Stuck/Unstuck

CrastersBabies · Mar 4, 2012

I'm in a bind. I have a scene and I've attempted to write this sucker half a dozen ways. Nothing is working. Nothing feels right. It's an important "link" from one act to the next for two of my characters.

I'm sure some of you have been in this situation. I feel like I'm living in "groundhog day" where I have to rewrite the same scene until I get it right. THEN, I can escape the loop of eternal doom.

How have some of you dealt with this? I imagine I could continue trying to write different scenarios. I've tried verbally talking myself through it. I've tried making pro/con lists for each scenario. This has been a thorn in my side for a month. I return to this scene, make an attempt, then set it aside. I'm at a point where I can't proceed until I crack this sucker.

While I understand that tenacity will likely pay off, I'd sure feel better if I know others have faced this. Why do you think it happened? How did you deal with it? What did you learn from it?

Anything at all.

Again, I can't drop it or the following chapters will make no sense. It's necessary. It moves the story ahead. It's vital. I'm just having a bear of a time executing it.

Ygramul · Mar 4, 2012

When I have a hard time getting a scene to go right, I find it's helpful to back up in the sequence of scenes. Usually I find that I need something else to come before it that allows the scene that's plaguing me to go smoothly.

L.C. Blackwell · Mar 4, 2012

If you know what comes after, why not mark it as unfinished and write the next scene or two? Sometimes moving ahead will make things clearer, or hint at why the previous material wasn't working.

Then too, when you come back to it later, you may have found a different way to create the necessary link.

dangerousbill · Mar 4, 2012

CrastersBabies said:
While I understand that tenacity will likely pay off, I'd sure feel better if I know others have faced this. Why do you think it happened? How did you deal with it? What did you learn from it?

For me, after a great deal of apparently unsuccessful effort, it's a good time to turn it over to my dinosaur brain. I stop working on it and let it fester down out of sight in my subconscious.

Sometime in the following week or two, a solution will generally pop into my head out of nowhere. But I know that all the 'unsuccessful' work will have contributed indirectly to the solution.

Federator · Mar 4, 2012

I think most writers have been in the same experience, it's part of making a good story.
You could leave it and allow yourself time to think about it, if its an important part of your story, you should try and make it as good as you can and not leave it out. Spend some time thinking about it, looking at how others have done it ect. But remember, if its a crucial part, make it decent, otherwise you will have a hard time writing ahead because you wont have written it down exactly as its happened.
-All your failures will make your final copy all the better!

bethanythemartian · Mar 4, 2012

This may or may not be happening to you, but I know when I get stuck it's because some part of my brain knows what I'm doing is not gonna work out. Generally I have to take metaphorical dynamite to the scene and alter it drastically, move it, or cut it completely. However, our brains all work differently, so YMMV.

What might help is if you strip the transition down it to it's barest bones. What absolutely HAS to happen for the story to continue? Why does it have to happen now? and so forth.

Devil Ledbetter · Mar 5, 2012

CrastersBabies said:
I'm in a bind. I have a scene and I've attempted to write this sucker half a dozen ways. Nothing is working. Nothing feels right. It's an important "link" from one act to the next for two of my characters.

I'm sure some of you have been in this situation. I feel like I'm living in "groundhog day" where I have to rewrite the same scene until I get it right. THEN, I can escape the loop of eternal doom.

How have some of you dealt with this? I imagine I could continue trying to write different scenarios. I've tried verbally talking myself through it. I've tried making pro/con lists for each scenario. This has been a thorn in my side for a month. I return to this scene, make an attempt, then set it aside. I'm at a point where I can't proceed until I crack this sucker.

While I understand that tenacity will likely pay off, I'd sure feel better if I know others have faced this. Why do you think it happened? How did you deal with it? What did you learn from it?

Anything at all.

Again, I can't drop it or the following chapters will make no sense. It's necessary. It moves the story ahead. It's vital. I'm just having a bear of a time executing it.

I do a character interview when I'm stuck. I roleplay as both the interviewer and the character, and ask the character to tell me all about what happened, how he felt, the details, etc. I free write his replies.

This method doesn't work for everyone but it has never failed me.

My tricks are:

1. Notify the character ahead of time. Just put a note in the MS that says "Bob, tomorrow I'll be interviewing you about what happened. So think it over."

