Reviewing Scripts on Zoetrope

That doesn't surprise me, tho' you could as easily have been assigned 4 readable scripts (or any variation thereof), it's blind luck really, and same goes for Triggerstreet.

Feedback-wise I'm afraid it's blind luck too, you can get great helpful comments or snotty unhelpful comments, just like any other peer feedback site. If there's any kind of ratings system involved then assume that a percentage of readers will want their scripts to score higher than yours.

If the 4 scripts have big flaws doesn't that make writing critiques easier?

-Derek

dpaterso said:

That doesn't surprise me, tho' you could as easily have been assigned 4 readable scripts (or any variation thereof), it's blind luck really, and same goes for Triggerstreet.

Feedback-wise I'm afraid it's blind luck too, you can get great helpful comments or snotty unhelpful comments, just like any other peer feedback site. If there's any kind of ratings system involved then assume that a percentage of readers will want their scripts to score higher than yours.

If the 4 scripts have big flaws doesn't that make writing critiques easier?

-Derek

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No. If a script has an obvious flaw then it's easy to point out. The tricky thing is how to correct it and make it into a great movie. Some people get paid US$250,000 per week to do just this.

I see your point H, but still feel that's a non sequitur.

-Derek

dpaterso said:

I see your point H, but still feel that's a non sequitur.

-Derek

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You're right. I think I was trying (badly) to suggest to OP that it's good practice to work out how you would re-order someone else's screenplay to make it rock, then apply that to your own work. I'm finding that the more objective I become about my own work, the better the feedback I seem to get on it.

The REAL problem

with peer review sites is that (in my experience) the majority of novice writers are NOT interested in serious reviews of thier work. They don't REALLY want to change anything. And certainly not a major flaw that would require a ton of new work not to mention a totally different understanding of the craft in order to fix.

They want to hear "You've got some spelling errors and I thought the action was a little weak and the dialog a bit on the nose" instead of "Your story doesn't actually get started until page 24 when he steals the diamond and then on page 66 the sidekick became the protag and you pretty much started a whole new story, and well, I hate to say it but that just won't work."

So YOU end up getting all kinds of nasty e-mails saying how cruel you were and how you just can't see the brilliance in the writing, etc etc etc.
It can be pretty ........... tiresome.

On the flip side, reading these scripts will help find flaws and then give you practice correcting them. The truly enlightening thing is to honestly worth through YOUR script and look for similar mistakes.
It's usually easier to find the mistakes in other people's work but then once you see them you can become aware of them in yours.

Also, you may find the rare gem that is well done and it can serve as an example to you. Or you may find some very creative ideas, characters, lines, or situations that can be altered to fit your story.

Just take things in stride and don't let anything work you up.

I pretty much agree with the above.

My experience with critting is that it's a massive ball-ache insofar as giving the writer what they want. On rare occasions you do get "That's EXACTLY what I was looking for!" but like I said. Rare.

I always preface my crits with a disclaimer that it's my opinion and as such is worth a fraction less than the two cents it usually costs. I also state that will try to offer a suggestion where I find a flaw, but this again can be freely ignored.

Setting aside all the arseiness of the process, I found it AMAZINGLY beneficial to my own work. It wasn't until I started examining other writers' work technically, that I became really aware of what I was doing subconsciously. And when I tried to work-out ways in which a writer could rework their piece, it made me consider all the things that I was just "doing" in my own work. In solving other writers' problems, it allowed me to solve and from that point, avoid those same mistakes in my own work.

So do the crits for your own benefit. If the writer gains something from your insights, that's great, but it's never a waste of time if you benefit from it.

I know several script editors who went on to become screenwriters/producers/directors.

They cut their teeth in many of the ways described in this thread, and although the majority of the scripts they worked on were destined for a greenlight, all still needed a bit of tidying up.

I think Scripter has it right. I've done both Zoetrope and TriggerStreet and my experiences have been 50/50... I constantly get this reply to my reviews, "You must not have read my script because you just didn't get it." The other problem I've had is that the new people who write a review to just get the review credits... usually they just make the 50 word minimum and contain odd non helpful comments like, "a good script, but overall the dish was to salty for my tastes" ... seriously what the heck is that??? My script was too salty... please...

Use the script review forum here, seriously you'll get much better insight. And if you're lucky Derek will say something like "your script has a crap ending"

Sorry D... just had to bring it up one more time...

Let it go Rainy.

Just ..... let ..... it ..... go.





Peer reviews can be great to catch little details about those things you either don't know or didn't think about.
Let's say, you write something with horses and you get me as a reader. I'll be able to give you the correct lingo and actions of horsemanship.
Or, you get Derek. He can correct your Star Trek quotes.
Etc, etc.

Far as giving reviews, it's only really helpful if you give detailed, complete reviews. Um, try to find a balance and start the writer off nice and easy. Tell them what you liked, find something anything that worked. And then ease into the difficult items. Offer reasons WHY you feel this would be an issue and then try to offer a suggestion of how to fix it. Back it up with solid references. Then go back to the postives and wish them luck.

Then, just let it go. Don't worry about it.


Hope you get some nice reads and some good scripts.

Hey Parkinson,

just out of curiosity, what are some of the flaws you are seeing?

I love Zoe. You'll encounter an occasional useless person, but there are a lot of smart people over there. Some good writers and reviewers if you put the effort into finding them.

You can learn quite a bit from badly written scripts so really any script you review can strengthen your own writing.

I think the best way to utilize peer review on a site like Zoe is to look for patterns. If you get five reviews from completely unrelated reviewers and four of them mention the same thing...look into it.

I had a script up at Zoe and a reviewer mentioned something that I thought was absurd. I thought the reviewer was either a moron or had reading comprehension problems. Then another reviewer mentioned the same thing...then another...then another. In fact, every reviewer except one mentioned this aspect of my script. I changed it.

Okay,

yep, pretty big things and I'll tell you, ALL stuff people don't want to hear because that means some really serious hard work. Those are craft and story issues.

Format is easy.
It's just, YO, industry standard. Learn it, Live it Love it, or get lost.
You can kindly direct them to the Screenwriters Bible, sites like this one and others, and also many of the comps will post a link to proper format guidlines.

Keep in mind that many, many of the writers on these sites are very, very novice and may not have read any books, or any scripts. They just simply don't have a clue, thought it would be fun to try writing a movie.

The key I think to gaining a writer's trust/respect is to prove that you really read the script. The whole thing. Talk about specifics, give examples from the script.

THIS means you have to really really read the script. It's time consuming.
BUT, if you are picking up on these kinds of things then YOU can be the type of reviewer that honestly has something to offer and helps novice writers who WANT to learn.

I've had some good experiences with Zoe and even gotten some paid work from reviewing scripts.

Hillgate said:

No. If a script has an obvious flaw then it's easy to point out. The tricky thing is how to correct it and make it into a great movie. Some people get paid US$250,000 per week to do just this.

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Where do I send my resume for that job? I don't really qualify, but for that much deniro I'll make it up as I go.

Seriously though, I've been trying to sign up for Zoe for months now and can't seem to get a return email.

I checked my breath and pits, so I know it's niether of them.

Anybody else have have a problem signing up?