Anybody realize their sequel may actually be their beginning?

SinkFulloDishes · Jun 4, 2007

Has anyone else ever felt like maybe your sequel is actually your starting point? I love the premise of my first novel, but honestly, I like the sequel much better as far as pacing, focus, and conflict. Can I dilute and distribute a novel's worth of backstory into the sequel without making the reader feel like they got to the party late and missed out on something?

This is a YA story where most of the story consists of similarly-themed sub plots, and the main conflict kind of pops up unexpectedly at the end. The sequel focuses on how that conflict has changed the MC's life, and how she works to find herself again.

JoNightshade · Jun 4, 2007

George Lucas realized this once upon a time, but unfortunately he got older and forgot.

glassquill · Jun 4, 2007

JoNightshade said:
George Lucas realized this once upon a time, but unfortunately he got older and forgot.

I agree with you. *cringes at the memory* Just goes to show that if it isn't broken, don't try and fix it. :tongue

FloVoyager · Jun 4, 2007

JoNightshade said:
George Lucas realized this once upon a time, but unfortunately he got older and forgot.

Not that it seems to have hurt him much.

Sounds like a good idea, Sink. I just ditched the first few chapters of my WIP after realizing nothing happens in them. The book now starts with action.

glassquill · Jun 4, 2007

SinkFulloDishes said:
I love the premise of my first novel, but honestly, I like the sequel much better as far as pacing, focus, and conflict.

Could it be that you have improved and grown in your writing?

I personally think my earlier writings were as appealing as the sound of nails on a chalkboard. When I look at them, I think 'What on earth was I eating then?' :tongue

SinkFulloDishes · Jun 4, 2007

glassquill said:
Could it be that you have improved and grown in your writing?

I personally think my earlier writings were as appealing as the sound of nails on a chalkboard. When I look at them, I think 'What on earth was I eating then?'

I definitely think that's a big part of it. A year after writing the first one, I went back and did a tremendous re-write. The first chapter was tossed, I cut about 1/3 of the story out, and I altered and newly wrote quite a few scenes. It's much better, but I still have this nagging feeling that either I'm starting in the wrong place, or I've left too much extraneous junk in the middle and the story needs to encompass at least part of what's in the sequel.

Thanks for the input!

glassquill · Jun 4, 2007

SinkFulloDishes said:
I definitely think that's a big part of it. A year after writing the first one, I went back and did a tremendous re-write. The first chapter was tossed, I cut about 1/3 of the story out, and I altered and newly wrote quite a few scenes. It's much better, but I still have this nagging feeling that either I'm starting in the wrong place, or I've left too much extraneous junk in the middle and the story needs to encompass at least part of what's in the sequel.

Thanks for the input!

Before I forget, :welcome:

to AW!

alaskamatt17 · Jun 4, 2007

Oh yeah, my first book was wasted megabytes. I realized I had basically written 300 pages of lead-up to a sequel, but by the time I finished I was so disgusted that I decided not to write the book that I should have been writing in the first place.

But that was just me, and if you feel you've got a "sequel" to write as a standalone you should probably follow that instinct.

louisgodwin · Jun 4, 2007

Yep. Many, many years ago I started wring a novel. I got 12 pages into it and realized it was part 3 of a trilogy. Been there.

ChaosTitan · Jun 5, 2007

SinkFulloDishes said:
I love the premise of my first novel, but honestly, I like the sequel much better as far as pacing, focus, and conflict.

Don't discount the notion that you like book two better simply because it is better. We all learn with our first novels, and invariably the second novel is better. Better pacing, better focus, and better conflict.

That's why it's rarely advisable that new writers begin with a series of books. Book one is often (but not always, there are exceptions) practice. Hell, sometimes books two, three, four, and five are practice.

jodiodi · Jun 5, 2007

Oh yes, I know the feeling. The problem is, my heroine needs book 1 to make the sequel make sense. Hence, I must rewrite everything.

Lady Esther · Jun 5, 2007

My sequel is about the parents of the MC in my first WIP. So, yes, my sequel is kind of the beginning of the first book.

Shady Lane · Jun 5, 2007

That's why it's rarely advisable that new writers begin with a series of books.

I don't think this is said enough.

althrasher · Jun 5, 2007

I did feel like that at first, but then I took a lot more time to really go back over book 1 and figure out what I didn't like about it. Was it too rushed? Did I not go into the characters enough? Was the action too predictable? Once I figured out what I didn't like about it, I was able to do a whole lot more with it and the result is a MUCH better book than I thought I had to start with. In my opinon, if your characters are strong enough to have a series/sequel based on them, they're strong enough to have a good opening novel. We just have to find it.

ccarver30 · Jun 5, 2007

Hmm, sort of. I have realized how much BETTER my second novel is going than my first. I hate the beginning of my first novel and love my second. I am going to chalk it up to experience instead of sucky writing.

SinkFulloDishes · Jun 5, 2007

chaostitan said:
Don't discount the notion that you like book two better simply because it is better. We all learn with our first novels, and invariably the second novel is better. Better pacing, better focus, and better conflict.

That's why it's rarely advisable that new writers begin with a series of books. Book one is often (but not always, there are exceptions) practice. Hell, sometimes books two, three, four, and five are practice.

I'm positive my writing is better now than it was then. The first book is a stand-alone novel, though. I wrote it to end exactly where it does, and didn't intend on writing a sequel. When I got to the end of it, though, it made sense to move on and explore how the MC's life would change. I guess what I'm trying to figure out is whether the first one is necessary, or if the most interesting part of the story begins where that novel ends.

althrasher - I did this once, and have recently gone back to put some more work into it because I was so much happier with the second version. I'm hoping that one more virtual-knife-weilding run-through will do it

, because I do want this novel to work. Not because it's my first (I've already got another one finished and two more in progress, all unrelated), but because I really think it's something I would pick up and buy if it were done well. I would hate to write it off, so to speak, just because it's my first novel.

