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reenkam
07-10-2007, 09:55 AM
Which does everyone like better? Present Tense for First Person narrative or Past?

Nakhlasmoke
07-10-2007, 10:37 AM
Present in first is more immediate, and seems to work well. I generally use first/present and third/past.

Tracy
07-10-2007, 11:39 AM
Personally, as a reader I can't stand present tense. It just seems too artificial and jarring. When I read past tense, I imagine it as if it's happening now in my head, so that's fine. But when I read present tense, I want to argue. If I read, say, "I'm going down the road when I spot the dragon" - I'm thinking, No you're not, you're sitting writing what happened. Otherwise how could I be reading it? - and that makes me come out of the reading trance.
I absolutely will not read books in the present tense.

But that's just a personal opinion, albeit a strongly held one as you may have gathered.

JoNightshade
07-10-2007, 11:56 AM
Present tense. If it's past tense, I dunno, I always get the feeling it's a bit preachy. And that the narrator is holding back. I feel like "He knows the end of the story, but he's not telling me!" If it's in present tense, I feel like I am right with the character experiencing everything through his head as it happens. I don't feel at all like Tracy describes... if it's done well, I don't even feel like someone sat down and wrote it. I feel like it's happening.

Stijn Hommes
07-10-2007, 12:14 PM
I'm with Tracy. When someone tells you a story, they usually tell you what happened in the past. So if you read a book in present tense, the tense breaks the illusion that is happening.

Scribhneoir
07-10-2007, 12:31 PM
Count me among the present tense haters. I can't stand novels written in present tense. Sorry, but for me there's no sense of immediacy--instead I can never forget that I'm reading. I can't get lost in the story. As a consequence, I've never been able to finish a present tense novel, although if I grit my teeth I can manage to slog through a short story. If I'm reading a screenplay, present tense is no problem, but novels ... :Shrug: ... just can't do it.

Nakhlasmoke
07-10-2007, 12:35 PM
I'm with Tracy. When someone tells you a story, they usually tell you what happened in the past. So if you read a book in present tense, the tense breaks the illusion that is happening.

Hmm I find it works differently with oral story telling - there I'd agree that first person past is best. ("We went down to the old station and that's when the soldiers attacked etc" told to a audience.)

But a written story is a very different medium to traditional oral story-telling, at least as I see them. First person present only pulls me out if it's badly done.

gingerwoman
07-10-2007, 12:38 PM
Isn't present tense first person fairly rare? Margaret Atwood did it in Cat's Eye which is one of my favourite novels and I did it for an erotic short story but I think it's very rare.
In first person present tense you wouldn't say "I looked up at him" but "I look up at him." It would be hard to sustain that kind of writing through a whole novel without sounding artificial.

Nakhlasmoke
07-10-2007, 12:46 PM
Maybe I read too much Atwood. :P

EriRae
07-10-2007, 12:46 PM
That's funny...I always find it's easier to read first person in present. I read a book in third person present and had the issues above and I HATED it (The Rule of Four, I think it was), but first person present, I feel like I'm in the scene (eg. the Shopoholic series). First person past tense reminds me of a fairy tale, something that's trying to teach me a lesson. Not that lessons are bad things, but I have this idea of an alterior motive lurking with every "ed." I lose myself in first person present. I occasionally have a problem with the character doing something that I wouldn't do, but that happens no matter what the PoV.

Xx|e|ph|e|me|r|al|xX
07-10-2007, 12:58 PM
Xx|I'm with the present-hating folk. But I love first person. My entire novel is first person past tense. No one thus far has had trouble "getting lost in it". It managed to scare one girl, so much so that she stopped reading it (although she did come back later, I think). Thus, I think it works. *shrugs I shrugged* :tongue

In addition, all my favorite books have been, at least for the most part, in first-person-past-tense.|xX

seun
07-10-2007, 01:19 PM
This comes up again and again. I think the important issue is for everyone to remember this is all just personal taste. There are no hard rules for this which was the impression I got off a few people when I first came here. For me, I'm not sure why so many have a problem with 1st or Present. I've written in both and enjoy reading both. If it works for the story, then great, but it's not a rule that a book has to be a particular POV or tense.

kristie911
07-10-2007, 02:19 PM
If it's written well, present isn't so bad. Unfortunately, it's not always written well. I don't have any problems with first person at all.

