POV 2nd Person

Literateparakeet · Jan 28, 2012

I just "read" (listened to it on CD actually), a book where one character's view point is told in 2nd person. As in:

When the birds hit your airplane, you hear the sound you always think of as machine gun fire. You say to your co-pilot, "my plane" and take the controls.

It is as if you are that character. Fascinating. It was a little jarring at first, since I had never come across that before, but then I 'fell into it' and liked it. Since that character had PTSD and lived in a haunted house, it was powerful to feel as if you are him.

The book was Night Strangers by Chris Bohjalian. He mentioned two other books he had seen 2nd person POV used in that inspired him. (I forgot to jot them down though...sigh).

I'm just curious has anyone come across this in their reading? Have you read Night Strangers, or something else?

Even more interesting...have YOU tried writing this way? I think it would be challenging. I might have to try it in a short, just for fun. I know I am too green to pull it off in a novel though. Especially with other characters presented in 3rd person as Chris Bohjalian did...but then he is a Master Word Smith! I love his work.

Grunkins · Jan 28, 2012

Bright Lights, Big City is the book that always comes to mind when I think of 2nd POV done well. It's effective in the right person's hands. I don't dare try it.

kuwisdelu · Jan 28, 2012

The most famous example is probably Bright Lights, Big City by Jay McInerney.

I've written a short or two in 2nd person, and once or twice in scenes from longer stuff, when I think it might achieve a greater effect than 1st or 3rd.

Dr.Gonzo · Jan 28, 2012

I've never written a full story in that POV. Although it's fairly easy to slip in and out of it when writing in first person.

kuwisdelu · Jan 28, 2012

Dr.Gonzo said:
I've never written a full story in that POV. Although it's fairly easy to slip in and out of it when writing in first person.

True. It's much easier to use when it's a hypothetical "you" than when "you" are a specific character.

Jamesaritchie · Jan 28, 2012

By and large, I detest first person. It doesn't make me think I'm the character at all, in any way. Just the opposite. First person makes me think I'm the character. Second person makes me think the writer is trying to be a writer, rather than a storyteller. To me, it comes across as a poor gimmick.

Having said this, Bright Lights, Big City, was an incredibly good novel. But even there, I would have liked any other tense better.

Cyia · Jan 28, 2012

I like to write short pieces in 2nd because it gives them a noirish voice over feel, but the only books I've ever read in that POV are the 'Choose Your Own Adventure' stuff when I was a kid.

However, there's a newish book called "YOU" by Charles Benoit that's supposed to be very good, and it's in 2nd.

blacbird · Jan 28, 2012

Jamesaritchie said:
By and large, I detest first person. It doesn't make me think I'm the character at all, in any way. Just the opposite. First person makes me think I'm the character.

Methinks there's a typo of some kind here, because otherwise this is completely self-contradictory nonsense. Could it be you meant to say I detest second person?

caw

kuwisdelu · Jan 28, 2012

Jamesaritchie said:
Having said this, Bright Lights, Big City, was an incredibly good novel. But even there, I would have liked any other tense better.

Also... huh?

Dr.Gonzo · Jan 28, 2012

Put the pipe down, JR.

Jamesaritchie · Jan 28, 2012

blacbird said:
Methinks there's a typo of some kind here, because otherwise this is completely self-contradictory nonsense. Could it be you meant to say I detest second person?

caw

Yep, I noticed something was seriously wrong when reading this thread a second time, and my brain still had a large and smelly fart. Something was very, very wrong, but just what still didn't register. I had the cartoon question marks and ecclamation marks abouve my head, but still couldn't see why it made no sense.

Thank you for pointing that out.

Dr.Gonzo · Jan 28, 2012

Cool. He's human after all.

charmingbillie · Jan 28, 2012

I once swore I would never ever ever write a story in second person. Then I did, more or less by accident (I didn't realize it until I was already two pages into it). When it was done, I sold it to a good place and it ended up in a Year's Best anthology. So, I like it much better now

I think some stories just really want to be second person. Not very many stories and it's hard to tell which ones, but if you hit it right, it can be a really powerful tool.

backslashbaby · Jan 28, 2012

I just read a short recently in 2nd. It's one of the stories in Circling the Drain by Amanda Davis.

I'm pretty sure it's the one called 'Crash' but I'm very bad at titles on short works.

It's a great story, and 2nd works well there, imho.

eta: yep, it's Crash.

You are weaving through your life when a plane falls from the sky....

