said:
The point others are attempting to make is that you may not be doing enough of your own research. This particular forum is helpful to a point but there comes a time when a writer has to get out and do some legwork.

Look, again, I'm not adverse to doing my own research. I've been doing my own research, even on this topic. I shot off a short question on here in case somebody had the information in their heads already. It's not like I asked myself the question, decided to throw it up on a bunch of forums and sat back and waited for other people to do my research for me. I'm doing it. The only reason I even got more specific with my question is because Rich said I wasn't specific enough, so I thought maybe he actually had something to offer other than sarcasm.

Anyway, researching isn't a new thing to me. I've spent the past two months pretty much doing nothing except researching various types of radiation and the capabilities of radio waves and extreme survival skills and military weapons and tactics and vehicles and how the public works in cities function and how long people are capable of walking in the heat before they pass out and all sorts of stuff about desert survival and what sand can do to guns and what the shelf-life of ammunition is and whether or not people can survive on an all-fish diet, and I've been gathering tons of information on military bases and coal power and how dam's work and how nuclear power plants work and I could go on, but hopefully you get the picture. Effective research isn't a foreign concept to me. But asking questions is one of the many effective ways to research. It's been my least used way, but I'm not going to ignore its potential usefulness simply out of principle.

How long does it take a Train to get moving?

Shane Fitzsimmons

johnnysannie

Colin McHale

Rich

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I'm super! Thanks for asking

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I'm super! Thanks for asking

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I'm super! Thanks for asking

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