Again, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. You need to go with what feels right for your story.

Shadow_Ferret
07-10-2007, 04:26 PM
I have only ever read one novel that was first person PRESENT tense and that's the one I'm reading, Thraxas by Martin Scott, and I find that I keep getting bumped out of the story by it, which is sad because it's a good read so far. I just find the present tense jarring.

Otherwise, every other book I've ever read that's been in first person was in past tense. I didn't even think people wrote in present tense. Past tense just seems more natural.

Spiny Norman
07-10-2007, 04:52 PM
You can do either, but present tense takes more effort, for sure. A lot of the present tense stuff I've seen and liked bordered on stream-of-consciousness stuff. That may be just personal bias, but as it's so immediate and is also confined to the main character's head, it challenges you to mix action and introspection all at once. Some of the most involving first person present tense I've read has been in graphic novels, but then they have the action all laid out for you so there's a clear division between character and action. Naturally, by my standards, it means that I find that in certain genres first person present tense doesn't come off so well...

Past tense works fine. It worked for Marlowe and Holden Caulfield. What more do you want?

Dawnstorm
07-10-2007, 04:53 PM
I have no preference. Usually, there's a reason for tense choice.

For example, Atwood's Cat's Eye worked with memories a lot, so it was easier to use the full variety of tenses. Remember that both present perfect and past tense turn into past perfect if the basic tense is past tense. By keeping to basic present tense, Atwood could manipulate temporal relations a lot better.

Present tense generally speaks straight to the imagination, so in stories that rely on images and setting descriptions a lot, present tense may also be preferred (example: William Gibson, Pattern Recognition. It's third person, though.)

Past tense is better for plot-centred stories, as you're not distracted by setting, images, etc. (I don't know many mysteries written in present tense, for example, though no doubt they exist.)

Choose the tense that's right for your story.

When someone tells you a story, they usually tell you what happened in the past.

Except when they lapse into the historical present (http://www.yourdictionary.com/ahd/h/h0219000.html). Some present tense stories could be seen as generalisations of that phenomenon (much the same way that literary past tense isn't the same as general past tense).

Spiny Norman
07-10-2007, 04:57 PM
My WIP is first person past tense, but when it comes to his memories I switch to present. The reason for this is that I want to give you the effect that the things in his past are, in their own way, still happening, as they certainly still control many events in the present and he still doesn't understand them.

I don't do it a lot, though, nor do I do it for extended passages. You can't push it that often.

Devil Ledbetter
07-10-2007, 05:57 PM
I can't stand reading present tense. For me, it's easy to write but hard to read. It annoys me.

maestrowork
07-10-2007, 06:01 PM
Bad writing annoys me. Tenses, by themselves, don't.

I do say first/present is harder to do well. I have read books that I wish they weren't written in 1st person; and I have read 1st-person books that are simply marvelous.

If you're not sure, and if you worry about if someone may not like your book because of the choice of tenses, choose past tense -- it's safe.

JoniBGoode
07-10-2007, 06:04 PM
I prefer to read the first person past tense over present tense, and I see more novels written that way.

However, there are times when using first person present makes sense. If you're writing a scene where the MC's life is in danger, the reader already knows that the MC survives, if the book is written in past tense. A book written in FP present leaves that in doubt (especially if the scene is near the end of the book.)

(Of course, if it's a series, the reader already knows that Kinsey Millhone or Stephanie Plum survives until the next novel.)

Spiny Norman
07-10-2007, 06:16 PM
John le Carre does some great alteration between present and past as well, though that's third person and is therefore probably easier to handle. I could easily see first person present coming off as terrible if mishandled - if it goes on too long or is paced poorly it can be exhausting to read. I find stuff like Pynchon exhausting already (well, who wouldn't?) and he uses third person present.

