On rejection, and the prospect of selling out.

Manxom Vroom · Sep 26, 2006

I just posted this long musing on my blog, but then I thought I would bring it here for open discussion. I'm curious to know what people think.

...

In the past week I've gotten back six rejection letters, one of which was "suitable for framing" (printed on nice letterhead, signed by agent, personalized w/ my name and the title of the book). The letter says "You want and deserve an agent who is no less than passionate about your work, and as I am not able to bring the necessary passion to the table, it's best I step aside as you pursue the right agent and publisher."

Reading (non form) rejection letters is like reading tea leaves. I've had other agents tell me that they didn't feel strongly enough about my work, but expressed confidence that somebody else would. I can't help but wonder: is this just a canned sentiment, or should I really take heart from it? I know, I know...I should take heart from it. But does she really mean it?

I know that the quality of my writing is up to par, but I'm afraid that maybe my ideas are too difficult to pigeonhole. I keep going back to the other agent who told me that my work was "charming" (I'm charming! She said that I was charming! Oh happy day! I felt like Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer after Clarice told him that he's cute in the animated Christmas special) but that she didn't know how to market it, and wouldn't be taking me on as a client (And then I felt like Rudolph crashing to earth, expelled from all future reindeer games).

Lately I've started to wonder if I shouldn't write something that is specifically designed to sell. I have no clue what subjects are hot and what's not in science fiction and fantasy, but I could find out. I could then write a book within the realm of what's hot in hopes that it will nab me an agent, and then present my Tarot books (the ones that I feel truly passionate about) at the follow up.

Is it "selling out?" Perhaps. For ten years now I've been following my heart, writing whatever I wanted to write, what I felt strongly about. So far it's gotten me one notable short story sale, five complete but as of yet unpublished novel-length manuscripts, and a collection of weird little short stories that I self-published through iUniverse.

At the moment I'm reading a self-help book by Dr. Phil McGraw, and he talks about "people who get it, and people who don't". Are writers who follow their muse people who "don't get it?" Are writers who write novels that sell (vampire chick-lit or some such thing) those who "get it?" I'm really starting to wonder.

Is there really an agent out there who will feel strongly about A Proper Fool (the current novel I'm shopping around), or am I deluded? I just don't know.

I have the time to write, and the discipline to finish what I start. Would it be so awful if I put my efforts towards a blatantly commercial project?

RedWombat · Sep 26, 2006

I suspect that you may find that writing a blatantly saleable book is a lot harder than it looks.

After all, if blatantly saleable books were easy, all the people who desperately want sales would be writing them!

For my money, if you can write a commercially appealing novel, why on earth wouldn't you? Then once you're a best-seller, you can come back to your charming but problematic book and say "Hey, publish this!" and your publisher is probably a lot more likely to take you seriously.

Selling out is very very easy. People come at you with contracts and offer you a pen and drive a dumptruck of money to your door. Writing a saleable novel? That's hard. So I doubt it could be called selling out, unless you've already done it a few times and found it extremely easy. Then I'd worry, but not before.

Manxom Vroom · Sep 26, 2006

UrsulaV said:
For my money, if you can write a commercially appealing novel, why on earth wouldn't you? Then once you're a best-seller, you can come back to your charming but problematic book and say "Hey, publish this!" and your publisher is probably a lot more likely to take you seriously.

Well, I thought that I was writing something commercially appealing. My ideas are a bit skewed, but my writing voice is very accessible, and strongly visual. I've had many people tell me that they like what I write, people who aren't family or friends. Folks in general seem to like my stuff...except for agents.

ggglimpopo · Sep 26, 2006

Jeff

I have written a book and have an agent; huzzah! But the book has not been picked up by a publisher, despite the fact that the agent is a damn good one and the book has been submitted all over the place.

I took a long hard look at what I had written - and loved writing. And, hey presto, my fondly imagined readership, who were never going to get to see the damn thing because it was too esoteric/writerly/pedantic, suddenly became glaringly nebulous - because I had imagined ME reading my book.

I have ripped the thing apart - taken out all the "Sartre moments" and replaced them with straightforward story telling, and I am about to resubmit.

Selling my soul - I don't think so. Going for a sale - definitely.

Go for it.

Nickie · Sep 26, 2006

I agree with Ursula. It's not easy to write a book that will sell - heck, it's a lot harder than just writing what you want!

My favourite genre is historical fiction. Not something publishers are fond of... they want historical romance, not the sort of book that was popular in the fifties to the eighties. The sort of novel like "Angelique", "The Scarlet Pimpernel", ... Unfortunately, that's what I can write best. I can spin lots of stories in this genre!

But if I want to sell my books, I need to write what the public expects. So up to now I've written two revised versions of older stories, more according the guidelines of historical romance, and watch: these sell! People write me mails, telling me how they loved the story! (Probably they would have liked the older version too, but hey, who am I?")

