18th century dialect-help me!

drevil915 · Aug 7, 2006

yeah, yeah, we all see movies or TV dramatizations of 18th century history, and the people speak in such formal tones.

My question is, how did people of the 1700s talk informally. Specifically, I'm working on a piece about the american revolution and I want to convey the manner in which continental soldiers talked with each other. Does anyone have any websites that detail this? I've looked high and low, but can't find anything.

Thanks,

-Jason

badducky · Aug 7, 2006

I've been reading up on dialects of the 1800s, and I've gotta be honest with you, friend. Unless you want to include a massive glossary of slang terms, and plenty of asterisked, footnoted dialogue, just stick with the kind of thing you see in "Mason & Dixon" by Thomas Pynchon. The book is written in the style of books of the period, with spellings and apostrophes. Much of the dialogue is true to the grammar. However, this has been heavily filtered to be legible by a modern audience minus the Shakespeare liner notes.

Deleted member 42 · Aug 7, 2006

Look for letters from the period. Look at the syntax of sentences--you'll find contractions are used very differently, and you'll find there's less Latin and Greek derived vocabulary. Get one of the reproductions of Johnson's dictionary, if they're British recent arrivals, rather than colonials. Look for the letters Ben Franklin wrote; he wrote in both an erudite, formal style, and a very very colloquial style.

You can also find letter collections from the soldiers and their families.

Concentrate on the specialized vocabulary, not only of the soldier, but of the geographic area and time.

blacbird · Aug 7, 2006

Read some Henry Fielding, e.g., Tom Jones, Joseph Andrews, Jonathan Wild.

caw

Jamesaritchie · Aug 7, 2006

books

blacbird said:
Read some Henry Fielding, e.g., Tom Jones, Joseph Andrews, Jonathan Wild.

caw

I agree. I think the best way to write about a given time period is to read the writers who wrote during that period.

johnnysannie · Aug 7, 2006

How 18th century folk talked depends a great deal on several factors:
location
birthplace or origin
education or lack thereof

In the Colonies, there were many diverse dialects that stemmed from a population made of from many different nationalities. A British aristocrat would have a different manner of speech and terms than a transported convict although both might be English by birth. Irish, Scots, German, French, and other immigrants would have reflected their heritage in their speech to a fair extent. Backwoods settlers would have likely conversed in ways different to their urban peers.

Letters are a fine resource but only to a point because many people wrote in a manner much more formal than they would have spoken. And, in this time period, there were many illiterate individuals who could not read or write at all.

"Poor Richard's Almanac" by Ben Franklin might help; so might some late 17th century literature such as Phillis Wheatly, an African-American poet, author, and former slave, Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Paine, James Madison, and the Wicked or Connecticut Wits (Joel Barlow,Timothy Dwight, and John Trumbull)

The following links may also help provide some background and a starting point for additional research.

http://www.crossmyt.com/hc/linghebr/18cengvs.html

http://www.yourdictionary.com/library/yankee.html

http://encarta.msn.com/encyclopedia_761564210_3/English_Language.html

http://www.historychannel.com/thcsearch/thc_resourcedetail.do?encyc_id=200868

James D. Macdonald · Aug 7, 2006

Let's not forget Robinson Crusoe, Tristram Shandy, Pamela, Evelina, and The Mysteries of Udolpho. (All currently in print, I believe.)

Read widely. Read with attention to grammar, word choice, paragraph length, and sentence rhythm: In short, become an expert for the duration of your writing project.

janetbellinger · Aug 7, 2006

From what I understand, when it comes to dialect, less is better. I find I get annoyed if I have to wade through a lot of dialect. I mean, if Shakespeare wrote it, I don't mind but when it's somebody from our era going back in time, I can't be bothered deciphering it. I think you can get the impression of the era across with a few typical phrases.

drevil915 said:
yeah, yeah, we all see movies or TV dramatizations of 18th century history, and the people speak in such formal tones.

My question is, how did people of the 1700s talk informally. Specifically, I'm working on a piece about the american revolution and I want to convey the manner in which continental soldiers talked with each other. Does anyone have any websites that detail this? I've looked high and low, but can't find anything.

Thanks,

-Jason

persiphone_hellecat · Aug 7, 2006

Don't forget your Descriptionary. Essential for proper words to describe things in period pieces.

Gillhoughly · Aug 7, 2006

What badducky & the rest wrote. I did some books set during that period and a casual conversation of the time would be nearly impossible to follow for a modern reader. So I fudged things a bit to make it easier to understand.