Heheh, I think I just answered my own question.

althrasher · Jun 5, 2007

SinkFulloDishes said:
althrasher - I did this once, and have recently gone back to put some more work into it because I was so much happier with the second version. I'm hoping that one more virtual-knife-weilding run-through will do it , because I do want this novel to work. Not because it's my first (I've already got another one finished and two more in progress, all unrelated), but because I really think it's something I would pick up and buy if it were done well. I would hate to write it off, so to speak, just because it's my first novel.

Heheh, I think I just answered my own question.

Dangit, I just read back over my post and it sounds so freaking arrogant. My apologies, that wasn't my intention. I just wanted to let you know that I've been there, definetely, and that's something that helped me. Like I said, though, if you've got strong characters and a whole other plot already worked out, I'm sure it'll work. Good luck!!!

SinkFulloDishes · Jun 5, 2007

althrasher said:
Dangit, I just read back over my post and it sounds so freaking arrogant. My apologies, that wasn't my intention. I just wanted to let you know that I've been there, definetely, and that's something that helped me. Like I said, though, if you've got strong characters and a whole other plot already worked out, I'm sure it'll work. Good luck!!!

No, I didn't take it as arrogant at all! In fact, I understood exactly what you were saying because it was something I had also done, but that maybe needs to be done one more time. You hear so much that the first novel should be set aside and forgotten once you learn how to write better, but I'm not sure I want to do that with this particular story. So it's good to hear that somebody has something positive to say about revising/rewriting.

Thanks for the comments!

althrasher · Jun 5, 2007

SinkFulloDishes said:
No, I didn't take it as arrogant at all! In fact, I understood exactly what you were saying because it was something I had also done, but that maybe needs to be done one more time. You hear so much that the first novel should be set aside and forgotten once you learn how to write better, but I'm not sure I want to do that with this particular story. So it's good to hear that somebody has something positive to say about revising/rewriting.

I've never heard that you should dump your first novel, but I haven't been here that long...I mean, I'd hate to just cast aside my first novel simply becuase it is my first. I mean, I guess it's not my first if you count that really horrible murder mystery book I wrote in middle school...but we won't think about that.

ChaosTitan · Jun 5, 2007

althrasher said:
I've never heard that you should dump your first novel, but I haven't been here that long...I mean, I'd hate to just cast aside my first novel simply becuase it is my first.

I can see how some of the advice on this board re: first novels can seem disheartening, but no one advocates tossing aside a first novel for the sake of tossing it aside.

Some writers will debut with their first novel. Some writers will put that first novel away, debut with a different one, and never pull that first attempt out of a drawer. Some writers will publish their first novel as their third or fourth.

If you feel strongly about a novel, keep at it. Don't, however, plug away at one project for five years at the expense of writing another. And another. And another. One of those "another's" may be the novel that is your published debut. You just never know.

I still love my first written novel. I adore the MC, and the setting, and the supporting cast. It's very close to my heart, but it isn't a debut novel. Will I ever have one? I hope so, but it won't be my first. Or my second/third/fourth. The novel that's getting some attention with agents right now is my fifth.

althrasher · Jun 5, 2007

I don't know, I guess I feel like I have a lot more experience than I actually do, does that make sense? I mean, I've been writing for as long as I've been reading, (seriously,) and I don't feel like I'm dreadfully, woefully inexperienced. May be way off-base, but there you are. Maybe I shouldn't even post this, it doesn't make sense. I think my first novel is strong enough to be a debut (I don't see myself writing anything stronger...) but I guess I'll just see how things go.

ChaosTitan · Jun 5, 2007

althrasher said:
I don't know, I guess I feel like I have a lot more experience than I actually do, does that make sense? I mean, I've been writing for as long as I've been reading, (seriously,) and I don't feel like I'm dreadfully, woefully inexperienced. May be way off-base, but there you are. Maybe I shouldn't even post this, it doesn't make sense. I think my first novel is strong enough to be a debut (I don't see myself writing anything stronger...) but I guess I'll just see how things go.

Your post does make sense, and I should have clarified that my own post was directed at a general "you," and not completely at you, althrasher.

Your writing may be strong enough to debut your first novel. I don't know. I can't judge your writing, because I've never read it. I hope that you are correct in your self-assessment.

But I'm a little worried by this:

(I don't see myself writing anything stronger...)

If you've already written your strongest, best work, then what's left? A career that's on par, but never gets any better? Like anything else, writing is a skill that needs to be constantly developed. I strive to make each work better than the last (whether or not I succeed is a different story, but the attempt is always there). I would hate to think that I'll never get any better.

glutton · Jun 6, 2007

Sorta.

I realized my prequel was my beginning...

Stormhawk · Jun 6, 2007

I want to damn the opening poster to a hell full of cookies.

This thread has been haunting me since I read it.

I now think that's a good thing. I've recently unclogged my writer's block and have been working on a project I long since thought I'd never finish. (All it took was a changing of genres and a world-building project that's been going on since NaNo last year).

I finally like this story again. However, I like the outline of one of the following stories a lot better - it's got a lot more heart (*snickers at inside joke*).

It's going to take some work, but in the end, I think it's going to be better. So thank you, OP, and may your sink never be empty.

dclary · Jun 6, 2007

I think it was Ben Bova, but one of the editors at Analog once wrote "If you ever get to a point in your story where you say to yourself "Here's where it really gets good" -- dump everything that happened before that and start from there."

Anybody realize their sequel may actually be their beginning?

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