Brand name-dropping...

I hate brand-name dropping. Anywhere. I just do. There's enough of it on TV, I don't need it in my literature, thank you very much.

Also, connotations change over time. Right now if I say "a bottle of Chianti wine," which is not really even a brand name but whatever-- you are probably going to associate some pretty good things from that. The Chianti is now the most famous wine-growing region in Italy.

If I had said that 50 years ago, however, you'd be thinking about one of those big-bottomed bottles of cheap wine that people stick candles in the top of. Hmm, not quite the same...

I always thought you characterized someone as being snobbish by having them act snobbish...

I think if it's done because you can't describe the luxury of the clothes, bags, whatever any better...or do the same through their personality...then that's, well, a little lame.

But I don't think there's anything wrong with saying a character "grabbed a can of Coke."

My rule of thumb for brand names is that I only use them if I don't have to describe the item afterward (eg, I wouldn't use Pop Tart if I had to say "grabbed a Pop Tart toaster pastry") or if I couldn't achieve the same effect by using a generic word. (eg, "grabbed a can of cola." There's nothing wrong with that.)

My characters drink Coke and my girl has a Balenciaga bag. If people reading it know what Balenciagas are like, it'll tell them more about her character. If not, they're not suffering.

*zips up her Hollister Hoodie, hikes up her True Religions and storms out of the thread* ..and you can just barely make out the words "PINK" above the waist of her jeans as the door slams behind her.

Uh...what is a Balenciagas?

Zoombie said:

Uh...what is a Balenciagas?

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Loser

I think it depends on the story. I think it can help show something about a character, sometimes. Let's say you write something about a middel-class middle-aged woman who kills her husband to get his money and becomes shallow in the process leading to...oh, I dunno. Something eye opening. Halfway through the novel, mentioning that she got some Jimmy Choo's or Manolo's or maybe her LV luggage she had on the way to the airport could really show instead of tell. In my opinion, at least.

That being sad, I don't think random name dropping is worth it or necessary. If it's not saying someone about a character or the plot and just using the name for the name then it needs to be removed. If everyone in the story has all that stuff then I think there are definitely other ways that their apparent snottiness could be show.

Zoombie said:

Uh...what is a Balenciagas?

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*sigh*

http://models.com/oftheminute/images/HilaryBalenciaga_1_LowRes.jpg

See that purse?

Barbarique said:

Exactly, but how do you accomplish that? Very few people can realistically say "Nyah, nyah, I won the Nobel Prize and you didn't."

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"Uh," Tam said, her eyes darting hopefully between Sybil and Max. "C-Can I sit here?"

"No, I'm afraid that this table is for people with some class, Tam, my dear." Sybil smiled sweetly. "But there is a seat in the kiddy corner."

Wait, that's just mean. Nevermind.

WackAMole said:

Loser

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Soooooooy, un perdedor. I'm a loser baby. So why don't you kill me?

I think it depends. There are types of books (chick lit comes to mind) where a good bit of name-dropping probably works: If your MC is very style-conscious, then it makes sense for her to wear/name/notice couture brands. On the other hand, if the brand-naming is being used as lazy shorthand, is too of-the-moment to age well and/or doesn't make sense for the characters and their setting, I'd say work around it.

(Within reason. For instance, in Evernight, I have the narrator say that she and her boyfriend got a pizza and a couple of Cokes, which IMHO feels more natural than "a couple of cola beverages" or the like.)

Yeah. I think the key is to decide whether you're using brand names because that's the best image, or out of laziness.

I noticed that, actually. Skinny girls upset me.

There are places that it just sounds correct to have a brand name, Coke was one that was mentioned or Kleenex, I'm not going to say, "She grabbed a facial tissue and blew her nose" or Jello. But I've seen a lot of novels where it's overboard.

Like anything else, there's a fine line between okay and overdoing it.

I don't understand when people use Kleenex. Why not just tissue?

It's about verisimilitude. Saying the character is drinking a Coke adds more realism than saying the character is drinking a soda.

Too much of anything is just bad writing, whether it's product placement or swearing or dialogue tags.