2. Always ask open ended questions, and write down the answers even if they conflict with your expectations or with other things in the plot. You'll iron that stuff out later. Listen to your character.

3. No editing the character's words as you go. This is fact finding, not writing.

4, Always thank your character when the interview ends.

readitnweep · Mar 5, 2012

bethanythemartian said:
...I know when I get stuck it's because some part of my brain knows what I'm doing is not gonna work out. Generally I have to take metaphorical dynamite to the scene and alter it drastically, move it, or cut it completely.

So true. When I get "stuck," it always later turns out to be at a point where I'm doing something that isn't going to work out- typically when I'm trying to force something.

My recommendation is to step back from the piece for a couple of days or more then come back to it and write it as it flows, not as you're trying to make it go. See if that works - for me it does 100 percent of the time.

CrastersBabies · Mar 5, 2012

Ygramul wrote:

When I have a hard time getting a scene to go right, I find it's helpful to back up in the sequence of scenes. Usually I find that I need something else to come before it that allows the scene that's plaguing me to go smoothly.

I think you are exactly right. It's time to review things up until this point.

Federator wrote:

Spend some time thinking about it, looking at how others have done it ect. But remember, if its a crucial part, make it decent, otherwise you will have a hard time writing ahead because you wont have written it down exactly as its happened.

I like this suggestion as well, to look at how this has been done before.

Devil Ledbetter wrote:

I do a character interview when I'm stuck. I roleplay as both the interviewer and the character, and ask the character to tell me all about what happened, how he felt, the details, etc. I free write his replies.

This is such an amazing idea. This is a great moment to interview the two characters involved, too. Hahah. One question, though. Do your characters answer 100% "truthfully" without fear of repercussions? Or, do they put a spin on it?

bethanythemartian said:
This may or may not be happening to you, but I know when I get stuck it's because some part of my brain knows what I'm doing is not gonna work out. Generally I have to take metaphorical dynamite to the scene and alter it drastically, move it, or cut it completely. However, our brains all work differently, so YMMV.

What might help is if you strip the transition down it to it's barest bones. What absolutely HAS to happen for the story to continue? Why does it have to happen now? and so forth.

You know, I thought about this last night before bed and the moment I got up this morning and I think you are 100% correct. While the chapter is super important, the "beef" of it can be downplayed, can be given less "page time," and still build toward the same impact in subsequent chapters.

The way it's been written before has been in depth. It's a conversation between two people after something traumatic has happened, and it was--honestly--too long, too overwrought, too soapy. But, there needed to be an emotional resolution.

I THINK I can do that w/o a long, lengthy conversation. I think I can turn the volume way down on the dialogue and amp up physical action, body language and subtext.

I don't know, but for some reason this connected with what I was thinking this morning.

Thanks to ALL who responded! Unfortunately, I can't really let this go now. I've been going back and forth too long (months) on this. I need to solve this, but, I do believe that with the above ideas I'll brush up against the answer at the very least--if not fix it completely. Off to write!

Jamesaritchie · Mar 5, 2012

I rewrite every scene until I think it's right, and only then do I move on. For me, the important thing is to realize when a scene is Good Enough. There comes a point when you simply have to move on to the next scene, whatever you think of the current one.

Nine times out of ten, when I have trouble with such a scene, but just move on after the fourth or fifth attempt, and then read the scene again when the story is finished, it reads just fine. The problem with many scenes isn't scene quality, it's the writer's perception of scene quality while writing it.

HoneyBadger · Mar 5, 2012

It's stuff like this that makes me wish "Anyhow, then they did some stuff, and I don't feel like writing this part anymore, so please turn the page," was a legitimate style choice.

Devil Ledbetter · Mar 5, 2012

CrastersBabies said:
This is such an amazing idea. This is a great moment to interview the two characters involved, too. Hahah. One question, though. Do your characters answer 100% "truthfully" without fear of repercussions? Or, do they put a spin on it?

They answer in character, which means I have a pretty good idea if they're giving it spin. But I don't argue and there are no repercussions. I just sit back and let the character do most of the talking. Later I can decide if something they said just didn't add up.

Most of the time what they say makes more sense both from a plot and motivational angle than whatever I was stuck on. (Which was why I was stuck to begin with. Something doesn't add up; characters refuse to move.)

