I seriously am terrible and some of the longer action scenes. I am currently editing my novel for the third time after having finally completed it, but there are these few parts where I just feel are tedious and can barely read a page an hour. I was completely gripped for the first 90 pages, but when I reached page 91, I just started losing interest. It introduces a chain of battle sequences that are essential to the story, but I just felt isolated from the story. It may just be something I in particular take no interest in as I've had the urge to skip past many useless pages in other books, but do you have any suggestions on how to make a fight scene interesting?
How to make Fight Scenes more interesting
- Thread starter Veniar
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Perhaps you could post some of the fighting sequence?
Easier to come with suggestions for improvement that way.
Easier to come with suggestions for improvement that way.
My favorite technique: have the heroine get impaled, vomit up a litre of blood, and keep fighting.
Now (more seriously), if your heroine isn't the type who can reasonably do that:
Are the fight scenes you are talking about mass battles? In my experience, these are the ones that tend to be more boring to read - and write, too, if you're doing it a certain way. If they are, I would suggest staying in the viewpoint of an important character who the reader would care about, rather than showing the battle from a distance in an attempt to give the most "complete" overview of the battle (ie. the boring way). That way, your reader should stay interested in the fate of character, and thus the scene as a whole. There's no need to show everything that happens in the larger battle, you can just briefly mention whatever happened that the POV character didn't see when it's over.
Or I am completely off the mark and that isn't your problem at all?
Now (more seriously), if your heroine isn't the type who can reasonably do that:
Are the fight scenes you are talking about mass battles? In my experience, these are the ones that tend to be more boring to read - and write, too, if you're doing it a certain way. If they are, I would suggest staying in the viewpoint of an important character who the reader would care about, rather than showing the battle from a distance in an attempt to give the most "complete" overview of the battle (ie. the boring way). That way, your reader should stay interested in the fate of character, and thus the scene as a whole. There's no need to show everything that happens in the larger battle, you can just briefly mention whatever happened that the POV character didn't see when it's over.
Or I am completely off the mark and that isn't your problem at all?
I hate writing one on one fight scenes. I think I stink and they come off as fake. But if you write fantasy, you can't escape it. For large battles, I concentrate on one or two characters.
Read Robert E. Howard. The man wrote some of the finest fight scenes I've ever come across. Del Rey has been releasing collections of his stories; I'd stick to either one -- or all -- of the three Conan volumes (forget the Arnold movie when you read these) or the one collecting the stories about Bran Mak Morn. If it's a mass battle you're writing, then take a couple days to read Steven Pressfield's Gates of Fire. He recounts the last stand of the Spartans and their allies at Thermopylae in epic and gory style. Absolutely worthwhile if your characters have martial leanings 
Hope this helps!
Scott
Hope this helps!
Scott
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Veniar -
Find a way to write the fight scenes that keeps YOUR interest. Somewhere on these boards it says if you're bored your readers will be too. It's true!
Find a way to write the fight scenes that keeps YOUR interest. Somewhere on these boards it says if you're bored your readers will be too. It's true!
Write them like any other scene; a dialogue of actions resolved in a satisfying but not quite expected manner, with implications.
The snag is, you need to know a world before you can play with it. Failing that, steal some real battles or single combats.
The snag is, you need to know a world before you can play with it. Failing that, steal some real battles or single combats.
Well as someone who's seen a few brawls, I can say that most fight scenes strike me as inherently false. In a real fight, a real fight between two people totally bent on killing/seriously messing each other up, here are five things I'd keep an eye on:
1. It's short. Really short. I don't know if your characters are magically enhanced or super cyborgs or whatever, but if they are basically "human" then no fight is going to last for longer than a few minutes straight. People don't wage epic battle for hours, they trade some blows until one of them manages to smash a bottle on the other's head or somebody gets an arm broken or something.
2. It's scary. No matter how badass you are, if you're in an honest to god fight you're going to be freaked out about getting your eyes gouged out or your fingers broken or something (particularly if you've already tried doing that against the other guy and it didn't work). Of course, adrenaline and anger and booze can override this, but even the bravest soldiers get the shakes before and after battle.