Jamesaritchie
07-10-2007, 07:27 PM
Which does everyone like better? Present Tense for First Person narrative or Past?

I detest 99% of the present tense I've read, and while there are always exceptions, it generally doesn't do very on the market at novel length. If the market is any indication, the great majority of readers prefer past tense fiction.

jordijoy
07-10-2007, 07:40 PM
I've writen in past and in present tense. Present tense works better for (me) if I'm trying to write a individuals story and tell what happened to her or him. It has a memoir vibe. Past tense, I use for adventure writing cause I feel it works better when telling about a whole host of things going on at once.

jordijoy
07-10-2007, 07:41 PM
I like writing in both past and present tense!! I can be drawn into any interesting story--I'm easy.

Sage
07-10-2007, 07:52 PM
Personally, I like past tense, & have trouble reading present (at least the last time I tried, I did). But write in whatever you like & works best for the story :)

reenkam
07-10-2007, 10:30 PM
Personally, as a reader I can't stand present tense. It just seems too artificial and jarring. When I read past tense, I imagine it as if it's happening now in my head, so that's fine. But when I read present tense, I want to argue. If I read, say, "I'm going down the road when I spot the dragon" - I'm thinking, No you're not, you're sitting writing what happened. Otherwise how could I be reading it? - and that makes me come out of the reading trance.
I absolutely will not read books in the present tense.

But that's just a personal opinion, albeit a strongly held one as you may have gathered.

I feel the same way, really. Almost every time I read first person present I notice every couple of paragraphs when they do something like you said (seeing a dragon). I'll still read them, but it's definitely annoying to me, most times...

Present tense. If it's past tense, I dunno, I always get the feeling it's a bit preachy. And that the narrator is holding back. I feel like "He knows the end of the story, but he's not telling me!" If it's in present tense, I feel like I am right with the character experiencing everything through his head as it happens. I don't feel at all like Tracy describes... if it's done well, I don't even feel like someone sat down and wrote it. I feel like it's happening.

This was the other problem...the whole time I'm writing I keep thinking "I know what's going to happen and so do the characters...so why does anyone care?" And I agree that it can feel like it's actually happening in the moment, but sometimes I wonder just where I am...in the person's head? Following them? It's slightly confusing...

I prefer to read the first person past tense over present tense, and I see more novels written that way.

However, there are times when using first person present makes sense. If you're writing a scene where the MC's life is in danger, the reader already knows that the MC survives, if the book is written in past tense. A book written in FP present leaves that in doubt (especially if the scene is near the end of the book.)

(Of course, if it's a series, the reader already knows that Kinsey Millhone or Stephanie Plum survives until the next novel.)

This is my main issue. There are lots of "life in danger" scenes and things like that, and it seems kind of obvious that the character will live when there's still have the book left. It became most obvious because I'm at the end of the book and it's the climax battle, I guess, but I just keep thinking "everyone's going to know who lives, won't they?" so I keep wanting to write certain paragraphs in present...obviously I can't do that.


All the opinions are great...I still have no idea which I'll do, though. I think I'm going to stick with past, just because there seem to be a lot of people who just won't read present, while no one said that about past, that I remember. Or maybe I'll trying rewriting a few chapters in present to see how it sounds...

FennelGiraffe
07-10-2007, 11:03 PM
Past tense is more conventional, thus less noticeable. Very few readers are going to wonder why you chose it, or be put off by it. Present tense calls more attention to itself, simply because it is less familiar. Some readers find it uncomfortable, for the same reason. I dislike reading it, myself, unless there is some explicit reason for it. (Such as epistolary novels.)

That said, if you have a compelling feeling that present tense is right for your story, go for it. It's certainly a valid choice.

Spiny Norman
07-10-2007, 11:41 PM
When used well, the first person present tense is exhilirating. It offers complete immersion in an experience. It shouldn't be used for simple blow-by-blow action, nor does it work very often in full novel length. However, I do admit that in the majority of novels it is not used very well.