Nickie

Manxom Vroom · Sep 26, 2006

ggglimpopo said:
Jeff

I have written a book and have an agent; huzzah! But the book has not been picked up by a publisher, despite the fact that the agent is a damn good one and has been submitted all over the place.

I took a long hard look at what I had written - and loved writing. And then my fondly imagined readership, who were never going to get to see the damn thing because it was too esoteric/writerly/pedantic, suddenly became nebulous because I had imagined ME reading my book.

I have ripped the thing apart - taken out all the "Sartre moments" and replaced them with straightforward story telling, and I am about to resubmit.

Selling my soul - I don't think so. Going for a sale - definitely.

Go for it.

Congratulations on landing an agent!

I'm not sure that I have a lot of "Sartre moments" (great phrase, btw) that I could cut. I think the problem is that my stories don't neatly fit into any predetermined genre mold. Other writers who I compare myself to are Neil Gaiman and Jonathan Carroll, but by no means would I call myself "The next Neil Gaiman." I'm just me.

jchines · Sep 26, 2006

Hi Jeff,

As others have said, it's not as easy as it sounds to write a "saleable" or hot novel. To pick one example, do you know how many people wrote "orphan boy (or girl) discovers their magical powers and runs off to learn magic" books before Rowling? Yet none of those took off the way Harry Potter did.

You also run the risk that by the time you write your hot novel, get it to an agent, sell it to a publisher, and get it into print, it will be many years after this hot trend has fizzled out, to be replaced by the next hot trend.

I haven't seen what you've done with Fool since last year's workshop, but if you decide the problem is that it's not commercial enough, another option might be to look at some of the smaller publishers who might be more willing to take a chance with something that's a bit of a departure from the norm. If so, I'd strongly suggest a lot of research beforehand to make sure you're dodging scams and getting a publisher who can give you and your book all of the support and attention it deserves.

Manxom Vroom · Sep 26, 2006

jchines said:
I haven't seen what you've done with Fool since last year's workshop, but if you decide the problem is that it's not commercial enough, another option might be to look at some of the smaller publishers who might be more willing to take a chance with something that's a bit of a departure from the norm. If so, I'd strongly suggest a lot of research beforehand to make sure you're dodging scams and getting a publisher who can give you and your book all of the support and attention it deserves.

I've thought about the small press route. I did query Llewellyn, a new age publisher that also does fiction. I thought my work would be a perfect fit for them, so they were one of my first queries. They wrote back that "while our acquisitions department gave serious consideration to your work, we decided it just doesn't suit our needs at this time." That one hurt, big time. They aren't the only game in town, of course, but getting rejected by the "perfect publisher" for my novel, a company that has done similar things, it really shook my confidence.

Manxom Vroom · Sep 26, 2006

Part of what's making me question myself right now is that I'm waiting to hear back from Shawna McCarthy, who requested a partial from me 8 weeks ago. She has agented writers similar to me, but I'm afraid it's going to be another rejection. I've had a few promising nibbles, but nobody willing to buy the whole enchillada.

jchines · Sep 26, 2006

You're doing better than I did with Shawna

I had an offer on the table from Baen, so I called her up. It took a single sentence for me to describe my work, at which point she (very politely) told me to go away.

Good luck!!!

fjeastman · Sep 26, 2006

If nothing else, writing something that's a radical departure from radical departures might be a refreshing change of pace that lifts the spirits and helps get through the dark period of shopping an ms out.

Of course, don't classify it as "selling out" or "doing what the public wants to see" ... that's just going to color the work with a hint of literary superiority in the background. If you're looking down your nose at the book and yourself as you write it, then you're going to be looking down your nose at the reader.

My only aspiration is to write fiction that people want to read. That is my personal goal. I don't look at it as selling out ... I look at it as doing the thing I want to do.

--fje

Manxom Vroom · Sep 26, 2006

fjeastman said:
If nothing else, writing something that's a radical departure from radical departures might be a refreshing change of pace that lifts the spirits and helps get through the dark period of shopping an ms out.

Of course, don't classify it as "selling out" or "doing what the public wants to see" ... that's just going to color the work with a hint of literary superiority in the background. If you're looking down your nose at the book and yourself as you write it, then you're going to be looking down your nose at the reader.

My only aspiration is to write fiction that people want to read. That is my personal goal. I don't look at it as selling out ... I look at it as doing the thing I want to do.

--fje

An excellent point. I do have this idea for a humorous alien invasion story that I genuinely think would be fun, something sort of in the Douglas Adams vein. I could even throw in some zombies.

Maprilynne · Sep 26, 2006

Manxom Vroom said:
Part of what's making me question myself right now is that I'm waiting to hear back from Shawna McCarthy, who requested a partial from me 8 weeks ago. She has agented writers similar to me, but I'm afraid it's going to be another rejection. I've had a few promising nibbles, but nobody willing to buy the whole enchillada.

