1 space or 2 after period

the debster · Nov 9, 2005

Fellow novelists,

I am in a quandary. I normally compose my novels and short stories exclusively in Courier New 12 point--and ALWAYS with TWO spaces after a period. However, I see more and more manuscripts presented in Times New Roman 12 point--only ONE space after the period.

I am a published author, therefore perhaps this is a non-issue as what I'm doing seems to be working, but I am also the moderator for a writers' group and don't want to lead my members astray.

I'm reluctant to change my way of formatting, yet want to stay current.

I've read opinions from editors/agents that they prefer Courier due to the fact that they can read pages quicker. And Courier remains the required method for screenplays.

What's everyone's take out there?

1 space after period?
2 spaces after period?
Times Roman, or Courier New?

Should I be swayed, or am I submitting correctly?

DJLedford

PeeDee · Nov 9, 2005

I always use one space after the period while actually writing, because that's how I'm used to writing and I don't to trip myself up and slow down. Afterward, though, I usually go through and add a second space, mostly at the behest of people I know.

(if someone would like to come along and say, "Use only one space forever after!" then that would be fine. It's a wee bit tedious, hunting for periods in my mss.)

AprilBoo · Nov 9, 2005

I always do two spaces for print, one space for web.

goatpiper · Nov 9, 2005

I always use two spaces after a period. That is traditional typing format, as far as I know.

clintl · Nov 9, 2005

I always use two, but in my magazine article writing class Monday night, the issue came up, and the AP Stylebook says to use one. That's not really relevant to novels, I guess, but apparently, there is not one right answer.

Kasey Mackenzie · Nov 9, 2005

I always use two, but this is because it's the way I was taught and is standard in business. (At least it has been in the places I've worked.) It also just looks better to me. However, if I knew that a particular agent or publisher preferred one space I would send anything to them with one space, and use the double spaces for everyone else.

TheIT · Nov 9, 2005

I believe there's a discussion about 1 space vs. 2 in the Uncle Jim thread. I think the consensus was that 2 spaces just indicates you learned to type before computers were widely available, and that either choice is acceptable as long as you're consistent. The thread also discusses submission formats, and I believe the consensus there was compose using whatever font/size you like, but submit using Courier 12 since that's the standard used to determine word count. Check the guidelines of the publisher to be sure you're matching the format they want.

PeeDee · Nov 9, 2005

Am v. happy. Will now use only one period and spend the extra time gained doing something useful, such as eating, writing, or aging.

Shwebb · Nov 9, 2005

When I (briefly) worked for a printing company, I was informed that it's one space after periods. This info does go against what I learned in typing class, but I'm sure that there's a difference now between using a typewriter and a word processor.

I now routinely use one space after periods.

Gabriele · Nov 9, 2005

Two spaces seems to be an US thing. I've learned it's one, but then, I've learned British spelling as well.

Lady of Prose · Nov 9, 2005

Old processing habits are hard to break. Unless specified by guidlines, I'll keep using 2.

When I worked in computer data processing during the early 80'S, 2 spaces were specified as business standard.

jst5150 · Nov 9, 2005

Two Spaces.

Courier. It's a fixed-width font and that's what's demanded by publishers.

Berry · Nov 9, 2005

I learned to type before computers were household items, and I put two spaces after a period. I don't think it's a big deal, though. It's still the same old story: If you write a terrific story, no one's going to care if there's one space or two, especially since a quick search-and-replace will fix it easily. Don't obsess about it and write the best story you can.

As for Times versus Courier, use Courier unless guidelines specifically say otherwise. It's standard.

Saanen · Nov 9, 2005

Two spaces after the period is still business standard, at least in the U.S. I've never had an editor say anything to me about my practice of putting two spaces after periods--which I absolutely cannot change after a couple of decades of typing. In grad school we had to follow APA style, which requires one space after all punctuation. I typed everything as usual, then searched and replaced two spaces with one space. It took about one second for my computer to change the spacing in my papers.

Celia Cyanide · Nov 9, 2005

TheIT said:
I think the consensus was that 2 spaces just indicates you learned to type before computers were widely available, and that either choice is acceptable as long as you're consistent.

Actually, I didn't. I learned to type on a computer, when most people had them, but I was still taught 2 spaces after a period. I'm glad to hear that it's okay, as long as you are consistent, because otherwise I've got a lot of editing to do.

Jamesaritchie · Nov 9, 2005

Spaces

It's usually one space after a period for electronic only because two spaces can cause HTML formatting problems.

Two spaces after a period with print just makes the manuscript (Or a letter) a little easier to read, and gives an editor just a bit more room to insert proofreader's marks. But no editor is going to shoot you for using only one space.

Proper font is Courier 12. Well, 10 pitch or 12 point. Some Macs have fonts that are measured in pitch. Courier10 BT is 10 pitch, but it's 12 point. Or used to. PCs have fonts measured in points.