Cassidy
07-11-2007, 12:47 AM
I like writing and reading good books, whether they are first or third person, past or present tense.

My first book comes out this fall and is first person, present tense (so you all won't read it... sniff) but most the ones I've written since are past tense, some first and some third. I write YA though and I think present tense may be more common in YA? Just an impression from my own reading.

What I find difficult is when I've just finished a novel or story in one tense and then start writing another in a different tense-- I keep messing up my tenses and having to go back and rewrite... Almost annoying enough to make me stick to one or the other... but not quite. I really do like both for different books and different reasons.

absitinvidia
07-11-2007, 12:54 AM
First-person present tense must be done very carefully, and it's extremely limiting. In a first-person past-tense novel, the narrator can draw on the experience of others (as told to him after the fact) to reach conclusions. In present tense, the narrator can present only what he sees and what his reactions are in the moment. Too often, I see writers cherry-picking details in present-tense narratives, presenting only what is important, and the problem is the narrator would not know at the time what was important and what wasn't.

Unless I respect the author's ability to write in the present tense without "cheating," I won't read a novel written in present tense.

Jamesaritchie
07-11-2007, 01:15 AM
I've writen in past and in present tense. Present tense works better for (me) if I'm trying to write a individuals story and tell what happened to her or him. It has a memoir vibe. Past tense, I use for adventure writing cause I feel it works better when telling about a whole host of things going on at once.

Have you ever read a memoir written in present tense?

Serenity
07-11-2007, 01:30 AM
I wasn't always a fan of first person, but after reading a few really good novels done that way, and an attempt at writing in first person myself, I'm okay with it now.

But personally? I hate reading in present tense. It just bugs me. First person/present tense, even more so. Past tense (to me) reads better.

maestrowork
07-11-2007, 01:40 AM
Have you ever read a memoir written in present tense?

Part of Angela's Ashes was written in present tense.

ChaosTitan
07-11-2007, 01:40 AM
Bad writing annoys me. Tenses, by themselves, don't.

Ditto.

If it's well-written, I don't care if it's first-person present, or third omniscient. I refuse to judge a book based solely on the use of "I am" over "I was."

Dave.C.Robinson
07-11-2007, 01:43 AM
I find that present is much harder both to write and to read, and generally avoid it. What I do find in first person is that there are more places when present can slip in. Admittedly that's normally as internal monologue and other character points, but I do find more of a mix of tenses in first person.

Thekherham
07-11-2007, 07:07 PM
I don't really care what viewpoint and what tense the book is written in, as long as it's good.
When you really think about it, writing in either first person present tense or first person past tense should not be such a good idea because where is the suspense regarding your character? When you write in third person you never know what happens to your character (maybe he'll get killed in the end?), but when you're writing in first person you know your character will be all right at the end of the novel (unless he turns into a ghost...)
Hmmm, I shouldn't talk, really. I'm working on a novel that is written in first person... present tense. I had started it in third person, but the MC was just screaming at me to change it to first person. As for the present tense... well, it just seemed right to me.

RainbowDragon
07-11-2007, 08:40 PM
If everything you write comes out it the present tense, you might want to consider crossing over into screenwriting, where there is no other tense :)

Spiny Norman
07-12-2007, 12:41 AM
Nevermind.

xanthalanari
07-12-2007, 02:04 AM
I was going to come down on the side of not liking it, but then I realised a fair chunk of one of my favourite books is written in first person present and I hadn't consciously noticed. It's Melusine by Sarah Monette, which splits between the first person viewpoints of Felix and Mildmay. Felix spends most of the book at varying levels of insanity, and when he's completely mad his passages are in the present tense. I think it actually works quite well, because it gets you right into what he's experiencing and creates a clear difference between the narrative voices of when he's sane and when he's not.

Normally I avoid first person and present tense for my own writing, but I wrote a story recently that was in both. I picked it because the viewpoint character is a teenager and I've noticed they talk more like that than adults do. It was an interesting change from what I usually do.