Just keep them talking. And be sure to thank them.

Devil Ledbetter · Mar 5, 2012

HoneyBadger said:
It's stuff like this that makes me wish "Anyhow, then they did some stuff, and I don't feel like writing this part anymore, so please turn the page," was a legitimate style choice.

Please include this in your writing challenge entry. If you don't, I will have to steal it.

HoneyBadger · Mar 5, 2012

We can start a movement.

We can change the whole world.

Chasing the Horizon · Mar 5, 2012

HoneyBadger said:
It's stuff like this that makes me wish "Anyhow, then they did some stuff, and I don't feel like writing this part anymore, so please turn the page," was a legitimate style choice.

YES! Lol, I officially declare that a legitimate style. :tongue

I'm another who usually lets sticky scenes go until I'm finished everything else. Usually that shows what the problem was. And if it doesn't, the sticky scene being the last thing standing between me and completion of the story is a good motivation for fixing it, lol.

Random note: I thought this thread was going to be about getting your characters literally stuck in a place they don't have the means to escape but aren't supposed to be. Which is what I just did in my WIP . . .

Hansey · Mar 5, 2012

HoneyBadger said:
It's stuff like this that makes me wish "Anyhow, then they did some stuff, and I don't feel like writing this part anymore, so please turn the page," was a legitimate style choice.

Oh god, yes.

I have a couple of scenes right now that I'm struggling with this problem on (in revision). I keep rewriting them, and just when I think I'm on a roll and it's going well... BAM. I write myself right into a wall again and wonder what the hell just happened.

For the time being, I'm just letting them fester and am moving on with the revision. And then hope I'll be struck with the miraculous cure to their illness.

jaksen · Mar 5, 2012

Leave a marker and move on to the next scene. Maybe when you least expect it, the correct way to work the scene will simply come to you.

No, I mean it. I've done this a lot of times, just jumped over a scene (I usually write the scenes in order) and then come back after things sort themselves out in my head.

The worst thing, though (imo), is to get stuck there, like a truck with its tires stuck in the mud and no progress is being made in any direction.

Scribhneoir · Mar 5, 2012

CrastersBabies said:
This is such an amazing idea. This is a great moment to interview the two characters involved, too. Hahah. One question, though. Do your characters answer 100% "truthfully" without fear of repercussions? Or, do they put a spin on it?

I've used this technique and found it extremely helpful. My characters do answer truthfully because they're eager as hell to share their opinions of all the other characters, not to mention justifying their own behavior. Just asking them why they deserve to be in the scene has broken the block for me more than once.

CrastersBabies · Mar 5, 2012

Scribhneoir said:
I've used this technique and found it extremely helpful. My characters do answer truthfully because they're eager as hell to share their opinions of all the other characters, not to mention justifying their own behavior. Just asking them why they deserve to be in the scene has broken the block for me more than once.

Hmmm, so more confessional then? I think that might work for this situation. Thanks for the tip!

The Lonely One · Mar 5, 2012

Have you considered that you might be burning yourself out on this scene? Perhaps you've lost objectivity and need input from another reader?

CrastersBabies · Mar 5, 2012

The Lonely One said:
Have you considered that you might be burning yourself out on this scene? Perhaps you've lost objectivity and need input from another reader?

That could be it. Very much so. I'm about to sit down and make another attempt tonight. Maybe if it feels off again, I'll get some feedback.

But, yeah, burnout is a definite possibility!

GFanthome · Mar 6, 2012

L.C. Blackwell said:
If you know what comes after, why not mark it as unfinished and write the next scene or two? Sometimes moving ahead will make things clearer, or hint at why the previous material wasn't working.

Then too, when you come back to it later, you may have found a different way to create the necessary link.

I was just going to post something very similar to this.

Stuck/Unstuck

Burninator!

Keeper of Fort Blanket

Retired Illuminatus

14 and writing.

Princess of Mars

Come on you stranger, you legend,

Burninator!

terribly loud, emotionally distant

Come on you stranger, you legend,

Come on you stranger, you legend,

terribly loud, emotionally distant

Blowing in the Wind

She who distributes the cookies

Caped Codder

Reinventing Myself

Burninator!

Why is a raven like a writing desk?

Burninator!

At the computer, opening a vein