3. People are fragile. If you get stabbed or shot or whatever (and thankfully I haven't seen this one), then it's pretty much game over for you. Here's a joke: "Who is the winner of a knife fight? The guy who dies three days later." That about sums it up. Even getting whacked upside the head with a metal pipe can be fatal.
4. Even winning can do your head in. Particularly if you're inexperienced (like, say, farmhand turned Knight of the Realm or Jedi or whatever). Beating the dickens out of a guy can realy rattle your cage when you think back on it. I've seen guys "come to" hours later and be utterly horrified at how badly they hurt somebody. The same goes even more for killing, and if you're killing somebody with a medieval weapon like a sword or mace then I imagine it's even more visceral and awful.
5. This is most important: PEOPLE DON'T TALK TO EACH OTHER WHILST TRYING TO KILL ONE ANOTHER. "Intense gunfight" is not "funny joke time," nor is "brutal kung fu melee." Shut up and get to work, stop taunting and bantering.
So there you go. On the rare occasions when I find myself writing fight scenes those are five things I like to remember. Not exactly swash-buckly, but it helps make it more real and thus more exciting.
1. It's short. Really short. I don't know if your characters are magically enhanced or super cyborgs or whatever, but if they are basically "human" then no fight is going to last for longer than a few minutes straight. People don't wage epic battle for hours, they trade some blows until one of them manages to smash a bottle on the other's head or somebody gets an arm broken or something.
2. It's scary. No matter how badass you are, if you're in an honest to god fight you're going to be freaked out about getting your eyes gouged out or your fingers broken or something (particularly if you've already tried doing that against the other guy and it didn't work). Of course, adrenaline and anger and booze can override this, but even the bravest soldiers get the shakes before and after battle.
3. People are fragile. If you get stabbed or shot or whatever (and thankfully I haven't seen this one), then it's pretty much game over for you. Here's a joke: "Who is the winner of a knife fight? The guy who dies three days later." That about sums it up. Even getting whacked upside the head with a metal pipe can be fatal.
4. Even winning can do your head in. Particularly if you're inexperienced (like, say, farmhand turned Knight of the Realm or Jedi or whatever). Beating the dickens out of a guy can realy rattle your cage when you think back on it. I've seen guys "come to" hours later and be utterly horrified at how badly they hurt somebody. The same goes even more for killing, and if you're killing somebody with a medieval weapon like a sword or mace then I imagine it's even more visceral and awful.
5. This is most important: PEOPLE DON'T TALK TO EACH OTHER WHILST TRYING TO KILL ONE ANOTHER. "Intense gunfight" is not "funny joke time," nor is "brutal kung fu melee." Shut up and get to work, stop taunting and bantering.
So there you go. On the rare occasions when I find myself writing fight scenes those are five things I like to remember. Not exactly swash-buckly, but it helps make it more real and thus more exciting.
Most of that only applies if you're not going for unrealistic, over-the-top epicness. Which, I must admit, I usually go for.
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not to be argumentative (what? who, moi?), but i've known a guy who got stabbed, ran after the guy and, well, did him no favours. i've also known a guy to be hit on top of the head with a piece of bundled cable and not find it the least bit amusing. granted, these are exceptions, but it's possible.
i'd add that kicks to the crotch doesn't instantly bring a guy down (not that i remember, anyway). it takes a moment or two: you swallow your balls and that's when the inconvenient ache sets in, and by 'inconvenient ache' i mean dehibilitating agony along the lines of 'oh, god, kill me now and spare me this torture!'
as mentioned, you *will* get cut in a knife fight. accept it before getting in one. (well, that's what the book said, at least.)
most people aren't in as good shape as they think they are. i know that after a slight workout my eyes are ready to shoot from my sockets.
all it takes is one good punch to not want any more/be unable to respond. so don't take that high road and wait for the attack: if you're in a fight, get the first punch in.
