Need medical advice!!!

DamaNegra · Feb 13, 2006

What drugs administered to very sick people to relieve the pain can kill in an overdose?? Does morphine have that effect??

stormie · Feb 13, 2006

I know there is a form of laudanum used today in hospitals, as a pain med. Back around the time of the civil war, it was used a lot. And killed people if given in larger quantities. I wish I could remember the name of the modern version of laudanam, but can't. Maybe google it.

DamaNegra · Feb 13, 2006

I will. I'd also like to know which is the lethal dosage.

Shwebb · Feb 13, 2006

Morphine can kill. Narcan is the antidote, and it works pretty fast.

Pretty much any pain med can kill you, if you take enough.

People don't realize how lethal Tylenol and aspirin are--but they kill you slowly and painfully by damaging organs.

If you want to know lethal dosage info on various drugs, PM me. I'll give it to you. I don't feel comfortable posting the info here.

James D. Macdonald · Feb 13, 2006

DamaNegra said:
What drugs administered to very sick people to relieve the pain can kill in an overdose??

All of them.

Does morphine have that effect??

Yes.

Tish Davidson · Feb 13, 2006

If you go here
http://www.pdrhealth.com/drug_info/index.html
and type in a drug name, it will give you information on dosage, side effects, and overdose information.

Haggis · Feb 13, 2006

stormie said:
I know there is a form of laudanum used today in hospitals, as a pain med. Back around the time of the civil war, it was used a lot. And killed people if given in larger quantities. I wish I could remember the name of the modern version of laudanam, but can't. Maybe google it.

Laudanum = opium.

ColoradoGuy · Feb 14, 2006

DamaNegra said:
What drugs administered to very sick people to relieve the pain can kill in an overdose?? Does morphine have that effect??

I am an ICU physician and use these drugs all of the time. Previous posters are correct: all narcotics, particularly the intravenous ones (chiefly morphine and fentanyl) cause dose-dependent depression of breathing. This is particularly so when they are combined (as they often are) with the intravenous forms of the benzodiazepine class of anti-anxiety drugs (chiefly valium, ativan, and versed). The lethal dose would vary from person to person and would depend upon several things, such as whether they had been receiving these drugs chronically, because they all induce tolerance to their depressive effects on breathing. The standard pain-killing dose for morphine in adults is 0.05-0.1 mg/kg of body weight, or about 3-6 mg for the standard 60 kg adult. Peak onset of action is about five minutes after injection. If you were to inject a lethal dose (say 20 mg or so) breathing would likely stop at about that time. Death would occur 4-5 minutes later when the heart ran out of oxygen, much quicker if the person already had a weak heart. None of this is secret information, so I don't mind posting it.

ColoradoGuy · Feb 15, 2006

stormie said:
I know there is a form of laudanum used today in hospitals, as a pain med.

It is called paregoric (tincture of opium). It hasn't really been used since the early 1960s, since we have so many better options now for narcotic medications.

stormie · Feb 15, 2006

Yes, the form of laudanum is still used. (At least it was four years ago.) It even has part of the word laudanum in the name of the med. It's not in pill form, but either syringe or through IV. I just can't remember the exact name.

Anyway, it's not important, since all the responses to the original question are very informative.

RandomUser1432 · Feb 16, 2006

You can also look up:

Vicodin (Is often prescribed for pain after surgery)
Valium (Was prescribed to me to calm me down)
Tylenol 3 (Which has vicodin in it - often prescribed after surgery)
I have heard they will give heroin to people with 3rd degree burns all over their bodies.

As far as I know, there are only two drugs where we have not discovered a lethal dosage, despite how much some people will take of them. Even caffeine can cause a heart attack if you drink too much.

ColoradoGuy · Feb 17, 2006

RandomUser1432 said:
You can also look up:
Tylenol 3 (Which has vicodin in it - often prescribed after surgery)

No. Tylenol #3 consists of 30 mg codeine (a smallish dose for an adult) and 300 mg tylenol (the size of one standard tylenol tablet or capsule): there is no vicodin (hydrocodone). Hydrocodone is MUCH more potent than codeine.

I have heard they will give heroin to people with 3rd degree burns all over their bodies.

No. Heroin is never used in this country; it is what the feds call a schedule I drug - always illegal. For one thing, it is not a standard product, since it is extracted from the sap of a poppy. Morphine is the closest IV drug to heroin; it was once also purified from poppies but is now synthetic. Fentanyl is the most potent IV narcotic; it is fifty times stronger than morphine and also is the narcotic with the most rapid onset of its effects on the brain. And yes, we use a lot of narcotics on badly burned patients.

