Great Crits and What You Learn From Them

Dr.Gonzo · Nov 25, 2011

So I'm going against the trend at the minute. They're all very good threads but it's Friday and I'm feeling a bit negative posting in them a lot. So here's the cure. Not all crits are bad. Most of them are great. Even if they can't tell you how to fix it, they'll at least make you aware that something's wrong. I have my problems and so do you. Name a problem you've been slapped in the face with, you literary cabbage patch. If you can think of one poster who remedies it, name them.

I'll go first: My characters are always walking through doors. They're never in the right room. They always have to walk through the hallway, open the door, go in the room. If they're handing something to someone, I feel a great urge to have them pick it up first. How, God, can I hand someone something when no one knows I'm holding the object? Damn you to hell. Anyway, I'm getting over it. Thanks to Fruitbat and his wicked line-by-lines.

Show your appreciation. And no, I've only had a few drinks so far.

Ken · Nov 25, 2011

... "avoid overly long sentences that jut off in different directions.
Break them down into smaller ones."
I forget the precise wording. It went something like that.

I think it was "Donkey" who gave me the advice,
along with some other sound guidance. Have made use of it.
It's been awhile and I haven't seen him around recently.

-------------------------------

Thanks VV

Dr.Gonzo · Nov 25, 2011

Ken. Teddy bear avatar. Shy and sensitive. Love it

Mr Flibble · Nov 25, 2011

Broadswordbabe gives the most excellent crits. I always learn something. She'll dissect that baby right down to the ground and then reconstruct....I'm in awe tbh. At crit meetings I find myself saying 'Yeah, what she said....'

Parametric · Nov 25, 2011

Trust your writing.

Georgina tells me this every time, and every time I get a little bit closer to understanding.

Do not repeat, do not emphasise, do not hammer home. Go lightly. Trust your writing.

Thanks, Georgina. :LilLove:

mirandashell · Nov 25, 2011

Reziac is always good with his crits. He lets me bounce ideas off him and we usually get an answer.

And I had a great crit yesterday from Nuallain. Spotted the problem I was having straight off and gave great advice.

And I love crits from Cwm cos his mind twists the same way as mine. So I know he gets what I'm trying to do.

VoireyLinger · Nov 25, 2011

One of my CPs is great for pointing out missed moments. "We need to pause here and hold on to the emotion." It's like she puts her finger on a spot in the manuscript and pinpoints where the reader needs an extra heartbeat of time. She also hates my long sentences, but I mostly ignore her.

Another is great for continuity and bigger picture moments, like when I had a storm raging during an angel/demon war. "And the rest of the world thinks this is what, angel farts?" She pinpoints world building issues and is great for brainstorming solutions.

A third is my cheerleader. She tells me what is working. Her crits are peppered with, "Love this," and "LOL," and "Rawr, that's sexy." My favorite comments from her break down technique and why it works for her. The last round I got from her commented on paragraph structure and why she felt it was effective.

Different CPs offer different insights. I feel blessed to have such a crit group with such a great group of writers. Their strengths make me a better writer, and I hope they feel the same about me.

Libbie · Nov 25, 2011

She's not on the forum, unfortunately, but a friend of mine can always spot when I'm not remaining consistent to the character's voice. That's my biggest blind spot and she really helps me with that! I'm so grateful to her!!

mirandashell · Nov 25, 2011

mirandashell said:
Reziac is always good with his crits. He lets me bounce ideas off him and we usually get an answer.

And I had a great crit yesterday from Nuallain. Spotted the problem I was having straight off and gave great advice.

And I love crits from Cwm cos his mind twists the same way as mine. So I know he gets what I'm trying to do.

BTW, I appreciate everyone who crits cos I know it's hard work. So please don't be thinking I'm ungrateful!

Paul · Nov 25, 2011

Parametric said:
Trust your writing.

Georgina tells me this every time, and every time I get a little bit closer to understanding.

Do not repeat, do not emphasise, do not hammer home. Go lightly. Trust your writing.

Thanks, Georgina.

That's a nice one. I think it's sorta trust your reader as much as trust your writing.

Have to say, all comments/ crits are good - in the sense you're getting a definite response to your work - it doent matter if it's detailed or whatever - it's a response that otherwise would not be available - meaning you otherwise would have to operate in a vacuum - which is a killer.

yes, dont lose your voice/ style etc because of an observation, but definitely recognise the value of responses- even when/ if they sting! (usually the better ones....)

defcon6000 · Nov 25, 2011

mirandashell said:
Reziac is always good with his crits. He lets me bounce ideas off him and we usually get an answer.

Ditto X 1000

And I love crits from Cwm cos his mind twists the same way as mine. So I know he gets what I'm trying to do.

I think CWM is a woman -- tho, don't quote me on it.

the cat came back · Nov 25, 2011

I always learn something from crits - good ones and bad ones. There's nothing like another perspective.

I also learn a lt from giving crits - we see problems in other people's writing that we miss in our own, which sharpens the faculty.

Win-win.