you are not the ultimate fighting champion. avoid fighting if you can. hang out in a bar long enough and you'll find plenty of amusement in the form of fisticuffs eventually. honestly, a lot of these guys i think get in fights to impress idiot girlfriends with the idea that they'll be broken up (the fight, not the couple, because most habitual bar brawlers don't have that much good sense) before gawdawful damage happens. then again, like i said, one good punch... a guy i know once punched an idiot square in the face, sending him into emergency reconstructive surgery. one punch. (later that night, my buddy's house was broken into and ransacked, his cousin visiting the place was beaten up.)
i'd add that kicks to the crotch doesn't instantly bring a guy down (not that i remember, anyway). it takes a moment or two: you swallow your balls and that's when the inconvenient ache sets in, and by 'inconvenient ache' i mean dehibilitating agony along the lines of 'oh, god, kill me now and spare me this torture!'
as mentioned, you *will* get cut in a knife fight. accept it before getting in one. (well, that's what the book said, at least.)
most people aren't in as good shape as they think they are. i know that after a slight workout my eyes are ready to shoot from my sockets.
all it takes is one good punch to not want any more/be unable to respond. so don't take that high road and wait for the attack: if you're in a fight, get the first punch in.
you are not the ultimate fighting champion. avoid fighting if you can. hang out in a bar long enough and you'll find plenty of amusement in the form of fisticuffs eventually. honestly, a lot of these guys i think get in fights to impress idiot girlfriends with the idea that they'll be broken up (the fight, not the couple, because most habitual bar brawlers don't have that much good sense) before gawdawful damage happens. then again, like i said, one good punch... a guy i know once punched an idiot square in the face, sending him into emergency reconstructive surgery. one punch. (later that night, my buddy's house was broken into and ransacked, his cousin visiting the place was beaten up.)
I love both reading and writing fight scenes. They're my absolute favorite to write. That said, my books have less battle sequences than most fantasy. This adds more interest and intensity when the fights finally take place.
Fights aren't necessarily short, not if those involved are elite fighters and evenly matched. (Yes, fights between normal people are short, but we're writing fantasy so I assume most of us have some characters we wouldn't describe as normal everyday people). I don't have any epic battle scenes involving large numbers of people, mainly because it wouldn't fit my plot, but also because those tend to get boring pretty quickly. All my scenes are either one-on-one or small groups. I think my longest fight sequence lasts about fifteen minutes real time (my 'final battle' at the end of the last book). This is one elite warrior fighting another with equal training. Most of the fights are more like five minutes, because one person has more of an advantage.
Fight scenes should be fast paced, minimal thoughts and dialogue (you really aren't going to have time to think or talk during a life-or-death battle).
Make sure you bring in potent sensual description. (And remember blood actually sprays into the air when important parts are severed). Describe the smells, tastes, sensations, as well as the actions.
The real key to making fights interesting is to have the reader already care deeply about what happens to those participating. Otherwise, all you have is senseless violence, and that just gets boring.
Not sure if any of that helps. All just my opinion, of course, which has been known to be wrong.
Fights aren't necessarily short, not if those involved are elite fighters and evenly matched. (Yes, fights between normal people are short, but we're writing fantasy so I assume most of us have some characters we wouldn't describe as normal everyday people). I don't have any epic battle scenes involving large numbers of people, mainly because it wouldn't fit my plot, but also because those tend to get boring pretty quickly. All my scenes are either one-on-one or small groups. I think my longest fight sequence lasts about fifteen minutes real time (my 'final battle' at the end of the last book). This is one elite warrior fighting another with equal training. Most of the fights are more like five minutes, because one person has more of an advantage.
Fight scenes should be fast paced, minimal thoughts and dialogue (you really aren't going to have time to think or talk during a life-or-death battle).
Make sure you bring in potent sensual description. (And remember blood actually sprays into the air when important parts are severed). Describe the smells, tastes, sensations, as well as the actions.
The real key to making fights interesting is to have the reader already care deeply about what happens to those participating. Otherwise, all you have is senseless violence, and that just gets boring.
Not sure if any of that helps. All just my opinion, of course, which has been known to be wrong.
Highly highly highly highly highly debateable (and what does "evenly matched" or "equal training" even mean?). Did you know that the reason they don't televise Olympic Fencing is because it's over too quickly to see? Do you know how brief championship matches at kenpo tournaments can be?