Jeff, I really don't want to burst your bubble, but Shawna McCarthy is rather known for requesting partials and never getting back on them. Even after nudges. But I wish you the best of luck!

Maprilynne

Manxom Vroom · Sep 26, 2006

Maprilynne said:
Jeff, I really don't want to burst your bubble, but Shawna McCarthy is rather known for requesting partials and never getting back on them. Even after nudges. But I wish you the best of luck!

Maprilynne

Urgh. I hope that won't be true in my case.

PeeDee · Sep 26, 2006

What worries me about all this is, you're trading in the thing you wrote from your heart, the thing which is your work, because you want sales so that you can come back and later sell your work.

Even if you like the story that you wind up writing to be sellable, I'm worried that this conflicts -- somewhere in there -- with the axiom that you have to tell the truth, you have to be honest with yourself and your readers. Honestly, you wrote the book 'cause you needed a sale so that you get your other stuff a home.

That doesn't mean that you can't try to write something that more people get (which you can do, without fear that It's Not Art, or whatever) it just means that if you write it for the sale, then I think you're cheating yourself a bit, and cheating your reader too.

ctheokas · Sep 26, 2006

There's one thing I want to touch on, and that's the marketing aspect of the book. If someone can't think of a way to market a book, then either they're not taking the time, or there's a problem with the story at its core. I write this because I think if you boil any story down to its bones, you can find what you need.

The best example I can think of right now is Akira, the graphic novel/movie. Now, it was sold on the science fiction aspects of the story, which was fine, but that was all window dressing to the real story. The real story of Akira is that two best friends overcome an obstacle (which is the unbalancing of their relationship via aforementioned sci-fi elements). That's an incredibly simple story. You can market that story to so many different people, men and woman of all ages.

So, not having read your novel, I am going to assume that the core of it is solid. Try to work that core idea into your pitch, and perhaps it will become easier for the agent to see how to market it.

kuatolives · Sep 26, 2006

If you want to write something that sells, write something people will buy.
If you don't know what people will buy, buy something and look at what you bought.

Rolling Thunder · Sep 26, 2006

Wasn't there a book about that called Catch-22?

Manxom Vroom · Sep 26, 2006

I just got an email request from a new agent to look at a partial. This came just when I needed it, when I was stewing in my own juices. It's another chance, and that's all I'm asking for. Just give me a chance.

*does happy dance*

MicheleLee · Sep 26, 2006

1. You really do want an agent that is a fan. You want you agent to want to see you succeed. that's the best kind of relationship you can get. Yes, not being enthusiastic is a legit reason to decline representation.
2. There is no way you can cash in on a current trend unless you have a book already written. 1 year to write, 1 year to agent/sell, 1 year to publish, by then the trend is gone. Write the book you want to write. If you have to adapt or edit it later, fine, but don't try to sell out. You'll be riding a dead horse through the race.
3. If you are getting to fulls then perhaps something doesn't click with the story beyond the first 3 chapters. Maybe have the book critted by an friend, novelist, group, whatever. But don't pay for it.
4. Shopping this novel around? START ANOTHER ONE. Not only does it give you a distraction from waiting for responses, it looks good that you're still writing and it's a back up if/when the currently travelling novel fails to get an audience, or gets you representation but fails to sell. Always be working on something else. Here's an example of what I have going on as of today;
1 novel shopping
1 novel to be edited
1 novel being written
2 partial novels in limbo until I finish what I have and figure out what to do with them
19 shorts circulating
2 shorts unfinished
2 shorts in editing for up coming contests
1 short in progress for an invitation anthology I've been asked to be in
I'm organizing Louisville's Horror Day celebration
1 anthology I'm in being plugged, promoed, etc.

Rest occasionally, but never have just one thing going if you can help it.

Doug Johnson · Sep 26, 2006

When I get rejections, it's usually because my writing isn't as good as I thought it was.

kuatolives · Sep 26, 2006

Rllgthunder said:
Wasn't there a book about that called Catch-22?

If you're writing for a means to make money, now you're catching on.

maestrowork · Sep 26, 2006

Why?

Just because you write something highly commercial, mainstream, and popular, and you make gobs of money doing that while millions of readers get to read your work -- why is that selling out?

Do writers have to suffer for their art or else they're not worthy?

I don't understand.

Art is great, but dammit, I want an audience.

Buy my book. Buy my book. Buy my book.

JumpingJack · Sep 26, 2006

I dont see how anyone could sell out. You write what you write don't you?

Surely it's only current trends or luck that dictate what is mainstream?

Mike Coombes · Sep 26, 2006

Doug Johnson said:
When I get rejections, it's usually because my writing isn't as good as I thought it was.

It's the usual reason.

On rejection, and the prospect of selling out.

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