CrastersBabies · Jan 28, 2012

Dennis LeHane has a great story in 2nd person called "Until Gwen." (America's Best Short Stories 2005, I believe).

Junot Diaz also does some great stuff in 2nd person. "How to Date a Brown Girl," is in 2nd person directive and one of my favorites.

I enjoyed Bright Lights Big City as well. I thought 2nd person was a great choice. It's a wonderful POV that lets you in close, but also keeps you an an arm's length at the same time.

James D. Macdonald · Jan 28, 2012

I think of 2nd person as stunt writing, which should only be performed by a trained stunt writer on a closed course.

Toothpaste · Jan 28, 2012

Danielle Younge-Ullman uses it in FALLING UNDER. It isn't all the time, just peppered throughout, but I think it is wonderfully effective.

blacbird · Jan 28, 2012

Just as a counterweight to some of the opinions expressed here (which I respect), I found Bright Lights, Big City to be an unreadable, pretentious, gimmicky piece of gag.

caw

Madison Ready · Jan 28, 2012

I recently read Simon Van Booy's Everything Beautiful Began After, which was divided into three portions. The Second portion was done in 2nd person POV. It's been lauded by many, but I struggled with it. I don't know if it was the POV, or the plot, that messed with me more.

Madison

CrastersBabies · Jan 28, 2012

2nd person always seems to get a lot of response, good and bad.

I have had people tell me that it comes across as too directive: "Don't tell me what I'm doing while I'm reading."

But, honestly? That's not the intent, imho. Maybe that's the kind of reaction you'd get from a high-schooler who doesn't know how 2nd person functions.

I've seen it gimmicky and I've seen it done very well with distinct purpose. As a writer, I have a toolbox. Maybe I want to take out that funky looking thing-ma-bob (that is the 2nd person POV) and use it. Maybe I don't. But, I think ignoring it as a tool of writing craft is a bit worrisome. I read a craft book once that had 2 sentences under "2nd person POV." They basically said, "don't bother."

Why not? If you don't like it and don't want to try it out, don't. But, I know a LOT of writers (a good number of students, too) who tried 2nd person, reluctantly, and ended up discovering how to play in the world of voice and POV.

Strange POVs can open a writer up to taking risks. 1st person plural (the collective "we") is another really fun POV to play in. You'll always get talk about how you should never EVER do it, never TRY it, run screaming from it, yet people do get published writing in the less traditional POVs. The writing still has to be good, regardless of what POV you choose.

eyeblink · Jan 29, 2012

Charles Stross's Halting State is in second person from three different POVs.

Another example is David Morell's novella "The Beautiful Uncut Hair of Graves". I found the use of second person very effective as the protagonist's identity is under threat.

I have used second person a few times in short stories and sold some of them - one of them to F & SF.

I see it as a "special effect" technique, one that you would use occasionally but can be very effective with the right story.

CrastersBabies · Jan 29, 2012

eyeblink said:
Charles Stross's Halting State is in second person from three different POVs.

Another example is David Morell's novella "The Beautiful Uncut Hair of Graves". I found the use of second person very effective as the protagonist's identity is under threat.

I have used second person a few times in short stories and sold some of them - one of them to F & SF.

I see it as a "special effect" technique, one that you would use occasionally but can be very effective with the right story.

A few stories I need to check out. 2nd person multiple POV? Ahh! Wow, definitely need to see that.

Catalyn · Jan 29, 2012

2nd person POV always makes me think of those Choose Your Own Adventure books, where I spent half an hour designing a character and then fell into a bottomless pit five pages in (this book clearly scarred me for life as I still remember it fifteen years later...)

I never really considered the POV to be a good way of writing a novel, but will definitely be looking up some of these recommendations. The idea of second person with multiple POVs just blows my mind!

eqb · Jan 29, 2012

eyeblink said:
Charles Stross's Halting State is in second person from three different POVs.

His novel Rule 34 is also second person, present tense, with multiple POVs. It's a brilliant novel, but I had to put it away for later when I have more energy.

Libbie · Jan 29, 2012

The Crimson Petal and the White by Michel Faber is entirely in 2nd person -- a very long (and very good) novel.

Parts of the Pulitzer Prize-winning novel The Brief Wondrous Life of Oscar Wao (Junot Diaz) are in second person.

Parts of Pilgrim at Tinker Creek (Annie Dillard) are in second. Another extremely excellent book, well worth reading, especially if you are into nature.

I love second person. I think it's fun.

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