But for dramatic purposes you are, of course, completely right. "Realistic" doesn't always mean "entertaining."
Stephen King describes action (which would include fight scenes) better than most. One of his relied-upon techniques is to slow action scenes way down by using a lot of words to describe intense action while using a minimal number of words to describe long, drawn-out periods of nonaction. This unusual contrast has the effect of making the reader pay supreme attention to the action, thereby making it feel more real.
I'm still trying to think of a way to turn the 300 "Slow then fast then slow then fast then slow then fast..." method of action into a book. Cause in 300, they'd swing a sword fast, then show the gory detail slow, then swing fast and so on.
I thought it was imensly cool, but have settled for lots of clipped sentences, like gun shots (I know it's weird, but that's how I think of them), and isolate important events with paragraph breaks.
Example:
Bang bang bang bang bang bang
The MC is shot
Bang bang bang bang bang bang.
Another thing I do is imagine it as I write it. That always makes for exciting writing.
If your imagination isn't good enough to picture the fight scene while it's being written...then what are you doing being a fiction writer?
I thought it was imensly cool, but have settled for lots of clipped sentences, like gun shots (I know it's weird, but that's how I think of them), and isolate important events with paragraph breaks.
Example:
Bang bang bang bang bang bang
The MC is shot
Bang bang bang bang bang bang.
Another thing I do is imagine it as I write it. That always makes for exciting writing.
If your imagination isn't good enough to picture the fight scene while it's being written...then what are you doing being a fiction writer?
Ha! Brilliant!
Come on people now, smile on your brother, everybody get together, try to love one another right now.
Well said, with the riders
1. It's short.
Yes. Except, judging from histroical examples, battles between armoured knights (or equiv) can be drawn out.
4. Even winning can do your head in.
Yes. Except most violent or martial societies have/had ways of dealing with this through religion or ritual. Also, distance, whether physical, social or psychological seems to make killing easier.
The best thing is to make sure you aren't simply trying to describe the action. The fight itself is not as important as what's at stake and who is in danger. If you make it look like beloved characters are going to die, the fight immediately becomes more interesting.
Make sentences short. Introduce fragments. Unless it's a duel ... then you can drag things out a little longer because there's only two combatants and each one will be paying attention to everything the other is doing.
Don't fall into the trap of blow-by-blow narration. This quickly becomes dull.
Murgar swung his sword and the dark wizard countered with a spell. Murgar swung again. And again. Hey, guess what? There's a lot of sword swinging when somebody fights with, well, a sword.
It's boring.
I
I'd put fight scenes in the same category as sex scenes: descriptions are good only insofar as they advance the story and serve to illuminate character. I have trouble following most extended fight scenes, or caring about kewl maneuvers.
What I notice about writers I love when they're describing action and battles is that it's foggy and disjointed and confusing and all of a sudden it's over. That feels real.
Check out how Patrick O'Brian, for example, handles battles in his Aubrey/Maturin series. They're mostly sea battles, and they begin with a chess game of maneuvering to get the advantage of wind that can go on for many pages (while other things happen, of course). Then the ships get close and the firing begins. If there's a boarding it's quick, confused action with a few horrific details, and then the stunned aftermath. There's no level of detail on the order of "Ducking to his left, he flinched as the French captain's cutlass flashed past his ear," etc., etc. I think this gives a feeling of verisimilitude—what's told is essentially what someone in the battle would be able to piece together later. Not much more than a few vivid essentials.
What I notice about writers I love when they're describing action and battles is that it's foggy and disjointed and confusing and all of a sudden it's over. That feels real.
Check out how Patrick O'Brian, for example, handles battles in his Aubrey/Maturin series. They're mostly sea battles, and they begin with a chess game of maneuvering to get the advantage of wind that can go on for many pages (while other things happen, of course). Then the ships get close and the firing begins. If there's a boarding it's quick, confused action with a few horrific details, and then the stunned aftermath. There's no level of detail on the order of "Ducking to his left, he flinched as the French captain's cutlass flashed past his ear," etc., etc. I think this gives a feeling of verisimilitude—what's told is essentially what someone in the battle would be able to piece together later. Not much more than a few vivid essentials.
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