My research required going to a local university library where they had 200 y.o. copies of The Gentleman's Magazine that I could pull off the shelf and read. It was printed in England from the 1750s to the 1800s and has great stuff on the Revolution from the Brit's POV. The reaction to the Declaration of Independence (printed 2-3 months after July because it took that long for the first ship to bring it across the pond) is a hoot.

I also read Thomas Jefferson's autobiography, and other autobiographies of people from the period. You get a better sense of the language used along with valuable bits on life and living.

If you can find it, a library's genealogy section (and I suppose genealogy sites) may have microfiche copies of letters from the period. Nothing like Auntie Murgatroid telling Auntie Prudence about that year' s apple crop for filling you in on the gossip!

drevil915 · Aug 7, 2006

Well, thank's everyone for the help!

I guess what I'll do is go the Sleepy Hollow road-the Johnny Depp one, where you could understand the characters but still got a sense of that proper manner of speaking.

-Jason

blacbird · Aug 7, 2006

Jamesaritchie said:
I agree. I think the best way to write about a given time period is to read the writers who wrote during that period.

Plus they're dang good reads. Tom Jones is Dickensian long, but the other two are fairly short even by modern novel standards, and Fielding could be wicked funny.

caw.

Saundra Julian · Aug 8, 2006

Did they used contractions in the era?

Mac H. · Aug 8, 2006

Did they used contractions in the era?

The 18th century is full of words like " farth'st Tis (ie: It is) Twas (ie: It was) "

Now that I think about it, we use " it's " instead of 'tis', but we really don't have a modern equipvalent of 'Twas'.

I'm going to start using it now.

Mac

James D. Macdonald · Aug 8, 2006

They used more contractions, and different ones, than we do.

Depending on where you were and who was talking, of course. Local dialects (particularly in those days of slow travel and no mass media) could make two English speakers from different regions mutually incomprehensible. Class would play a major role. So would education.

See also: Robert Burns.

Laurie · Aug 8, 2006

It's a little later, but there is a book - Everyday Life in the 1800's - A guide for Writers, Students and Historians by Marc McCutcheon. In it there is a section on Slang and Everyday Speech that is quite helpful for creating readable dialogue with historic flavor. The book shows the words used in sentences from the period. Jefferson is quoted and referenced quite a bit. It's a nice, concise place to start

Shadow_Ferret · Aug 8, 2006

Informal 18th century lingo? I think it went something like:

"Yo yo yo! Goodman Brown. How's doth it hang?"

"Well shnizle my minizle, Goodman Turner. It be liketh that!"

Or am I confusing my 17th century with my 18th century?

Jamesaritchie · Aug 8, 2006

??

Shadow_Ferret said:
Informal 18th century lingo? I think it went something like:

"Yo yo yo! Goodman Brown. How's doth it hang?"

"Well shnizle my minizle, Goodman Turner. It be liketh that!"

Or am I confusing my 17th century with my 18th century?

I don't know which century you'e in, but if you write the book, I want to read it.

johnnysannie · Aug 8, 2006

Here's a good link and reputable source that offers insight into some of the many dialects and where various words became part of everyday language:

http://pandora.cii.wwu.edu/vajda/ling201/test3materials/AmericanDialects.htm

UrsusMinor · Aug 8, 2006

Not quite your period or place, but check out Patrick O'Brian's Aubrey and Maturin series. Brilliant craftsmanship (and an interesting use of a Jane-Austen voice). The main thing you can discover from a tight reading of O'Brian is how far you can go with slang and odd locutions; he manages to make them seem like ornaments rather than speedbumps.

pdr · Aug 8, 2006

One resource I've found useful...

is the Diary Jumction: http://www.pikle.demon.co.uk/diaryjunction.html
where you can find all or parts of diaries written in your period which are freely available on the internet

18th century dialect-help me!

drevil915

badducky

No Time For Chitchat, Kemosabe.

Deleted member 42

blacbird

Jamesaritchie

johnnysannie

James D. Macdonald

Your Genial Uncle

janetbellinger

persiphone_hellecat

Gillhoughly

Grumpy writer and editor

drevil915

blacbird

Saundra Julian

A work in progress

Mac H.

Board Visitor

James D. Macdonald

Your Genial Uncle

Laurie

Shadow_Ferret

Court Jester

Jamesaritchie

johnnysannie

UrsusMinor

pdr