Shady Lane said:

I don't understand when people use Kleenex. Why not just tissue?

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I thought the same thing! I never understood that either but I figured that was becuase I'm half-assed foreign.

Some brand names I think are fine like coke is a good one becuase everyone knows coke. I think others are pretensious and date the book. Like Dolce and Gabanna or some such. I think that you can describe a class of clothes without dropping a name brand.

I usually try to avoid brand names but the occasional "coke" or "pepsi" or "xerox" or "jello" may creep in by accident. Also in my comic strip "apple" and "microsoft" do pop up from time to time.

As to the tissue reference, I've been in Costa Rica and asked for a tissue and they looked at me funny, but when I said kleenex they knew what I meant. (Now that is brand name recognition!)

THIS POST WRITTEN ON A APPLE MAC, THE BESTEST COMPUTER AROUND WHILE DRINKING A REFRESHING PEPSI AND CLEANING THE SCREEN WITH AN EXTRA SOFT KLEENEX.

It can also be used ironically...

"I f#c%!n hate all those hipsters," he mumbled, crushing out the butt of a Parliament with the heel of his Chuck Taylors as he adjusted his Jon Deere cap. "Let's go grab some Pabst and read the new Vice."

But, in order to get that joke, you would already have to know that hipsters like to smoke Parliament cigarettes and wear Converse All-Stars and trucker hats. So, I think a lot of it depends on your audience. And I think I'm probably about 6 years out of date with my hipster references.

It can also be used satirically. For instance, in American Psycho Bret Easton Ellis went to great lengths to describe his characters' posessions and wardrobe. Part of it was to indicate the character's mind set (the 1st person narrator was concerned with labels, etc) but part of it was a joke.

From an interview: " Also, what a lot of people don't realize, and what I had a lot of fun with, is that if you really saw the outfits Patrick Bateman describes, they'd look totally ridiculous. He would describe a certain kind of vest with a pair of pants and certain kind of shirt, and you think, He really must know so much, but if you actually saw people dressed like this, they would look like clowns. It was a subtle joke. If you read it on a surface level and know nothing about clothes, you read American Psycho and think, My God, we're in some sort of princely kingdom where everyone just walked out of GQ. No. They look like fools. They look like court jesters, most of them."

Me? Coming from a cyberpunk school (okay, I made that up...I just like cyberpunk) I drop brand names like it was my job... sort of like some brand-name-dropping guy...

But then again I'm not published.

It's about detail and realism. Like the movies, if you put some generic things on screen it loses something. But if you see a MacBook or a Coke or a Ford or something, it feels real. Same with books... if you just say "he drank some soda and ate at a fast food restaurant" it feels vague and lackluster.

I try not to use brand names, or I butcher them so badly in my stories to make them jokes. Alternatively, it can be used to set up for a joke.

For example, in one of my WIPs, the character has a Glad Forceflex trash bag and pulls it over an assailant, then comments, "Wow, they really can withstand near anything." It'd make sense for those who see those commercials where someone uses those brand trash bags to hold elephants or some other ridiculous thing. Why should an eldritch knight be any different?

Shady Lane said:

*sigh*

http://models.com/oftheminute/images/HilaryBalenciaga_1_LowRes.jpg

See that purse?

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Someone ought to tell the designer that models ought not carry accessories which outweigh them.

Now, back OT:

I have a simple rule that works for me: if I have to work to describe something while using a brand name, I ought to drop the brand. Of the two:

"She was wearing low-slung jeans that barely touched the top of her gold-sequined Jimmy Choo's."

"She was wearing low-slung jeans that barely touched the top of her shiny, bold-heeled shoes."

I'd use the second because the brand seems like extra, meaningless info.

But that's me.

Did I ever tell you my Reebock story? No, wait a minute, I'll break it down for you: Fu.. Reebock!
And I'm not getting any love from that Energizer bunny either.

Also depends on the genre and character. If I'm 1st person and I have a womanizing male P.I. with a taste for women with taste, I might toss in some designers and pay attention to descriptions.

If I'm writing 3rd person about a schlub with no time for fashion, I certainly wouldn't.

--fje