Fruitbat · Nov 25, 2011

Thanks, Dr. Gonzo! And I learn from the opposite, somehow I always think everybody already knows all the small stuff. I am so surprised when I post something and everyone tells me they have no idea what I'm babbling on about. LOL!

I learn the most from the most detailed critiques. I don't need a lot of hand-holding. The only thing that I really get upset about is if someone seems like they are being deliberately mean or sarcastic, but I haven't had much of that.

Also from getting a lot of critiques on the same story. Things show up differently when you hear from a couple dozen people, as opposed to just a couple of people.

Layla Nahar · Nov 25, 2011

I think Bartholemew's detailed crits are really something, he really gives a lot. And Donkey's thorough crits are great, I think he usually says something nice as well as the crits.

WriteMinded · Nov 25, 2011

I haven't stuck my neck out that many times, but getting my first chapter on SYW is on my ToDo list.

When I was very new here, Anonymous gave me a crit that was so helpful I wrote a different book!

I also appreciated He Who Shall Remain Nameless' crit when I posted the first 200 words of the MS I just finished.

Bufty · Nov 26, 2011

This is a Basic Writing Questions Forum. What's with all these recent weird threads?

I don't think cliques should be encouraged.

If I find a critique helpful, I say thankyou in the relevant thread, or send a Rep.

Dr.Gonzo · Nov 26, 2011

Bufty, what are you on about?

Bufty · Nov 26, 2011

I may be alone - probably am - but I just don't see the point or relevance of some of these threads.

Fruitbat · Nov 26, 2011

So then, so far what is most valued in critiques is detail, and also encouragement? And maybe someone to discuss back and forth with?

*taking names down so I know who to bother next time I post a story, lol*

Dr.Gonzo · Nov 26, 2011

Bufty said:
I may be alone - probably am - but I just don't see the point or relevance of some of these threads.

Fair play. I did say why I made it in the initial post. There seemed to be a few negative threads and I thought a positive one would even the odds. I'm not precious about threads I start, though, so it's nice to see a different view. You know, opinions are arseholes or something.

Fruitbat · Nov 26, 2011

It's "pointless," "irrelevant", "weird," and "cliquish" to discuss what works for us or not in work or critiques, on a writers' board? That sounds untrue by definition, as well as rather insulting to those of us participating in the discussion.

The only time I see an issue would be if people are called out by name or deed in a negative way, which I have not seen.

I don't understand why people post on a thread just to tell everyone they don't approve of the thread. Why would anyone expect every thread to appeal to them? If a thread doesn't interest me, I just skip it. *shrug* Unless there's more to this story?

Dr.Gonzo · Nov 26, 2011

Fruitbat said:
It's "pointless," "irrelevant", "weird," and "cliquish" to discuss what works for us or not in work or critiques, on a writers' board? That sounds untrue by definition, as well as rather insulting to those of us participating in the discussion.

The only time I see an issue would be if people are called out by name or deed in a negative way, which I have not seen.

I don't understand why people post on a thread just to tell everyone they don't approve of the thread. Why would anyone expect every thread to appeal to them? If a thread doesn't interest me, I just skip it. *shrug* Unless there's more to this story?

I agree. From what I've seen in the various threads about this subject, everyone has remained respectful. Also, we have hundreds of threads being made about how you shouldn't write and what doesn't work. Being on a board with crits available, is it so strange to have threads about how you shouldn't crit and what crits don't work for you, the writer? Surely any points we bring to light on this subject, be it positive or negative, can only lead to a better understanding, as individuals and as a community.

Bufty · Nov 26, 2011

Take what you wish from my post but there is no 'other story' and no concealed insult.

Fruitbat said:
It's "pointless," "irrelevant", "weird," and "cliquish" to discuss what works for us or not in work or critiques, on a writers' board? That sounds untrue by definition, as well as rather insulting to those of us participating in the discussion.

The only time I see an issue would be if people are called out by name or deed in a negative way, which I have not seen.

I don't understand why people post on a thread just to tell everyone they don't approve of the thread. Why would anyone expect every thread to appeal to them? If a thread doesn't interest me, I just skip it. *shrug* Unless there's more to this story?

Fruitbat · Nov 26, 2011

I'm not taking anything from your post that wasn't stated or wishing for anything from it, either. Just wondering what your point is, I guess. It didn't sound very nice, but I have no idea how this thread and the others like it could be considered offensive. *shrug*

the cat came back · Nov 26, 2011

I thought that the original premise of the thread was WHAT constituted a good crit but morphed into WHO gives good crit, the former possibly constituting a Basic Writing Question and the latter being of a different nature (which Buffy feels is out of place).

Just my analysis.

Great Crits and What You Learn From Them

Wonderfully Irreverent

Wonderfully Irreverent

They've been very bad, Mr Flibble

Angel Wing Fetish

Worst song played on ugliest guitar

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Seashell Seller

Derailed

Where have the last ten years gone?

Wonderfully Irreverent

Where have the last ten years gone?

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Wonderfully Irreverent

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Wonderfully Irreverent

Where have the last ten years gone?

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