Courier 12 is not only fixed-width, it's a specific fixed width that gives a specific number of characters and spaces per page. It's also large enough, and has enough room between letters, to make editing by hand much, much easier that it is to edit Times New Roman by hand.

PeeDee · Nov 9, 2005

I've always written in 12pt Times New Roman, mostly because I started writing with it, way back in the dawn of time, and have never thought to change it. I've poked at writing in Courior 12pt sometimes, but it tends to make my page count jump. F'r example, it just jumped a story from 102 pages to approx. 140 pages.

Soemhow, this always seems like cheating and I wind up switching it back.

if Courior is indeed the standard, though (am I looking for assurance? probably) then maybe I will switch over and write in that. Certainly, it's cleaner and easier to read.

paprikapink · Nov 9, 2005

Celia Cyanide said:
Actually, I didn't. I learned to type on a computer, when most people had them, but I was still taught 2 spaces after a period. I'm glad to hear that it's okay, as long as you are consistent, because otherwise I've got a lot of editing to do.

That's probably because your typing teacher learned to type before a computer. Most people who've never had anything to do with printing or publishing have no need for the little tidbit of knowledge about proportional spacing in word processing software accommodating the punctuation for you. Although spacing two times after a period is no longer necessary to provide the benefit that the practice was intended to provide, I don't think the custom will ever go away.

aka eraser · Nov 9, 2005

I've been using one space since the mid-70s and never had an editor complain.

Aconite · Nov 9, 2005

PeeDee said:
I've poked at writing in Courior 12pt sometimes, but it tends to make my page count jump. F'r example, it just jumped a story from 102 pages to approx. 140 pages.

Yes, it will do that, because it's monospaced (each letter and each character takes up the same amount of space on a line). That's why editors care about word count, not page count: the font you use will greatly affect page count. (And remember: Word count is not the actual number of words in your story. It's the amount of space that your story will take up, which is why you use a monospaced font.) In the US, Courier is still the standard for fiction submissions.

Jamesaritchie · Nov 9, 2005

spaces

aka eraser said:
I've been using one space since the mid-70s and never had an editor complain.

Some things are worth complaining about, and some aren't. If editors complained to writers about every little thing, there wouldn't be any to to edit. Or read. Or do anything.

Two spaces is the traditional standard, and does make things just a bit easier on the eye, but no editor is going to waste time and energy complaining about one.
Complaining to writers about much of anything, even serious things, just brings on headaches.

PeeDee · Nov 9, 2005

Aconite said:
Yes, it will do that, because it's monospaced (each letter and each character takes up the same amount of space on a line). That's why editors care about word count, not page count: the font you use will greatly affect page count. (And remember: Word count is not the actual number of words in your story. It's the amount of space that your story will take up, which is why you use a monospaced font.) In the US, Courier is still the standard for fiction submissions.

Huh. Very interesting. well, what the hey, I'll go plop my manuscript over into Courier and let the page number jump.

(I did know how irrelevant page number was, and likewise how the word count was only vaguely useful, but they both serve as units of measurement when writing, even if only abritrary ones)

Jamesaritchie · Nov 9, 2005

PeeDee said:
I've always written in 12pt Times New Roman, mostly because I started writing with it, way back in the dawn of time, and have never thought to change it. I've poked at writing in Courior 12pt sometimes, but it tends to make my page count jump. F'r example, it just jumped a story from 102 pages to approx. 140 pages.

Soemhow, this always seems like cheating and I wind up switching it back.

if Courior is indeed the standard, though (am I looking for assurance? probably) then maybe I will switch over and write in that. Certainly, it's cleaner and easier to read.

The more pages, the fewer words on each page, and the easier it is to read and edit. Your manuscript isn't one word longer if you use Courier, it just uses more paper, and makes life easier for whoever has to read and edit it.

Do a printout and try editing Times New Roman 12 by hand. Try to find space to insert proofreaders' marks between all those crammed together, tiny letters. Or even between words. Now try doing this all day long, five days per week.

If a writer insists on using Times New Roman, the least he could do is use Times 14, rather than 12. It still doesn't have the advantages of Courier 12, I still hate it, but at least it can be edited with some ease.

From an editor's standpoint, more pages with the same word count is a very good thing.

Aconite · Nov 9, 2005

PeeDee said:
Huh. Very interesting. well, what the hey, I'll go plop my manuscript over into Courier and let the page number jump.

Compose and self-edit in whatever's comfortable for you. Just switch it over before you print out your submission to send off, and don't worry about it.

For a fairly accurate word count--word counts are handy, definitely--estimate 250 words per page of Courier 12-point text.

PeeDee · Nov 9, 2005

No, I really do get that it doesn't actually add ro subtract a single thing, it just spreads it out more or less. Honest. It was just one of those set-in qualms I never thought about seriously, up 'till about fifteen minutes ago. I went through and redid my manuscript in Courier, and it really is much more comfortable to look at. I give, I give.

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