All of these narcotics - morphine, hydrocodone, oxycodone, fentenyl, sufentanyl, and a host of others - cause the same effect on the body. They only vary in potency and in a few odd side effects (demerol, for example, has a few weird side effects peculier to it.)

Vanatru · Dec 15, 2006

Would the person still be cognizant after a 20mg dose of morphine? Would they have passed out before then?

Thanks

-Bill

ideagirl · Dec 15, 2006

ColoradoGuy said:
No. Tylenol #3 consists of 30 mg codeine (a smallish dose for an adult) and 300 mg tylenol (the size of one standard tylenol tablet or capsule): there is no vicodin (hydrocodone).

I think I know where that poster's confusion came from. Vicodin is not pure hydrocodone: it is a combination of hydrocodone and acetaminophen (the active ingredient in Tylenol). So, that combination of painkillers does exist and is widely available (by prescription only, of course).

Steve Lenaghan · Dec 16, 2006

We took a patient in by ambulance who overdosed on Philip's Milk of Magnesia. It is not in the poison guide nor the CPS book but he was on the table out cold. I joked that since he overdosed on an antidote maybe we needed to poison the patient. The doctor laughed the nurse thought we meant it.

When I crashed off a ladder last year and crushed two vertebrae I got a hip full of MS Morphine Sulfate. Like wow, man... I could have limboed after that.

I was treated with Valium for flying and ended up eating it like candy. I found myself at the top of a 50 tower, no climbing gear. I quit the stuff right then cold.

Conversation with pharmacist after slamming bottle on counter.

"What is this stuff"

"Its a tranquilizer"

"Do I look f,,,ing tranquil to you?"

I went home had a drink, laid on couch and woke up 27 hours later.

I have a high tolerance for pain and pain killers let you do things that your body would rather you didn't. I learned that lesson by being in my spinal brace for two more months than I needed.

What was the question again?.

Anything in excess can kill or disable functions. Even too much water will do a number on your system.

Vanatru · Dec 16, 2006

Steve Lenaghan said:
Anything in excess can kill or disable functions. Even too much water will do a number on your system.

Amazingly true....reminds me of that Marine recruit who drowned a few years ago from drinking to much water during boot.

ErylRavenwell · Dec 17, 2006

Just google morphine toxity or anaesthetic overdose. Did you mean a local anaesthetic whose margin between effectiveness and toxicity is slight?

In that case go for lignocaine, a local anaesthetic. The margin is not that small, though; but negligent use can lead to death. The drug must be administered in accordance to the body mass. Maximum adult dose is 10 ml (200 mg) of 2% lignocaine. So an old fella, with lower body mass than an adult in his prime, will be knocking on heaven's door pretty soon if administered that max adult dose. Yer know what I mean

ErylRavenwell · Dec 17, 2006

Originally Posted by Steve Lenaghan
Anything in excess can kill or disable functions. Even too much water will do a number on your system

Actually that's not true most of the time. Usually you'll vomit most of the time if ingested, otherwise your liver'd neutralise the toxin after some complications. It's not so easy to die of an overdose. A few substances are actually lethal in overdose. I'm not talking of extreme overdoses here.

Steve Lenaghan · Dec 18, 2006

If the toxin don't get you the vomit will. I've bagged too many who choked on their own vomit. So the mechanism meant to save you ends up killing you instead.

Small amounts of lead properly administered will cause the same symptoms

Vanatru · Dec 18, 2006

Boy howdy....and all those TV show made it look so easy to OD. I feel like they've been lying to me now. *sniff*

Need medical advice!!!

DamaNegra

Mexican on the loose!

stormie

storm central

DamaNegra

Mexican on the loose!

Shwebb

She's the creepy-looking dude

James D. Macdonald

Your Genial Uncle

Tish Davidson

Haggis

Evil, undead Chihuahua

ColoradoGuy

I've seen worse.

ColoradoGuy

I've seen worse.

stormie

storm central

RandomUser1432

ColoradoGuy

I've seen worse.

Vanatru

practical experience, FTW

ideagirl

Steve Lenaghan

Packing and moving out, bye!

Vanatru

practical experience, FTW

ErylRavenwell

ErylRavenwell

Steve Lenaghan

Packing and moving out, bye!

Vanatru

practical experience, FTW